CAN A MUSICAN GOOD OR BAD KILL A CHURCH OR CHOIR?

[monalisa]

IF YOU ARE JUST STARTING OFF,WEITHER YOU ARE GOOD OR NOT DO YOU HONESTLY THINK,THE WAY YOU PLAY WILL KEEP PEOPLE AT THE CHURCH OR RUN THEM OFF,IS IT POSSIBLE TO KILL A CHURCH OR RUN CHOIR MEMBERS OFF?AND IF SO WHAT SHOULD YOU DO.SHOULD YOU QUIT?

[singinbro]

NO, I DON'T THINK A PERSONS STLYE OF PLAYING CAN RUN MEMBERS OFF. MOST TIMES ITS BECAUSE THEY ARE COMPARING TO THE PERSON YOU REPLACED AND ARE NOT WILLING TO CHANGE.

[TataDelite]

I feel that if you was appointed to play in that ministry you shouldn't quit or leave no matter if members run off the choir or people start leaving the church. I agree with singinbro, alot people are accustom to a particular person playing and feel that now someone else has taken his/or her place it's the end of it. Another thing is music is there to help build up the church so I think of it like this if you only go to a church because the music is always poppin' then that sounds like a personal issue. Music will always be there but you can't always rely on music to get you to Heaven. I mean music can help people get through but its the word that's going to keep you. Sometimes you have to consider this issue when it boils right down to it, who soul is at stake? Mine: Me being obedient unto God. or There's: Leaving the church or the choir because they don't like my playing because they ALWAYS want to compete being the best and because they "don't like me" they are going to walk off. I don't know but I truly feel if God has called you then this issue is going to bother you but it shouldn't effect your feelings on if you should question your judgement as to continuing to stay in the ministry.

[Brorich]

When starting at a new church I try to find out what happen to the old musician? Depending on what conditions they left on, can determine what drama you might run into! Now to answer your question, choirs always compare the old musician to the new one! It's like a relationship you learning them and them learning you! If they are willing bring new material for them, and try to pick out some songs they are familiar with. If they keep complaining and comparing and the situation is still uncomfortable do what my music teacher told me "Let um sing acapela"

[CESharp]

Ya'll I agree but.....................
the musician or anyone else for that matter, can run people out of the choir.  Running them out of the church is a personal problem with Relationship with God.

We had a musician that played any and everything they wanted to play in the church.  Yes, I even heard with my own ears "In Between The Sheets" one Sunday and I wanted to flip.  That is why we as musicians must stay humble and versatile......able to adjust to things.  Always put God in control of our thinking, etc.  This person played so many songs that they wanted to play, doing what they wanted to do, when they wanted to do it regardless of what the conductor asked.  People just couldn't deal with it...........that person should have been dismissed quick but he wasn't until later after some members got out of the choir.

[singinbro]

I believe that anyone appointed in the music ministry first and for most, must be saved and  have a relationship with God. If there is a musician at a church who is not the minister of music by calling and appointment then there should be a minister that supervises them. And we as Ministers need to be knowledgable in praise, worship, order of service and also understand that all gospel is good but not all music even gospel is appropriate for morning worship. Lastly, any music played should always be geared to the audience you're  ministering to. You can't minister if you congregation don't understand you music.

[idoobiedub]

I don't believe the musician can kill or church or a choir.  I think they can have a negative affect on the congregation or the choir.  I think the musician has more reponsibility than just playing a song.  They have to feel what the spirit is feeding and feel what the atmosphere is like throughout the service.  That's why I have a problem when the preacher gets up to preach, the musicians walk out and don't come back in until they hear the preacher about ready to wrap up.  Then they don't know what the atmosphere is like and it leads to an invitational song that is completely off the wall and has nothing to do with the message.  I think the musician has to be able to feel when to play and what to play.  For example, one Sunday the choir was singing a dynamic worship song.  I can't remember what it was, maybe "More Than Anything."  After that, the church was in fool worship mode.  Everyone was just worshipping.  I mean tears and shouting and just plain worship.  Then out the blue, the musician starts playing an upbeat praise song.  Half of the choir wasn't ready because they were still so deep in worship.  Needless to say, it made a negative effect on the rest of the service.  The pastor was a bit upset about it because of the change in atmosphere before his message.  He actually preferred the worship song before his message because it really related to it.  I don't believe that you are saved by gospel music nor do I believe it is more important than the preached word, but it sets the  atmosphere for the preached word.  I like this excerpt from an interview with Bishop Eddie Long of the Newbirth Missionary Baptist Church in Lithonia, GA.  In regards to the importance of Gospel Music in the church: Gospel music is the root and foundation of the church. It's important in today's society to be creative and have a variety of sounds to draw all different types of people and age groups. The purpose of the music is to lead people to Christ and amplify the preached word of God.

