Topic: You say the Bible is the Word of God, so... (Read 25170 times)

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #20 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:36:21 PM »

Quote from: Rjthakid on March 08, 2007, 01:32:01 PM

Truth. God changed his mind. It's scriptural.

....so, we can't use it, right?

nessalynn77 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:38:05 PM »

Quote from: bassthumpa on March 08, 2007, 01:34:42 PM

Hammer... how in the world can you believe that the "Word of God", God Himself, can wrap himself in flesh and walk this earth, but can't manifest himself in written text?

Often what happens is that, for example we get out of the way of God's wrath when we get right and humble ourselves before him. God didn't change his mind in those cases, but WE are the ones that changed. How many stories are there where destruction was headed toward a person or people, and they get themselves in order... fasting, praying, seeking Him... and in doing that, avoided destruction?

What about the scripture, help me find it y'all, where it says God repented that he even made man. I'm asking the question because I haven't really searched out the use of the word "repented" in that text, but it would seem that God, who knows the end from the very beginning, for a moment "regretted". Is that possible?

bassthumpa · « **Reply #22 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:40:12 PM »

Hammer, here's a question for you: If you honestly believe that the Bible is NOT the Word of God, how did you come to believe in God? From where does your teaching come? How do you know how to BECOME saved, and then STAY saved?

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #23 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:41:59 PM »

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:38:05 PM

What about the scripture, help me find it y'all, where it says God repented that he even made man. I'm asking the question because I haven't really searched out the use of the word "repented" in that text, but it would seem that God, who knows the end from the very beginning, for a moment "regretted". Is that possible?

Not in the form of the word as we're used to using it. The problem, for most of us, is that our English language has many uses for a particular word, but we'll only use it in one form (or definition) (i.e. the word 'concert').

bassthumpa · « **Reply #24 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:42:41 PM »

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:38:05 PM

What about the scripture, help me find it y'all, where it says God repented that he even made man. I'm asking the question because I haven't really searched out the use of the word "repented" in that text, but it would seem that God, who knows the end from the very beginning, for a moment "regretted". Is that possible?

Jonah 3:10 - And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

(Edit: I know that's not the one you asked for, but it came to mind)

I honestly don't believe that God can repent as man does. That would indicate that God was wrong in the first place. We'd have to dig into the meaning of repent in that context and translation.

iamworship2006 · « **Reply #25 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:43:00 PM »

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:38:05 PM

What about the scripture, help me find it y'all, where it says God repented that he even made man. I'm asking the question because I haven't really searched out the use of the word "repented" in that text, but it would seem that God, who knows the end from the very beginning, for a moment "regretted". Is that possible?

Sometimes you can know too much and get it wrong. In this case Ness, what little you know is just enough.

Hezekiah's worship cause God to change his mind about his death sentence. I could go on but God can and does change his mind about things all the time.

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #26 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:44:05 PM »

Quote from: bassthumpa on March 08, 2007, 01:40:12 PM

Hammer, here's a question for you: If you honestly believe that the Bible is NOT the Word of God, how did you come to believe in God? From where does your teaching come? How do you know how to BECOME saved, and then STAY saved?

What if I suggested that Hammer may be someone who's at a crossroads in their faith. He's been burned by churches (that's been discerned and he's said as much). I think Hammer may do what he does because he's trying to find answers. $:-\$

Just putting a thought out there $:-\$

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:45:36 PM »

Quote from: bassthumpa on March 08, 2007, 01:42:41 PM

Jonah 3:10 - And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

(Edit: I know that's not the one you asked for, but it came to mind)

I honestly don't believe that God can repent as man does. That would indicate that God was wrong in the first place. We'd have to dig into the meaning of repent in that context and translation.

Quote from: sjonathan02 on March 08, 2007, 01:41:59 PM

Not in the form of the word as we're used to using it. The problem, for most of us, is that our English language has many uses for a particular word, but we'll only use it in one form (or definition) (i.e. the word 'concert').

SCARY!!!

bassthumpa · « **Reply #28 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:46:01 PM »

Got it:

Genesis 6:6 - And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

Again, translation and context most likely.

NJTheBishopAnderson · « **Reply #29 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:48:46 PM »

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:21:42 PM

2Ti 3:16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

..and to build upon that..

2 Peter 1:20-21
"Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."

Yeah, I hear ya.. "That has to do with prophecy." Yet, our the foundation of our faith is BUILT upon prophetic and doctrinal scripture.

