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Author Topic: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?  (Read 2667 times)

Offline Big T.

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2008, 09:22:30 AM »
I have neither the time nor the inclination. ::)
CO_SIGN!!!
Go with God, cause He always goes with you.

Offline fmason3

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2008, 09:47:49 AM »
Constantine was raised pagan and was pagan most of his life.  He was an avid sun worshipper.  However, he nominally accepted Christianity and was baptized just before he died.  But Christianity did not replace paganism in his empire, but rather, Christianity adopted paganism.  Christians were persecuted before Constantine accepted Christianity but afterwards, it was cool.  But the problem is the form of Christianity that followed. 

Constantine converted sun-worshipping pagans to Christianity by fusing pagan symbols, rituals and dates into a hybrid religion.  Egyptian sun disks became the halos of Catholic saints.  Remember the Greek sun god helios....hence halo....and sol in Roman mythology...or sol invictus...the "unconquerable sun."  Images of Isis nursing her son Horus were recast as Mary and baby Jesus.  The Persian sun god Mithra was said to have been born on Dec. 25..."natalis invicti"...rebirth of the winter sun, unconquered by the rigors of the season.  That of course was the obvious choice for Christmas even though there's no biblical evidence that we as Christians should commemorate the birth of Jesus. 

Sunday (first day of the week) was also a very holy day to pagan sun worshipping cultures.  Where as throughout the entire bible, God's people observed the seventh day of the week as His holy day.  But Constantine, in an Edict back in A.D. 321 declared Sunday as the official day of rest on which markets were banned and public offices were closed (contrary to Ex. 20:8-11, Neh. 13:15-21).  Furthermore...a few years later at the Council of Laodicea, they outlawed the observance of the seventh-day sabbath:  "Christians should not Judaize and should not be idle on the Sabbath, but should work on that day; they should, however, particularly reverence the Lord’s day and, if possible, not work on it, because they were Christians" (Canon 29 [A.D. 360]).

After Constantine "accepted" Christianity and amalgamated it with paganism, the persecution of Christians did not cease.  Christians that kept the true faith and rejected this spurious new faith continued to give themselves up as martyrs who loved not their lives unto death. 

Throughout the bible, God's relationship with his church is likened to that of a marriage (See story of Hosea and Gomer, parable of the 10 virgins, etc).  Yet in Revelation, God talks about a church that has played the harlot...that has committed spiritual adultery against God.  That's why some pagans laugh at most strains of Christianity.  I saw a bumper sticker one time that said something about Christianity having pagan footprints. 

Offline Salvador

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2008, 09:50:05 AM »
Constantine was raised pagan and was pagan most of his life.  He was an avid sun worshipper.  However, he nominally accepted Christianity and was baptized just before he died.  But Christianity did not replace paganism in his empire, but rather, Christianity adopted paganism.  Christians were persecuted before Constantine accepted Christianity but afterwards, it was cool.  But the problem is the form of Christianity that followed. 

Constantine converted sun-worshipping pagans to Christianity by fusing pagan symbols, rituals and dates into a hybrid religion.  Egyptian sun disks became the halos of Catholic saints.  Remember the Greek sun god helios....hence halo....and sol in Roman mythology...or sol invictus...the "unconquerable sun."  Images of Isis nursing her son Horus were recast as Mary and baby Jesus.  The Persian sun god Mithra was said to have been born on Dec. 25..."natalis invicti"...rebirth of the winter sun, unconquered by the rigors of the season.  That of course was the obvious choice for Christmas even though there's no biblical evidence that we as Christians should commemorate the birth of Jesus. 

Sunday (first day of the week) was also a very holy day to pagan sun worshipping cultures.  Where as throughout the entire bible, God's people observed the seventh day of the week as His holy day.  But Constantine, in an Edict back in A.D. 321 declared Sunday as the official day of rest on which markets were banned and public offices were closed (contrary to Ex. 20:8-11, Neh. 13:15-21).  Furthermore...a few years later at the Council of Laodicea, they outlawed the observance of the seventh-day sabbath:  "Christians should not Judaize and should not be idle on the Sabbath, but should work on that day; they should, however, particularly reverence the Lord’s day and, if possible, not work on it, because they were Christians" (Canon 29 [A.D. 360]).

After Constantine "accepted" Christianity and amalgamated it with paganism, the persecution of Christians did not cease.  Christians that kept the true faith and rejected this spurious new faith continued to give themselves up as martyrs who loved not their lives unto death. 

Throughout the bible, God's relationship with his church is likened to that of a marriage (See story of Hosea and Gomer, parable of the 10 virgins, etc).  Yet in Revelation, God talks about a church that has played the harlot...that has committed spiritual adultery against God.  That's why some pagans laugh at most strains of Christianity.  I saw a bumper sticker one time that said something about Christianity having pagan footprints. 
Did you copy and paste that from the zeitgeist web site or something?
Because most of that is half truths.

