Should churches.......

[chevonee]

invest in the stock market? BTW, I hope this question hasn't been asked b4 if so just point me to the link please. I have just been very curious about how churches can do something to help itself without having to have church services and sell fish plates to raise money. 

[LaylaMonroe]

I think that from a practical perspective, churches should NOT invest in the stock market. It creates too many opportunities to have a conflict of interest, and investing, in general, is not a church's area of expertise nor does it have anything directly or indirectly to do with soul-winning or edifying the body of Christ.  There are also a few principles involved that could be compromised. I'm too sleepy right now to get into that.

As far as a Biblical perspective... I can only say that it's not explicitly unBiblical, but I wouldn't hesitate to advise against it. If I had a client or pastor who insisted, I would recommend buying some US Savings Bonds instead, a mutual fund, money market, or something else that is safer and lower-risk than the stock market.  I don't think there's much wrong with churches investing, but I would avoid having them invest in the stock market.

[betnich]

IMO churches should invest in the Kingdom of God....

(not the kingdom of gold - besides, lots of people + corps have lost their shirts in the recent downturn)

[Fenix]

They could invest in US government and other AAA rated bonds.

[phbrown]

They can always continue to invest in real estate.

It is what a lot of churches do. I personally see it causing too many potential conflicts if Churches start investing in the stock market.



On a side note why would a church need more than what is bought in through tithes?

If the membership isn't tithing like they should thats the bigger problem. And if they are tithing like they should than maybe the church needs to downsize.

[Hasmonean1]

I hear you on the tithing phbrown.  Furthermore, if anyone should be investing it's the members of the church.  As we know only a small portion of the membership is active in doing the much needed work within the church.  So in my opinion, if the membership as a whole would step up and "work the work" then the church should be well serviced in all areas even to the overflow.  One not so famous man often says that "anything healthy will grow".  That being true, we pray for the overall spiritual health of the churches.

[LaylaMonroe]

They can always continue to invest in real estate.

It is what a lot of churches do. I personally see it causing too many potential conflicts if Churches start investing in the stock market.



On a side note why would a church need more than what is bought in through tithes?

If the membership isn't tithing like they should thats the bigger problem. And if they are tithing like they should than maybe the church needs to downsize.

I wholeheartedly cosign this, especially the part in bold.

I've often said, and it bears repeating, if churches are unable to be sustained by tithes and offering, they are probably living/existing beyond their means. If the Bible is our reference, the book of Acts is a great model for churches.

[nessalynn77]

But let's we be real (unless this is just a Reno thing), tithes fluctuate so much it can't possibly be a dependable income with which to forecast your ministry endeavors for any extended period.  You may be within your means now, and 6 months later with the same expenses you're suddenly not any more.

[LaylaMonroe]

But let's we be real (unless this is just a Reno thing), tithes fluctuate so much it can't possibly be a dependable income with which to forecast your ministry endeavors for any extended period.  You may be within your means now, and 6 months later with the same expenses you're suddenly not any more.

VERY true, and it's not just a Reno thing. But it is indicative of a much bigger problem (or perhaps a few problems). Could be lack of teaching, could be the economy (job loss, fewer hours, pay decrease), could be members leaving, etc... I always advise new pastors to plan by HALF of what they reasonably anticipate will come in. So if it's safe to assume a church will bring in $10,000 in tithes each month, they should base their budgets on a plan of $5,000... especially in this economy.

My church, as of today, is a 100% tithing church. However, we are a small church and steadily growing.  So with great dread, I've been thinking about how we will handle the new member that DOESN'T tithe or doesn't tithe consistently. I guess we'll prayerfully cross that bridge when we get to it. But as of today, 100% of our members (and many of our non-members as well) are consistent tithers. Thank God.

[Mysteryman]

@Nessa my God shall supply... and that he will. Either way the church can grow broke if the market crashes. 

If the church wants to invest they can set up a separate fund for participating members. Would be nice thinking how much stock a group can buy and the profit in a short time.

The tithes go in direct support of the church. If churches would keep the tithes restricted to the ministry it may solve many problems but we will do other stuff and take the tithes to pay for it. 

[J31]

YES! Churches like christians should use any legal means to gain wealth. I ask God all the tie and pray when I go to invest and move money etc, along with solid professional counsel and I believe churches waste so much more money on departments and ministries within the church that are fruitless yet we dump money into services and programs that dont work.

churches should also aquire property, land etc... THAt is how you advance the kingdom.. at least one of the ways. its not all spiritual.

