Constructive Criticism vs. Judging

[JFunky]

...okay folks, when did Constructive Criticism become Judging?  Can someone explain this?  All of the sudden Church Musicians are going around thinking that their playing is great all of the time and as soon as someone tries to help them out and point out there weakness they get upset and say, "Don't judge me!  You're talking about my Praise and criticizing my Praise.  Stop Hating!"   What!?  Are you kidding me!?  This has not happened to me yet but man it's happened to other well known and respected musicians around me.  As a matter of fact, I hear this all of the time at music stores when a bunch of church musicians get together and talk.  "Oh, this guy is a hater or this guy thinks he's all that and he tried to tell me how to play."


...Your thoughts?

[Vangie D]

I see where you are coming from, judging and positive criticism are two different things, but it all depends on how things are said.
Individuals who get heated up due to positive criticism, may either have a bit too much pride or may have forgotten how to be humble.

Sometimes our attitudes by no means reflect our playing... it's better to be someone who doesn't know how good they are then to be someone who acts as if/ thinks they are better than they are, and can't musically deliver.

we should pay attention to respected musicians around us, as it is better for them to say something then for someone else that you may not know to say something.

but some people just don't like anybody commenting (encouraging, or getting them to think another way) and may feel teh individual is trying to tell them what to do, just as God gives us the gift to play, he allows us to fall upon the right people tohelp us improve and aim to perfect the gifts and ministries he has given us.

this is how i look at it, you don't know where God's going to take you with the ministry and gifts he's given you, but while going through the process of preparation (i.e. playing at church) you should listen to others, it's better than going out (various events) and some complete stranger saying to you what your local folk wanted to but you wouldn't allow them to.

[JFunky]

...check this out though....Constructive Criticism is not Positive Criticism.  Constructive Criticism points out both positive and negative.  Whether a person likes it or not there's no "Nice Way" of saying the negative no matter how lovely you word it.  If a person is really passionate or emotional about what they do, they will still be put in check by it.

[Keys410]

...check this out though....Constructive Criticism is not Positive Criticism.  Constructive Criticism points out both positive and negative.  Whether a person likes it or not there's no "Nice Way" of saying the negative no matter how lovely you word it.  If a person is really passionate or emotional about what they do, they will still be put in check by it.

Cats are soft man and emotional that's why...They know a couple of licks and think they are pro's..Here is a simple way to tell Judging from constructive Criticism...Constructive criticism is saying "Dude your wack when it comes to playing this, but if you practice this it will help you get stronger and better". Judging is "Dude your wack, your not going anywhere playing like that". The difference is one present a way to get better at what you do. I play 7 instruments so I am use to being critics either from teachers or more expierenced musicians. It honestly does hurt when you you get constructive criticism but you can either cry about it or take what they have told you and get on your grind.

[JFunky]

Cats are soft man and emotional that's why...They know a couple of licks and think they are pro's..Here is a simple way to tell Judging from constructive Criticism...Constructive criticism is saying "Dude your wack when it comes to playing this, but if you practice this it will help you get stronger and better". Judging is "Dude your wack, your not going anywhere playing like that". The difference is one present a way to get better at what you do. I play 7 instruments so I am use to being critics either from teachers or more expierenced musicians. It honestly does hurt when you you get constructive criticism but you can either cry about it or take what they have told you and get on your grind.

...yeah but cats don't want to cry about it and get on their grind.   They just want to go ahead and keep doing what they're doing cause...."they're annointed".   It's the truth.  Dude, I'm not the only one that's been faced with Constructive Criticism and have gotten my feelings hurt.  The point is that it made me realize that I still had tons of work to do.  It only get's you to be better "IF" you pay attention to what is being said "AND" correct the issues that we have.  I think that the person needs to get away from the denial stage and get away from all of the folks that are constantly saying that they're good when in actuality they're saying "you need help".  

[Keys410]

...yeah but cats don't want to cry about it and get on their grind.   They just want to go ahead and keep doing what they're doing cause...."they're annointed".   It's the truth.  Dude, I'm not the only one that's been faced with Constructive Criticism and have gotten my feelings hurt.  The point is that it made me realize that I still had tons of work to do.  It only get's you to be better "IF" you pay attention to what is being said "AND" correct the issues that we have.  I think that the person needs to get away from the denial stage and get away from all of the folks that are constantly saying that they're good when in actuality they're saying "you need help".  

I have noticed the increase in the "I'm annointed" speech. To be honest that is not the humble approach at all. If they were that annointed they would have been able to receive what is being said in the spirit.

IRT the last part....Alot of people that are telling them they are hot are usuallly not musicians. Those people just know you can keep a beat..They don't know that your timing was off or you can come in off a roll on a certain part. Thats why some cats can never get gigs cause they just don't want to listen

[T-Block]

I welcome all criticizm.  But, I have the wisdom to know what to accept and what to let brush off my shoulder.  Haters should only fuel you to keep doing what you doing.  Pros who give you tips should encourage you to keep practicing.

I too hear the "I'm annointed" speech a lot.  Being annointed is one thing, but without anything to back it up, the annointing is useless.  The annointing should enhance what you already know.  So, if you don't know anything.... well you get the idea.

We need to stop being so doggone sensitive and realize it ain't about us, it's about doing what we do to the best of our ability for God's glory.

[tko05]

Personaly I'd rather have constuctive criticism any day than be praised. You don't get better by having your ego stroked. I thank God for all the people who put me in place and told me what I needed to work on. Wether someone citicizes you to help or to hurt you doesn't matter. Take what you can learn from the person and throw the rest of it away.