[Dooley]

I think so...Music is a big part of our church, and a big part of our culture.  Some people really look forward to hearing great music.  If the choir is slammin, but the music isnt hittin right, people may look at that funny, and it may have people lookin at the musicians funny.  If the drummer is constantly getting off beat, or whatever, thats not good.  But I dont think it can make people leave a church, but definately leave the choir...I've seen it done

[depondrums]

I feel that if you was appointed to play in that ministry you shouldn't quit or leave no matter if members run off the choir or people start leaving the church. I agree with singinbro, alot people are accustom to a particular person playing and feel that now someone else has taken his/or her place it's the end of it. Another thing is music is there to help build up the church so I think of it like this if you only go to a church because the music is always poppin' then that sounds like a personal issue. Music will always be there but you can't always rely on music to get you to Heaven. I mean music can help people get through but its the word that's going to keep you. Sometimes you have to consider this issue when it boils right down to it, who soul is at stake? Mine: Me being obedient unto God. or There's: Leaving the church or the choir because they don't like my playing because they ALWAYS want to compete being the best and because they "don't like me" they are going to walk off. I don't know but I truly feel if God has called you then this issue is going to bother you but it shouldn't effect your feelings on if you should question your judgement as to continuing to stay in the ministry.

Good point.  Well said.

[mteekemp]

Let's be honest about a few things here...One is this...yes a musician can kill a church if he or she is allowed to. We must remember that the enemy was "a musician" and the enemy's job is to steal, kill, and destroy. If his or her attitude, or lifestyle is not one that is condusive to the Spirit of God, then that church runs the risk of being "torn up" by that spirit. I feel that it should not be like that, but that does not change the reality of it all. Let's look at some of the issues that are in the church music departments today...1.) homosexuality- a spirit that operates totally against God...2.) fornication/lust-both are against what the word of God says...3.)pride and arrogance- both of these are directly in opposition to God's plan for the church...4.) greed- and we know what $$$$ is doing to the church...
     What is happening, though, is the leaders of these churches are accepting all of this for the sake of what they are calling "productive music ministry", and that is what is killing the churches because when true worship is desired by God, He's not getting the glory from the musicians because the musician is too messed up. How can we lead people somewhere that we have not been...??? We can't because we don't have proper directions to that place. I am a minister of Music in Houston Texas, and as long as I played and sang other people happy, my lifestyle did not matter to the pastors that I was playing for...but thank God I found my way to the altar and repented of my foolish and sinful ways. Am I perfect, no...Do I still mess up, yes...but I love God now with all of my heart and I understand that this Ministry of Music that He has placed in me has nothing to do with me, it is all about Him...We all should have that mindset and those of us who don't...those are the ones thathave the greatest chance of "tearing up churches"...but it's not just musicians... The blame falls on a lot of people who turn away from wrong just cause the music is right... 