BTJM

[LaylaMonroe]

Churches like christians should use any legal means to gain wealth.

Really? Despite the risk factor in some "legal means"? Going to a casino playing Blackjack is both legal (in some states) and a great way to make a lot of money, and it offers an opportunity to fellowship. It's also high-risk and it could be addictive. These factors make that particular "legal means" imprudent and unwise.

Lawful but not expedient. The stock market can also be high-risk.

[funkStrat_97]

But what if the church's investments are not part of its day-to-day operating budget?  Suppose a church is properly managing its income from tithes and offerings, but has other long-term financial goals.  For example; some denominations provide pensions for retired clergy.  Would this be a case where some investment in the stock market might make sense or are there other alternatives?

[LaylaMonroe]

But what if the church's investments are not part of its day-to-day operating budget?  Suppose a church is properly managing its income from tithes and offerings, but has other long-term financial goals.  For example; some denominations provide pensions for retired clergy.  Would this be a case where some investment in the stock market might make sense or are there other alternatives?

My personal opinion is that if a church manages all it's income properly and has "extra" money left over, it should be putting that money into outreach and evangelism.... BTJM.

That said, I don't know enough about pensions to say whether that would be a good case where stock market investing may make sense. On the surface, it sounds reasonable enough to me, but I'd be interested in knowing the alternatives and risks.

[lordluvr]

The only reason I can see the church investing in the market, or market-related investments, is if it has a pension fund or some other type of fund for its employees.  Aside from that, what's the purpose?  Most church funds are used in one way, shape or form for the ministry, from building improvements, to helping out struggling members financially, to outreach programs, etc.  All of those purposes are short-term when it comes to when those dollars will be used.  One should invest in the market if they have a sufficient time horizon in which to invest (5 years +). 

[LaylaMonroe]

The only reason I can see the church investing in the market, or market-related investments, is if it has a pension fund or some other type of fund for its employees.  Aside from that, what's the purpose?  Most church funds are used in one way, shape or form for the ministry, from building improvements, to helping out struggling members financially, to outreach programs, etc.  All of those purposes are short-term when it comes to when those dollars will be used.  One should invest in the market if they have a sufficient time horizon in which to invest (5 years +). 

Given your expertise, that settles it for me.

[Arkhams Finest]

Investing in the Stock Market, when done both conservatively, and by someone who knows what they're doing, would be a very good idea.

You don't take all the church treasury and invest in the market, but if you invest a portion of the treasury wisely, it can be beneficial.

It isn't for everyone though.  If you have a small church and not much funds in the treasury, and you're trying to make a million dollars in 3 months, it's a bad idea.

If you have a large church with a substantial treasury, and don't mind waiting for a smart, conservative market plan to yield results, then it's a good idea.

[nessalynn77]

Investing in the Stock Market, when done both conservatively, and by someone who knows what they're doing, would be a very good idea.

You don't take all the church treasury and invest in the market, but if you invest a portion of the treasury wisely, it can be beneficial.

It isn't for everyone though.  If you have a small church and not much funds in the treasury, and you're trying to make a million dollars in 3 months, it's a bad idea.

If you have a large church with a substantial treasury, and don't mind waiting for a smart, conservative market plan to yield results, then it's a good idea.

I agree.  I think a wise investment now, could help the church in the long-term when say they need to build an edifice to accomodate the growing ministry, or if they have a growth plan that includes branching out on the other side of town and reaching a whole new community.  Those are long term goals that require some long term finance.

[T-Block]

I think it's a bad idea. No matter how u look at it, you're taking money that you already have out of the church and putting it into a system that may or may not yield any returns. God doesn't deal in chance and so shouldn't the church.

On a side note why would a church need more than what is bought in through tithes?

If the membership isn't tithing like they should thats the bigger problem. And if they are tithing like they should than maybe the church needs to downsize.

This.

[nessalynn77]

I think it's a bad idea. No matter how u look at it, you're taking money that you already have out of the church and putting it into a system that may or may not yield any returns. God doesn't deal in chance and so shouldn't the church.

This.

Is investing gambling, though?  I don't believe so, look at the parable of the talents.  There is some investing that is unwise and does indeed amount to gambling, but if you research a product or an idea, and feel that it is worth making an investment, it is not the same thing.