Different Sigs... Everybody Plz Read and feedback

[stiksnmypocket]

?, are we to a point now where jus because you can't count or understand what the drummer is doing, that we say he/she is off... for instance I have a piece where it's in 4/4 but I play a 3/4 groove over it, so will you consider me to have bad timing, because you don't know where I'm at musically, my point is that alot of the drummers we hear think outside the box... so thats what sets them apart, you don't hear Teddy trying to play like Gerald or Chris Dave trying to play like Chris, they all have there own rights in the drumming community so how can someone say Calvin or anybody else got off on a certain track while soloing/tricking could it be that you jus can't count or maybe even he lost you, I read something similar in another post and was kind of bothered to read statements of that nature, if everybody went to there resources and learned stuff like this they would probably have a better understanding of what was going on... so I would like to see you alls feedback on this subject and not for it to turn into a Bloodbath...   

So next time you're practicing practice something crazy, off the wall and you'll see, if you need some ideas here goes... 6-6-5-5, or 7/5 and the most common 7/8, everbody's doing 6/8 now also it's the time sig. to Tye's song Alright for those who don't know

[WithLuvKay]

7/5 ???? 6/8 has been done since forever its a common Gospelmusic feel or time signature.

[rjthakid]

?, are we to a point now where jus because you can't count or understand what the drummer is doing, that we say he/she is off... for instance I have a piece where it's in 4/4 but I play a 3/4 groove over it, so will you consider me to have bad timing, because you don't know where I'm at musically, my point is that alot of the drummers we hear think outside the box... so thats what sets them apart, you don't hear Teddy trying to play like Gerald or Chris Dave trying to play like Chris, they all have there own rights in the drumming community so how can someone say Calvin or anybody else got off on a certain track while soloing/tricking could it be that you jus can't count or maybe even he lost you, I read something similar in another post and was kind of bothered to read statements of that nature, if everybody went to there resources and learned stuff like this they would probably have a better understanding of what was going on... so I would like to see you alls feedback on this subject and not for it to turn into a Bloodbath...   

So next time you're practicing practice something crazy, off the wall and you'll see, if you need some ideas here goes... 6-6-5-5, or 7/5 and the most common 7/8, everbody's doing 6/8 now also it's the time sig. to Tye's song Alright for those who don't know

Hmmmmm.  Interesting.

Well, if someone is playing in a time signature and it's not coinciding with the music, that's why someone might say they're off.  Even if you DO understand time signatures, if they drummers timing isn't flowing with the music, then you could say it's off.  Yea, everybody's using the 6/8.  It has a nice Tripletty kinda feel (if that's a word).

[bigblackdrummer]

Hmmmmm.  Interesting.

Well, if someone is playing in a time signature and it's not coinciding with the music, that's why someone might say they're off.  Even if you DO understand time signatures, if they drummers timing isn't flowing with the music, then you could say it's off.  Yea, everybody's using the 6/8.  It has a nice Tripletty kinda feel (if that's a word).

Ah yes you can its, called ; super imposed metric modulation! Vinny C. is King at it also listen to Tony Williams he was a monster of it too.

[bigblackdrummer]

Whats up my man, Im still waiting for you too call me back  Yo you got my DDRUM snare there!?

[SabianKnight]

Hmmmmm.  Interesting.

Well, if someone is playing in a time signature and it's not coinciding with the music, that's why someone might say they're off.  Even if you DO understand time signatures, if they drummers timing isn't flowing with the music, then you could say it's off.  Yea, everybody's using the 6/8.  It has a nice Tripletty kinda feel (if that's a word).

6/8 doesnot always have to have a triplet feel. A lot of Latin and Brazilian music is in 6/8 and you feel the triplet.

Get Pete Magadini's book called Polyrhythms. It will open up a whole new world. 

[j_kay]

7/5?!?  There's no such thing.  Remember the denominator and what it represents... 

[stiksnmypocket]

JKay there's always such a thing, think about it, thats my whole point think outside the box, it doesn't always have to be formal and you definitely won't use the crazy timings in a song your whole life but it will definitely open you up for other stuff, just count it and groove to it, peace


BBD I got you dog, and I did hit u bak...no answer

[j_kay]

Really, now?!?  The denominator always represents the note value, hence the 4, which represents a quarter note, 8, which represents an eighth note, 16, which represents sixteenth notes, 32, which represents thirty-second notes, and 64, which represents sixty fourth notes.  With that being said, there is no such thing as 7/5, no matter how you type or write it.  If it is ('such a thing'), explan what notational value corresponds with the denominator, since this value always represents the notes that were mentioned earlier. 

I know that you're astute in this thang right here, and so am I.  I would like you to show me an example of a 7/5 piece of music, with the explanation and all.  Truss, there isn't any formality to music theory; it's the backbone of what we as musicians do.  I've heard of 15/8, 17/16, 25/16, 13/4, etc, but there isn't a 7/5.  Notice the pattern of the denominator. 

The numerator, you could always play with, however, the notational value is always 'textbook' (again, see the explanation above).

I'll wait for you to post those examples, along with the explanation.      

