LearnGospelMusic.com Community

Please login or register.
Pages: 1 ... 4 5 [6]   Go Down

Author Topic: Should churches.......  (Read 9932 times)

Offline chevonee

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13133
  • Gender: Female
  • Back and better than ever!
    • God's Glory

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #100 on: August 13, 2010, 05:45:15 AM »
Greed knows no denomination.
Amen to that!!
Strike while the iron is hot!

Offline phbrown

  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12070
  • Google Fiber

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #101 on: August 13, 2010, 10:08:44 AM »
invest in the stock market? BTW, I hope this question hasn't been asked b4 if so just point me to the link please. I have just been very curious about how churches can do something to help itself without having to have church services and sell fish plates to raise money.  ;D


Hey Chevonee,

I just read an article about earning a great return.

http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/03/looking-at-debt-repayment-as-an-investment/

Basically it says if you want to earn a great return with very low risk. You should pay off your debt.

Offline chevonee

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13133
  • Gender: Female
  • Back and better than ever!
    • God's Glory

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #102 on: August 13, 2010, 07:22:33 PM »
Hey Chevonee,

I just read an article about earning a great return.

http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/03/looking-at-debt-repayment-as-an-investment/

Basically it says if you want to earn a great return with very low risk. You should pay off your debt.

Gee thanks friend!!
Strike while the iron is hot!

Offline phbrown

  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12070
  • Google Fiber

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #103 on: August 13, 2010, 10:06:07 PM »
Gee thanks friend!!

sorry, my bad I'll be quiet

Offline nessalynn77

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24503
  • Gender: Female
    • Inspirational Contemplation

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #104 on: August 14, 2010, 02:43:22 PM »
sorry, my bad I'll be quiet
Why are you apologizing?  I think she was genuinely thanking you, lol. 

Offline chevonee

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13133
  • Gender: Female
  • Back and better than ever!
    • God's Glory

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #105 on: August 15, 2010, 06:59:12 PM »
Why are you apologizing?  I think she was genuinely thanking you, lol. 
Yes indeed I was!
Strike while the iron is hot!

Offline phbrown

  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12070
  • Google Fiber

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #106 on: August 16, 2010, 08:16:46 AM »

Offline LaylaMonroe

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36422
  • Gender: Female
  • POW!
    • Order in the Church!

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #107 on: August 16, 2010, 08:32:50 AM »
So just so I understand correctly,

We, the people here, have no problem with the church earning a return on their investment.

Meaning it is okay that the church makes money from a savings account because the savings account is much more stable and has a very low risk to it

But some of us here do not like stock markets and what not because It has more risk than a savings account?





In other words this thread is not that the church is making money off of the tithes it is because members are afraid of losing the money from the tithes.

I know I'm late. And I didn't want to re-raise the issue... but since the thread is already at the top... I thought I'd reply.  ;D

The above sentiment does not represent MY PERSONAL stance at all. I'm not afraid of the church losing money from tithes. I will be blessed regardless because of my obedience and my sacrifice as a tither. They can take my tithe and buy $xxx worth of lottery tickets for all I care.  For me, it has nothing to do with the risk; it has all to do with the management of the money. All throughout the Bible, from OT to NT, there are examples of people bringing money (and building supplies and animals) to the temple for the sake of ministry. What was brought in was used to build... to do ministry. Period. I will admit, I have been thinking a lot lately about how far today's church has strayed from the Acts church, which I believe is part of God's original blueprint for the body of Christ. I'm not even sure God would recognize us anymore. I'm not sure He really sanctions a lot of what we do today, calling it "church" or "ministry". I'm concerned about that. So that's the perspective from which I'm coming.

My issue is that if we are doing church the way the Bible prescribed in the book of Acts, we won't have have money left over to invest. I believe (key word: I) that if churches have money left over, they should be doing ministry with it, not refraining from doing ministry today so that they can possibly do more ministry later. These are souls at stake, not research rabbits.
When you're in love you don't want to fall asleep bc reality is finally better than your dreams.

Offline Arkhams Finest

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5785
  • Gender: Male
  • Me and my baby

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #108 on: August 17, 2010, 08:03:58 AM »
All throughout the Bible, from OT to NT, there are examples of people bringing money (and building supplies and animals) to the temple for the sake of ministry. What was brought in was used to build... to do ministry. Period.