[MODERN_DRUMMER]

I feel that if you was appointed to play in that ministry you shouldn't quit or leave no matter if members run off the choir or people start leaving the church. I agree with singinbro, alot people are accustom to a particular person playing and feel that now someone else has taken his/or her place it's the end of it. Another thing is music is there to help build up the church so I think of it like this if you only go to a church because the music is always poppin' then that sounds like a personal issue. Music will always be there but you can't always rely on music to get you to Heaven. I mean music can help people get through but its the word that's going to keep you. Sometimes you have to consider this issue when it boils right down to it, who soul is at stake? Mine: Me being obedient unto God. or There's: Leaving the church or the choir because they don't like my playing because they ALWAYS want to compete being the best and because they "don't like me" they are going to walk off. I don't know but I truly feel if God has called you then this issue is going to bother you but it shouldn't effect your feelings on if you should question your judgement as to continuing to stay in the ministry.

 i agree

[Grammi]

     What is happening, though, is the leaders of these churches are accepting all of this for the sake of what they are calling "productive music ministry", and that is what is killing the churches because when true worship is desired by God, He's not getting the glory from the musicians because the musician is too messed up. How can we lead people somewhere that we have not been...??? We can't because we don't have proper directions to that place. I am a minister of Music in Houston Texas, and as long as I played and sang other people happy, my lifestyle did not matter to the pastors that I was playing for...but thank God I found my way to the altar and repented of my foolish and sinful ways. Am I perfect, no...Do I still mess up, yes...but I love God now with all of my heart and I understand that this Ministry of Music that He has placed in me has nothing to do with me, it is all about Him...We all should have that mindset and those of us who don't...those are the ones thathave the greatest chance of "tearing up churches"...but it's not just musicians... The blame falls on a lot of people who turn away from wrong just cause the music is right... 

This is EXACTLY why I don't prohibit sinners from being a part of ministry in my church. Clearly there are certain behaviors that would prohibit them from certain ministries...like an alcholic would not be allowed to be over pouring the communion into the cups...but I haver seen to many folks saved from being in church to prohibit them from participating

[Graced1]

I believe that anyone appointed in the music ministry first and for most, must be saved and  have a relationship with God. If there is a musician at a church who is not the minister of music by calling and appointment then there should be a minister that supervises them. And we as Ministers need to be knowledgable in praise, worship, order of service and also understand that all gospel is good but not all music even gospel is appropriate for morning worship. Lastly, any music played should always be geared to the audience you're  ministering to. You can't minister if you congregation don't understand you music.


Well said!  AMEN!

I definelty belive you should be saved to minister in the choir.

The choir stands before the congregation leading the congregation in praise and worship towards God under the leadership of the Minister of Music. Exalting Him and Glorifying Him is what it's all about.  You can't do that without the work of the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whose job it is to Glorify Him.  The unbeliever knows nothing about the ministry of the Holy Spirit. He's not indwelt. He cannot Glorify or Magnify the Lord without the agency of the Holy Spirit. He can't even say Jesus is Lord! How is he going to sing in the choir?

[SAHSHA13]

Well, if not kill, SEVERELY INJURE....a gift without the annointing is just that.....and if you add a bad attitude, and mix in a little arrogance, pride, and the fact that the person is unsaved, you better have a defibrillator on hand to revive the choir quick b/c it can "stop breathing" until the Saints pray....Sometimes we choose one over another b/c they seemingly have better "playing skills" but an annointed saved musician will run circles around one who merely has "talent."    THE ANNOINTING IS WHAT BREAKS THE YOKE..... BUT YOU will always have the faithful few who are real and sincere, so because of these faithful few, the choir will never die....but it can be weakened......the Bible says upon this rock I will build my church, and the very gates of hell shall not prevail against it....so the musican cannot kill or prevail!

[MrAJJONES]

Well, if not kill, SEVERELY INJURE....a gift without the annointing is just that.....and if you add a bad attitude, and mix in a little arrogance, pride, and the fact that the person is unsaved, you better have a defibrillator on hand to revive the choir quick b/c it can "stop breathing" until the Saints pray....Sometimes we choose one over another b/c they seemingly have better "playing skills" but an annointed saved musician will run circles around one who merely has "talent."    THE ANNOINTING IS WHAT BREAKS THE YOKE..... BUT YOU will always have the faithful few who are real and sincere, so because of these faithful few, the choir will never die....but it can be weakened......the Bible says upon this rock I will build my church, and the very gates of hell shall not prevail against it....so the musican cannot kill or prevail!