Offline fmason3

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #23 on: April 01, 2008, 09:51:04 AM »
Did you copy and paste that from the zeitgeist web site or something?
Because most of that is half truths.

no sir

Offline fmason3

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #24 on: April 01, 2008, 09:53:30 AM »
Most of it is my words from studies I've done in the past.  I referred to a few sites like the catholic encyclopedia and wikipedia to get dates and latin phrases but that's about it.

Offline Fenix

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #25 on: April 01, 2008, 10:01:28 AM »
Did you copy and paste that from the zeitgeist web site or something?
Because most of that is half truths.

I am going to agree with you. It looks copy-pasted to me.

Sorry Mr Fmason3 .  :-\


The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline Salvador

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #26 on: April 01, 2008, 10:12:23 AM »
Well, it's not wrong per se.
But like I told Bruh Kell it places the emphasis on the wrong parts.

Constantine was pagan (like all previous Roman rulers) but, possibly because of his father, was tolerant of Christianity and employed not only Christian men, but priests in his retinue BEFORE his conversion.

And it wasn't so much "fusing" as much as it was one upping the pagan things. So the 3rd, 4th century Christians began making their own versions of the pagan things like Mithra killed a bull, Sampson kills a lion.
It was more like marketing, during a time that the culture was very imitative.

As for Mithra, a good rule of thumb to remember is that almost everything we know about the religion dates AFTER Christianity. So who influenced/copied who?

I'm going to have to look up the sabbath thing, which is weird because I JUST read something about that yesterday.

Offline Fingers!

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #27 on: April 01, 2008, 11:03:07 AM »
Did you copy and paste that from the zeitgeist web site or something?
Because most of that is half truths.

I thought what he said was okay.  A few questionable gray areas (he covered a lot of real estate) but generally, sure, why not...  But I wouldn't try picking him apart point-for-point unless I thought he was waaaay off.  A defense for Constantine's behavior would be sort of slippery to make, unless you're Catholic.  Don't get me wrong, I WOULD argue, but not FOR Constantine.

I liked what you said earlier until you mentioned Francis Bacon.  Mr. Bacon don't sit well with me in a religious discussion.  To me, it's like throwing blood into the water for sharks.  Nevertheless, I was able to move on and still accept your comment. 

If you go after each other point-for-point, especially on a vast subject as Constantine (didn't even bring up his mother), neither of you will get out of the woods alive. 

Offline Dredakyst

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2008, 11:06:36 AM »
I'm going to have to look up the sabbath thing, which is weird because I JUST read something about that yesterday.

Didn't Paul debunk the case for the Sabbath??? Romans 14:5-6 (I like the New Life Version wording)

Kinda foreshadowing if you will...


As for the zeitgeist reference... keep in mind that sometimes those half-truths are what perpetuated the faith... sad to say..  Remember Judas was a disciple, with his own agenda.

But Like fire raining down on the prophets against Elijah, the very true essence of God will be revealed if you draw near to Him; and be willing to listen/open your eyes.

Christianity didn't adopt Paganism, the fallen man did.

If you believe in the scripture... everything is laid out accordingly. 

The rest we have added... Like Christmas, Easter egg hunts and I'm sure the list can grow darker....

There comes a point where you will have to be willing to separate the Holy Spirit/Move of God working through man; which is an alternative viewpoint from man trying to conjure up the very essence of the Move of God/Holy Spirit in order to appease man.

Offline Furious Styles

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2008, 11:06:47 AM »
In the defense of freemason his perspectives is not based on half truths. If one did the research outside of Wednesday bible study you'd find that many of the traditions taken on by orthodox christianity comes from many of these adopted customs. Constantine is an important figure in christian history because he was the first political power to give christianity a face. Many religions and customs had been practiced throughout the history of the various empires of the world. Scholastic comparisons of these empires in regard to the Jewish nation is very miniscule when you view the accomplishments of the world powers. God's will was accomplished through the jewish nation as a means to bring the world salvation.

God allowed and predicted through his prophets that Isreal would prosper but would be conquered by world powers such as Rome.(reference the prophecies of Daniel) By the time Constantine comes to power the Roman empire is on the brink of falling apart. It is he who commissioned the crusades. The crusades were not about converting lost souls but about aquiring more land, wealth and prestige for glory of the Roman empire. SO Constantine is not a saint but a central figure important in the mainstream recognition of Religion. The martyrs of the faith who secretly practiced the true teachings of Jesus were persecuted. Many such as Paul were murdered for upholding the true essence of the faith. These murders are consistent with the prophecies of Jesus who declared that tribulation and great challenge would come upon those who took the true essence of the Gospel to the Masses and those in power.