Yea, I wonder why they didn't invest in the stock market.   ?/?


Oh, wait...
Now Reading:
Visioneering
Creating Community
(Both by Andy Stanley)

Offline LaylaMonroe

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36422
  • Gender: Female
  • POW!
    • Order in the Church!

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #109 on: August 17, 2010, 08:20:20 AM »
Yea, I wonder why they didn't invest in the stock market.   ?/?


Oh, wait...

Smartie Pants! ::)

Do you also wonder why there's no mention of them investing in any business ventures at all?  Regardless of what opportunities were available 2000 years ago, there is one thing that is clear: The Book of Acts and several of Paul's epistles tell us exactly how the gifts and offerings were used in the NT church.
When you're in love you don't want to fall asleep bc reality is finally better than your dreams.

Offline Arkhams Finest

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5785
  • Gender: Male
  • Me and my baby

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #110 on: August 17, 2010, 08:32:15 AM »
Smartie Pants! ::)

Do you also wonder why there's no mention of them investing in any business ventures at all?  Regardless of what opportunities were available 2000 years ago, there is one thing that is clear: The Book of Acts and several of Paul's epistles tell us exactly how the gifts and offerings were used in the NT church.

A business venture 2,000 years ago was selling fish or fruits.   :D

Times change.

The bible doesn't specifically speak for or against the church investing, so all I have is an opinion anyway.

My issue is that if we are doing church the way the Bible prescribed in the book of Acts, we won't have have money left over to invest.  I believe that if churches have money left over, they should be doing ministry with it, not refraining from doing ministry today so that they can possibly do more ministry later. These are souls at stake, not research rabbits.

So do you think a church shouldn't have a savings account, as they should use all "left over" funds to do ministry?   ?/?
Now Reading:
Visioneering
Creating Community
(Both by Andy Stanley)

Offline LaylaMonroe

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36422
  • Gender: Female
  • POW!
    • Order in the Church!

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #111 on: August 17, 2010, 08:43:43 AM »
A business venture 2,000 years ago was selling fish or fruits.   :D

Times change.

The bible doesn't specifically speak for or against the church investing, so all I have is an opinion anyway.

So do you think a church shouldn't have a savings account, as they should use all "left over" funds to do ministry?   ?/?

My stance throughout this thread has been made abundantly clear. I never said that a church shouldn't have a savings account. Cash reserves is an essential part of any church budget and anyone who serves in Administration, Operations, or Finance ministries knows that. Cash reserves are usually liquid (or mostly liquid/liquid enough) and readily accessible when a need presents itself.

I can't make it any more simple than this: churches' income, in my opinion, should be used to do ministry as ministry needs arise... just like it was in the NT.  I am especially passionate about the finances of the church because it is alarming and a bit disheartening for me to realize that the majority of our church budgets is spent on... stuff... and not soul ministry.

I'm kinda done with this... lest we cross over into the bickering stages...  ;) ;D :)
When you're in love you don't want to fall asleep bc reality is finally better than your dreams.

Offline Arkhams Finest

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5785
  • Gender: Male
  • Me and my baby

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #112 on: August 17, 2010, 09:01:28 AM »
I can't make it any more simple than this: churches' income, in my opinion, should be used to do ministry as ministry needs arise... just like it was in the NT


There was nothing in that day even remotely close to the Stock Market for the church to invest in.

The church in Acts is NOT a point of reference.
Now Reading:
Visioneering
Creating Community
(Both by Andy Stanley)

Offline funkStrat_97

  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5431
  • Gender: Male
  • Da' House Rocka' is in Da' House!
    • Facebook

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #113 on: August 17, 2010, 09:03:50 AM »
I believe (key word: I) that if churches have money left over, they should be doing ministry with it, not refraining from doing ministry today so that they can possibly do more ministry later.

So do you think a church shouldn't have a savings account, as they should use all "left over" funds to do ministry?   ?/?