I agree 247 365

[Big T.]

When starting at a new church I try to find out what happen to the old musician? Depending on what conditions they left on, can determine what drama you might run into! Now to answer your question, choirs always compare the old musician to the new one! It's like a relationship you learning them and them learning you! If they are willing bring new material for them, and try to pick out some songs they are familiar with. If they keep complaining and comparing and the situation is still uncomfortable do what my music teacher told me "Let um sing acapela" And that's a rap!!!

[fmason3]

Gospel music is the root and foundation of the church. It's important in today's society to be creative and have a variety of sounds to draw all different types of people and age groups.

Pertaining to a church
I would have to disagree with Mr. Long.  Jesus is the root (Isa. 11:10) and the foundation (Ps. 118:22, 1 Cor. 3:11) of the church.  I believe in far too many churches, music has become the scapegoat as to why the church is not growing.  "The music is dry and boring."  I wonder how good the music was on the Day of Pentecost?  Jesus said "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."  Many churches these days are preaching about how God wants this for you and you should reach up and grab it and your material blessing is on the way.  What happened to preaching obedience to God's law and how we are supposed to live holy...not in order to receive some blessing from God but because we are called to be a holy people (1 Pet. 1:16, 2:9)?  Having good music is a great enhancement to a service.  But when it comes down to it, the success of a church should never be blamed on the music department or the lack thereof.  It is the responsibility of all of the members of a church to evangelize.

...but true church success should never be measured by how full the pews are on a given Saturday or Sunday morning....numbers aren't an accurate depiction.  Some of the the largest churches preach some of the weirdest stuff....and Satan had a bigger church on earth than God did just before the flood.

Pertaining to a choir
The term "good musician" can be rather broad as can "bad musician."  I do believe that a good musician (a kid that can play all the contemporary gospel in the world) can land a gig at the "wrong" church where he may be needed to mainly traditional gospel and anthems.  The church where I play on Sundays was having musician-of-the-week specials going on for a while before I got there and it KILLED the youth choir.  When I got there, the kids would not come to rehearsal.  Whereas the adult choirs pressed through it.  It depends on how much influence and control the musician has (ie: are they also the choir director, minister of music, etc).

[organplaya04]

Pertaining to a church
I would have to disagree with Mr. Long.  Jesus is the root (Isa. 11:10) and the foundation (Ps. 118:22, 1 Cor. 3:11) of the church.  I believe in far too many churches, music has become the scapegoat as to why the church is not growing.  "The music is dry and boring."  I wonder how good the music was on the Day of Pentecost?  Jesus said "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."  Many churches these days are preaching about how God wants this for you and you should reach up and grab it and your material blessing is on the way.  What happened to preaching obedience to God's law and how we are supposed to live holy...not in order to receive some blessing from God but because we are called to be a holy people (1 Pet. 1:16, 2:9)?  Having good music is a great enhancement to a service.  But when it comes down to it, the success of a church should never be blamed on the music department or the lack thereof.  It is the responsibility of all of the members of a church to evangelize.

...but true church success should never be measured by how full the pews are on a given Saturday or Sunday morning....numbers aren't an accurate depiction.  Some of the the largest churches preach some of the weirdest stuff....and Satan had a bigger church on earth than God did just before the flood.

Pertaining to a choir
The term "good musician" can be rather broad as can "bad musician."  I do believe that a good musician (a kid that can play all the contemporary gospel in the world) can land a gig at the "wrong" church where he may be needed to mainly traditional gospel and anthems.  The church where I play on Sundays was having musician-of-the-week specials going on for a while before I got there and it KILLED the youth choir.  When I got there, the kids would not come to rehearsal.  Whereas the adult choirs pressed through it.  It depends on how much influence and control the musician has (ie: are they also the choir director, minister of music, etc).

PREACH MY BRUTHA!!! good stuff Fred..!

[slburks]

Not a spiritually healthy church. If you mean a lead musician, (s)he can kill a song, and run off members who are more concerned about notes than ministry.