Today's American society is riddled with pagan traditions that have been adopted as "biblical". The spiritual aspect of the faith has been minimized while those who claim to stand for righteousness aren't really being persecuted. The fellowship of christ suffering and resurrection has been minimized to a form of truth, Godliness, and false information used as means to control people's mind. This my friends is the essence of withcraft in modern American churches... Strong medicine but I'm telling the truth. Some of you will not accept it as truth but historical, sricptural and cultural events point to these words...
 I'll finish this later in the P.M.
Ignorance is Bliss

Offline Bruh Kell

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #30 on: April 01, 2008, 11:08:31 AM »
Well see look here.

I had a sermon coming to me last night and that was exactly what I was talking about.

One of my side notes was...............The move of God will never be mainstream!!!!!
That is to say mainstream culture will never accept the true Gospel. So you got to change it!!!! which is exactly what they've done.........

Actually if I had to give the sermon a title it would be "The Counterfiet God".
I Love You!!!

Offline Fenix

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #31 on: April 01, 2008, 11:13:22 AM »
1) In the defense of freemason his perspectives is not based on half truths.
 
2) I'll finish this later in the P.M.


Sorry i had to alter your post a bit.

1) I SUSPECTED AS MUCH. See i was thinking maybe Fred Mason III or something like that.

2) NO!!!! Finish it here please. Don't worry about steppin' on toes man. Finish it here.
The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline Salvador

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2008, 11:33:44 AM »
In the defense of freemason his perspectives is not based on half truths.
I corrected myself in the next post.
It was for the most part true, I just disagreed with the emphasis.
It's like that picture of the U.S. soldiers and the camel spiders. The picture is real but the perspective of the picture changes the reality of it.

The Freemason post disturbed me in general because it was almost lifted straight from the Da Vinci Code.

Offline Salvador

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2008, 11:34:20 AM »
Sorry i had to alter your post a bit.

1) I SUSPECTED AS MUCH. See i was thinking maybe Fred Mason III or something like that.

2) NO!!!! Finish it here please. Don't worry about steppin' on toes man. Finish it here.
I think by "pm" he meant in the afternoon.

Offline Salvador

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #34 on: April 01, 2008, 11:37:19 AM »
I liked what you said earlier until you mentioned Francis Bacon.  Mr. Bacon don't sit well with me in a religious discussion.  To me, it's like throwing blood into the water for sharks.  Nevertheless, I was able to move on and still accept your comment.
It was just a quote, I'm not endorsing or sharing all of his beliefs.
The same as when I quote Aristotle, Einstein, or even a guy like Voltaire.

Offline fmason3

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #35 on: April 01, 2008, 02:45:27 PM »
Who is Freemason?  My name is Fred Mason, III hence "fmason3"....in no way related to freemasonry...

Offline fmason3

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #36 on: April 01, 2008, 03:17:55 PM »
Well see look here.

I had a sermon coming to me last night and that was exactly what I was talking about.

One of my side notes was...............The move of God will never be mainstream!!!!!
That is to say mainstream culture will never accept the true Gospel. So you got to change it!!!! which is exactly what they've done.........

Actually if I had to give the sermon a title it would be "The Counterfiet God".

Agreed...that's why Satan is a deceiver...stuff that is his looks so much like the real thing that people can't tell the difference....or the difference no longer matters...because we should not banter over trivial matters :-\
So would this counterfeit god work like the re

Offline Fenix

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #37 on: April 01, 2008, 03:31:39 PM »
Sorry i had to alter your post a bit.

1) I SUSPECTED AS MUCH. See i was thinking maybe Fred Mason III or something like that.


Who is Freemason?  My name is Fred Mason, III hence "fmason3"....in no way related to freemasonry...

In case ya'll missed it...

I AM GOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!
The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline lathoma

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #38 on: April 01, 2008, 04:28:30 PM »
The Freemason post disturbed me in general because it was almost lifted straight from the Da Vinci Code.

I've never read the Da Vinci Code, but I do know Fred is correct in everything he just stated.  Go check out any college survey history text book concerning Western Civ or anything about the history of the early Christian church.

Offline Salvador

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Re: Who is Constantine????? Is he important at all?
« Reply #39 on: April 01, 2008, 04:37:15 PM »
In case ya'll missed it...

I AM GOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!
haha...umm, apri fools?  ;)
I've never read the Da Vinci Code, but I do know Fred is correct in everything he just stated.  Go check out any college survey history text book concerning Western Civ or anything about the history of the early Christian church.
I know my history of the early church.
And again, my problem wasn't so much with the data as it was with the semantics.

I see posts like that all the time...from skeptics.

I was just trying to point out I wouldn't say things quite the way he said them because of how they can be easily twisted.
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