Ephesians 2:19-21
"Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;..."

So I guess Jesus (the one you say is your saviour), was wrong for reading the self-prophetic scripture in Isaiah 58:6, right?

Luke 4:16-20
"And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read. And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written, The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him."

NO JESUS DON'T READ THAT... ITS NOT THE INSPIRED WORD OF GOD!!!

Man, give me a break...

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #30 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:51:39 PM »

Quote from: NJTheBishopAnderson on March 08, 2007, 01:48:46 PM

..and to build upon that..

2 Peter 1:20-21
"Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."

Yeah, I hear ya.. "That has to do with prophecy." Yet, our the foundation of our faith is BUILT upon prophetic and doctrinal scripture.

Ephesians 2:19-21
"Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;..."

So I guess Jesus (the one you say is your saviour), was wrong for reading the self-prophetic scripture in Isaiah 58:6, right?

Luke 4:16-20
"And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read. And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written, The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him."

NO JESUS DON'T READ THAT... ITS NOT THE INPIRED WORD OF GOD!!!

Man, give me a break...

*poof, The Grammar Wizard enters*

I know, I know you were typing fast, right. Happens to the best of us and by best, I do mean ME.

*poof, The Grammar Wizard exits*

NJTheBishopAnderson · « **Reply #31 on:** March 08, 2007, 01:55:17 PM »

Quote from: sjonathan02 on March 08, 2007, 01:51:39 PM

*poof, The Grammar Wizard enters*

I know, I know you were typing fast, right. Happens to the best of us and by best, I do mean ME.

*poof, The Grammar Wizard exits*

Lawd, TODAY!!!

HammerRock · « **Reply #32 on:** March 08, 2007, 02:10:49 PM »

nessalynn77, So far you are the only one making good points here.

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:21:42 PM

2Ti 3:16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

The scriptures that Paul is talking about here is much of the OT that we know and some of it that's not canonized. It's funny, but the parts of the NT that I would consider scripture, like the Gospels and the book of Revelation, by this definition, weren't even being referred to here.

What is meant by instruction for righteousness when we recieve a righteousness through faith?

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:21:42 PM

You make a circular argument. Even if the above scripture only references the OT as you have stated many times before, this very post would indicate that you don't even believe that. No one is arguing Jn 1:1, I believe it whole-heartedly, and I also believe II Timothy 3:16.

I do beleive the OT is scripture. I was saying that the term "Word of God" is being misused.

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:21:42 PM

You make your point using Jn 1:1, but all of your arguments state that you question the validity of that scripture and all scripture.

I don't question the validity of it, but many will live as if they are still subject to the keeping of these requirements of the law. I consider the OT scripture fulfilled scripture when it comes to the keeping of it. I am no longer bound with living out of the requirements of the law. It's fulfilled scripture.

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:21:42 PM

How do you even know that God is writing anything on your heart if you don't start with his written Word? Without it you have no basis or foundation for any of your arguments, as all of our knowledge of God and who Jesus is gets it's foundation in the Bible. The Holy Spirit didn't come and tell you that Jesus was the son of God, born of a virgin, crucified, risen and our only hope for salvation. THE BIBLE TOLD YOU THAT.

Like I said, there's a whole lot of knowledge and wisdom in the bible. The Word of God, Jesus, makes it Truth to me. I appreciate the bible.

Many will tell you that it's a blue print for how to live your life. I don't agree with that. That's the Living Word, Jesus, The Word of God's job through the Holy Spirit.

Wayne Webb · « **Reply #33 on:** March 08, 2007, 02:17:27 PM »

Quote from: nessalynn77 on March 08, 2007, 01:21:42 PM

2Ti 3:16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

You make a circular argument. Even if the above scripture only references the OT as you have stated many times before, this very post would indicate that you don't even believe that. No one is arguing Jn 1:1, I believe it whole-heartedly, and I also believe II Timothy 3:16.

You make your point using Jn 1:1, but all of your arguments state that you question the validity of that scripture and all scripture. How do you even know that God is writing anything on your heart if you don't start with his written Word? Without it you have no basis or foundation for any of your arguments, as all of our knowledge of God and who Jesus is gets it's foundation in the Bible. The Holy Spirit didn't come and tell you that Jesus was the son of God, born of a virgin, crucified, risen and our only hope for salvation. THE BIBLE TOLD YOU THAT.

You are right SJon....

I've been trying to tell him this Nessa.
But I could not have said it plainer than you just did.