We church musicians have gotten so soft. It seems that we take offence to everything thats not praise and accolades. In Matthew 16: 21-28 Jesus himself rebukes Peter when he steps out of line. When you see someone headed in the wrong direction wether in music or in life the best thing to do is to try and correct them not try to make them feel good about their situation. Contructive criticism is not hating its a blessing!

[dude-on-drums]

I dont think anyone should constructively criticise anyone voluntarily.  That could be the reason why people are taking offense.  I dont do it unless a person asks for it.  This way you can avoid the "stop hatin" remarks cause in a sense, you are hatin, if they didnt ask for your constructive criticism.  Nobody asked you.  Keep your comments to yourself.  If a person wants constructive criticism, they will seek it but you cant force it on somone.

[JFunky]

I dont think anyone should constructively criticise anyone voluntarily.  That could be the reason why people are taking offense.  I dont do it unless a person asks for it.  This way you can avoid the "stop hatin" remarks cause in a sense, you are hatin, if they didnt ask for your constructive criticism.  Nobody asked you.  Keep your comments to yourself.  If a person wants constructive criticism, they will seek it but you cant force it on somone.

...I don't do it because I'm too busy working on me but I appreciate all of the folks who have taught me and molded me by their "C.C."

...check this out though Sheen......Some cats are asking for it without sayin' a word.  Are you going to let your fellow soldier walk into that land mine when you see it or are you going to let him figure it out or wait till he steps on it to say, "hey I saw it!  I should've told ya!" 

[dude-on-drums]

...I don't do it because I'm too busy working on me but I appreciate all of the folks who have taught me and molded me by their "C.C."

...check this out though Sheen......Some cats are asking for it without sayin' a word.  Are you going to let your fellow soldier walk into that land mine when you see it or are you going to let him figure it out or wait till he steps on it to say, "hey I saw it!  I should've told ya!" 

I pretty much read them first.  If you pay attention, you can tell if someone will recieve it or not.  I agree though.  Alot of people are asking for it without saying a word.  We just gotta know which ones are and which ones arnt. 

[Keys410]

I pretty much read them first.  If you pay attention, you can tell if someone will recieve it or not.  I agree though.  Alot of people are asking for it without saying a word.  We just gotta know which ones are and which ones arnt. 

True dat!!!! No point in talking to a brick wall...

[JFunky]

...yeah but it seems like we're beginning to build the Berlin Wall because there seems to be too many walls.    

[Keys410]

...yeah but it seems like we're beginning to build the Berlin Wall because there seems to be too many walls.    

True but that is something that is happening in society...A lack of discipline...Nobody wants to take time to do things right and they don't like being corrected when they do it wrong

[dude-on-drums]

Hey J!  Speaking of land mines...did you know I was in the Marines?! 

[sjonathan02]

...check this out though....Constructive Criticism is not Positive Criticism.  Constructive Criticism points out both positive and negative.  Whether a person likes it or not there's no "Nice Way" of saying the negative no matter how lovely you word it.  If a person is really passionate or emotional about what they do, they will still be put in check by it.

Have you noticed the age range of said 'people'? For me, I've noticed it with young cats. Can't tell 'em nothin'!!

[Keys410]

Have you noticed the age range of said 'people'? For me, I've noticed it with young cats. Can't tell 'em nothin'!!

Man your a school teacher so I know you see the problem first hand..

[JFunky]

Hey J!  Speaking of land mines...did you know I was in the Marines?! 

...yes.  You told me.

...back to the thread Robin...

[JFunky]

Have you noticed the age range of said 'people'? For me, I've noticed it with young cats. Can't tell 'em nothin'!!

...that's not necessarily true.  There are many older musicians that you can't tell anything too.

[sugabear]

I welcome all criticizm.  But, I have the wisdom to know what to accept and what to let brush off my shoulder.  Haters should only fuel you to keep doing what you doing.  Pros who give you tips should encourage you to keep practicing.

I too hear the "I'm annointed" speech a lot.  Being annointed is one thing, but without anything to back it up, the annointing is useless.  The annointing should enhance what you already know.  So, if you don't know anything.... well you get the idea.

We need to stop being so doggone sensitive and realize it ain't about us, it's about doing what we do to the best of our ability for God's glory.

Personaly I'd rather have constuctive criticism any day than be praised. You don't get better by having your ego stroked. I thank God for all the people who put me in place and told me what I needed to work on. Wether someone citicizes you to help or to hurt you doesn't matter. Take what you can learn from the person and throw the rest of it away.

We church musicians have gotten so soft. It seems that we take offence to everything thats not praise and accolades. In Matthew 16: 21-28 Jesus himself rebukes Peter when he steps out of line. When you see someone headed in the wrong direction wether in music or in life the best thing to do is to try and correct them not try to make them feel good about their situation. Contructive criticism is not hating its a blessing!

As grandma use to say "eat the meat and throw away the bone".
Even when people criticize you with every intention of demeaning you and making you feel bad, you can find the necessity in the comment. If you happen to be hurt by what they said then fine, let it sting for a moment, but don't stop there. Apply what they've said or use what they've said to pinpoint what you lack in. Sulking gets you nowhere. There's going to be tons of people criticizing what you do, with good and bad intentions. How you use it determines how far you can go. IMO, offering unwelcomed criticism is no worse than ego-stroking or trying to save face by giving someone truth-manipulated advice. As Bill Cosby said putting a steak dinner on a trash can lid ruins the dinner. It's all in the presentation. The question is are you mature enough to accept unwelcomed criticism?