[stiksnmypocket]

i guess i wasn't clear I do know that 7/5 is informal(very) it's not in anybody's book, just count 7 over 5, it's pretty much made up but it works so next time you practice do it... simple as that count 7 then 5 7 then 5 eazy does it, its actually fun if you can do it, so excuse me for not making myself clear...lol

[SabianKnight]

i guess i wasn't clear I do know that 7/5 is informal(very) it's not in anybody's book, just count 7 over 5, it's pretty much made up but it works so next time you practice do it... simple as that count 7 then 5 7 then 5 eazy does it, its actually fun if you can do it, so excuse me for not making myself clear...lol

What you are saying is a polyrhythm 7 over 5/4 or  7/4 over 4.

we just have clear and specific.


GREAT THREAD Sticksnmypocket... Let's keep the knowledge flowing.

[stiksnmypocket]

Thank God somebody gets it, I was waiting on at least you to come in...by the way did you judge tonite... I hosted the drumoff at my store tonite and the lack of talent was awful.....

[j_kay]

Okay...  After my post, now you want to go into more detail as to what you were referring to.   

You have to be able to fully articulate what you are attempting to convey to the audience on this forum.  You have to keep in mind that everyone does not know about time signatures and how they work (in terms of the numerator and denominator, and what they represent).  If I didn't know how time signatures work (in terms of theory), I would have thought that "7/5"  (not 7/4 over 5/4 or 7/8 over 5/8) would be a valid time signature (if I were just to take this as face value, and not research the validity myself).

Now, had you expressed that you are playing "7/4 (which is a valid time signature because of the denominator) over 4", then I would not have had to type the theory behind my understanding of time signatures. 

Instead, you typed that "7/5" is a time signature.  Maybe in transation (to you), the "/" indicates the word "over", but in the application of this figure on music appears as playing in 6/8, or playing in 4/4. 

As Sabianknight stated, "we just have to be clear and specific".  It's all good. 

~Done~

[rjthakid]

Ah yes you can its, called ; super imposed metric modulation! Vinny C. is King at it also listen to Tony Williams he was a monster of it too.

???

I never said that you can't.  lol.  I just said that that's the reason why you would say it's off.  ESPECIALLY in a church setting.  In many situations, if your MD doesn't hear that Base Drum or Snare where he thinks he should, you're gonna get one of these: 

lol.

[SabianKnight]

Thank God somebody gets it, I was waiting on at least you to come in...by the way did you judge tonite... I hosted the drumoff at my store tonite and the lack of talent was awful.....

Yes I judged last night (Tues) and the lack of talent was thick , lol. Two vets were there and it was obvious they had the top two spots. One of the guys had gone to the District Finals the past two years.

I cannot stand the kit though. Tama dropped the ball. Even though they change the mount on th bass drum they DID NOT extend the post which caused taller players (6 ft tall and over) were at a disadvantage. They were handicapped. NOT COOL.
I am still undecided on the EC2 coated heads.... I know they would work better with a brighter resonant such at the Genera Resonant or Glass. They store tuning was not up to par.
Ghost Notes on the snare (EC2 Reverse Dot) seemed to lack sensitivity. THis may have been due to the poor tuning.

[rjthakid]

6/8 doesnot always have to have a triplet feel. A lot of Latin and Brazilian music is in 6/8 and you feel the triplet.

Get Pete Magadini's book called Polyrhythms. It will open up a whole new world. 

Gotta disagree on this one.

a 6/8 would be counted: ONE Two Three FOUR Five Six, with the note value being that of an eigth note......By nature a 6/8, 9/8, and 12/8 are triplet type Time Signatures.  That doesn't mean you have to PLAY triplets, lol, but their feel, their PULSE is that of a triplet.

Bossanova, Mambo and Samba are typically 4/4.

I have a solid understanding of time signatures, but knowing more can only help.  Where can I get that book?

Okay...  After my post, now you want to go into more detail as to what you were referring to.  

You have to be able to fully articulate what you are attempting to convey to the audience on this forum.  You have to keep in mind that everyone does not know about time signatures and how they work (in terms of the numerator and denominator, and what they represent).  If I didn't know how time signatures work (in terms of theory), I would have thought that "7/5"  (not 7/4 over 5/4 or 7/8 over 5/8) would be a valid time signature (if I were just to take this as face value, and not research the validity myself).

Now, had you expressed that you are playing "7/4 (which is a valid time signature because of the denominator) over 4", then I would not have had to type the theory behind my understanding of time signatures. 

Instead, you typed that "7/5" is a time signature.  Maybe in transation (to you), the "/" indicates the word "over", but in the application of this figure on music appears as playing in 6/8, or playing in 4/4. 

As Sabianknight stated, "we just have to be clear and specific".  It's all good. 

~Done~

Yep.  Technically speaking, the denominator is generally 1 or a number divisble by 2 (4,6,8,10,12, etc.)  Though usually after 2 they're a number divisible by 4 (4, 8, 12, 16)

It is possible to have a denominator like 3 or 5.  They're called "Irrational" time signatures.  But they're rare and aren't used too music.  Even Odd Time Signatures don't use them.

[rjthakid]

But they're rare and aren't used too *MUCH

[SabianKnight]

???

I never said that you can't.  lol.  I just said that that's the reason why you would say it's off.  ESPECIALLY in a church setting.  In many situations, if your MD doesn't hear that Base Drum or Snare where he thinks he should, you're gonna get one of these: 

lol.

Bass Drum not Base Drum 

[rjthakid]

Bass Drum not Base Drum 

Oops.     Thanks.

[j_kay]

Interesting.  I looked it up to gain more insight on this.  That's what I'm talking about.