Rjthakid · « **Reply #34 on:** March 08, 2007, 02:17:44 PM »

The Stance....

"You see, there are things that I really don't agree with or want to comply with in the Bible.

Example:

Hebrews 13:17
Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

Ugh. I HATE those words!!!

What to do?

The bible CLEARLY states that we must SUBMIT to our Pastors (It's obviously speaking of Pastors, because Pastors "watch for our souls" and must give an accout).

How can I get around it?

AH!!! I KNOW! I state that the Bible is not the Word of God! I say that JESUS is the Word! They can't argue with that because He IS!!!!

Oh, and when they say that the Bible is ALSO the Word of God, I'll put on a song and dance routine and ask bizarre questions like "Did Jesus say the New Testament is the Word of God?"

Now, seeing as the NT wasn't WRITTEN until after Jesus' death, burial and resurrection, he wouldn't say anything about a NT!!! It's an airtight...If not weird...argument!!!!!

Claiming that the Holy Ghost will tell me what's right and what's WRONG in the Bible will allow me to basically pick what I WANT to do in the Bible and leave the rest!!!!

HA!

Tithe? LATER FOR THAT!!! My BILLS come first!!!!!

Pastoral Leadership? They can't tell me anything I don't like! If they do, I'll cry "Spritual Bondage!!!! Spiritual Bondage!!!"

Aaaaaaah. Life is good."

NJTheBishopAnderson · « **Reply #35 on:** March 08, 2007, 02:25:50 PM »

Quote from: Rjthakid on March 08, 2007, 02:17:44 PM

The Stance....

"You see, there are things that I really don't agree with or want to comply with in the Bible.

Example:

Hebrews 13:17
Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

Ugh. I HATE those words!!!

What to do?

The bible CLEARLY states that we must SUBMIT to our Pastors (It's obviously speaking of Pastors, because Pastors "watch for our souls" and must give an accout).

How can I get around it?

AH!!! I KNOW! I state that the Bible is not the Word of God! I say that JESUS is the Word! They can't argue with that because He IS!!!!

Oh, and when they say that the Bible is ALSO the Word of God, I'll put on a song and dance routine and ask bizarre questions like "Did Jesus say the New Testament is the Word of God?"

Now, seeing as the NT wasn't WRITTEN until after Jesus' death, burial and resurrection, he wouldn't say anything about a NT!!! It's an airtight...If not weird...argument!!!!!

Claiming that the Holy Ghost will tell me what's right and what's WRONG in the Bible will allow me to basically pick what I WANT to do in the Bible and leave the rest!!!!

HA!

Tithe? LATER FOR THAT!!! My BILLS come first!!!!!

Pastoral Leadership? They can't tell me anything I don't like! If they do, I'll cry "Spritual Bondage!!!! Spiritual Bondage!!!"

Aaaaaaah. Life is good."

Agreed 100%... Oh, WAIT A MINUTE!!! Those folks aren't in a "church" setting, are they?!?!?! BLASPHEMOUS!!!

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #36 on:** March 08, 2007, 02:37:16 PM »

Someone help me here. If we're backing up Nessa's points, how is she the 'only' one making good points? $:-\$

And RJ, funny, as usual.

*walks away whistlin' like LT*

bassthumpa · « **Reply #37 on:** March 08, 2007, 02:57:02 PM »

Sometimes I wonder if he's trying to convince himself as much as he's trying to convince us.

Quote from: NJTheBishopAnderson on March 08, 2007, 02:25:50 PM

Agreed 100%... Oh, WAIT A MINUTE!!! Those folks aren't in a "church" setting, are they?!?!?! BLASPHEMOUS!!!

Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves toge--- oh wait, the NT isn't scripture. RIIIIIIIIIGHT. What was I thinking?

T-Block · « **Reply #38 on:** March 08, 2007, 03:53:58 PM »

HammerRock is getting exposed big time in this thread. You should have thought about this before posting HR. It's clear that you have some issues that need some quick readjusting.

sjonathan02 · « **Reply #39 on:** March 08, 2007, 03:57:19 PM »

Quote from: T-Block on March 08, 2007, 03:53:58 PM

HammerRock is getting exposed big time in this thread. You should have thought about this before posting HR. It's clear that you have some issues that need some quick readjusting.

And, that's why we keep him lifted in prayer. He's crying out. I truly believe that.

Author Topic: You say the Bible is the Word of God, so... (Read 25170 times)

iamworship2006

HammerRock

Rjthakid