Well here's my view.  I'm not advocating that a church should just take every last tithe, offering, etc., and throw it in the market.  By all means, a church should be involved in an active ongoing ministry that meats immediate needs.  At the same time, I also feel that it would be a wise option to grow some of that money for future use as well.  So you have to look at both short-term as well as long term ministry goals/needs.
“Don't bother to give God instructions, just report for duty”
- Corrie Ten Boom

Offline LaylaMonroe

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36422
  • Gender: Female
  • POW!
    • Order in the Church!

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #114 on: August 17, 2010, 09:10:45 AM »

There was nothing in that day even remotely close to the Stock Market for the church to invest in.

The church in Acts is NOT a point of reference.
I'm kinda done with this... lest we cross over into the bickering stages...  ;) ;D :)

 :)


----------------------------------------------------
On another note, for the life of me, I simply cannot understand why it is so impossible to just agree to have two different opinions. That is a rhetorical statement.

This entire thread comes down to one issue, from what I can tell. There are some who believe it is acceptable/good to invest excess money in the stock market in the hopes that it will produce a return for future ministry.  There are some who believe it is NOT acceptable/good to invest excess money in the stock market because that excess money should be used to do present ministry.

Neither side has expressed any movement toward a change of mind.

So...

Why....
When you're in love you don't want to fall asleep bc reality is finally better than your dreams.

Offline Arkhams Finest

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5785
  • Gender: Male
  • Me and my baby

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #115 on: August 17, 2010, 09:25:45 AM »
Well here's my view.  I'm not advocating that a church should just take every last tithe, offering, etc., and throw it in the market.  By all means, a church should be involved in an active ongoing ministry that meats immediate needs.  At the same time, I also feel that it would be a wise option to grow some of that money for future use as well.  So you have to look at both short-term as well as long term ministry goals/needs.





Kanye West approves of this LGM Post.
Now Reading:
Visioneering
Creating Community
(Both by Andy Stanley)

Offline phbrown

  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12070
  • Google Fiber

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #116 on: August 17, 2010, 10:51:47 AM »
Yea, I wonder why they didn't invest in the stock market.   ?/?


Oh, wait...

If a church starts investing in the market and corporations invest in the market

Then what is the difference between the two.

Are some churches today merely corporations?

Offline T-Block

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17289
  • Gender: Male
  • I got my MBA!!!

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #117 on: August 17, 2010, 12:46:56 PM »
Hey Chevonee,

I just read an article about earning a great return.

http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2008/08/03/looking-at-debt-repayment-as-an-investment/

Basically it says if you want to earn a great return with very low risk. You should pay off your debt.


This kind of made me chuckle a bit.


If a church starts investing in the market and corporations invest in the market

Then what is the difference between the two.

Are some churches today merely corporations?


Mainly the main goal of the organization. Most organizations' main goal is to make money. The church's main goal should be to save souls.
Real musicians play in every key!!!
Music Theory, da numbers work!

Offline funkStrat_97

  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5431
  • Gender: Male
  • Da' House Rocka' is in Da' House!
    • Facebook

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #118 on: August 17, 2010, 01:55:59 PM »
Are some churches today merely corporations?


Well basically yes.  Churches are more or less considered "non-profit corporations" and are governed by the same laws as are other non-profits.  Of course some churches have become tremendous sources of incomes for their executive boards pastors and in some cases what they teach is only Biblical on a surface level.  But alas, boys and girls, that's a whole 'nother kettle-o-fish.
“Don't bother to give God instructions, just report for duty”
- Corrie Ten Boom

Offline LaylaMonroe

  • LGM Royalty
  • LGM Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 36422
  • Gender: Female
  • POW!
    • Order in the Church!

Re: Should churches.......
« Reply #119 on: August 17, 2010, 02:14:06 PM »
Well basically yes.  Churches are more or less considered "non-profit corporations" and are governed by the same laws as are other non-profits.  Of course some churches have become tremendous sources of incomes for their executive boards pastors and in some cases what they teach is only Biblical on a surface level.  But alas, boys and girls, that's a whole 'nother kettle-o-fish.


Yep, that's why I avoided that particular post. LOL.

But yes, I agree with you. Churches ARE corporations.

Mainly the main goal of the organization. Most organizations' main goal is to make money. The church's main goal should be to save souls.


Yeah.  :-\
When you're in love you don't want to fall asleep bc reality is finally better than your dreams.
Pages: 1 ... 4 5 [6]   Go Up