The Tragedy of Inner Turmoil...

[SirTJ]

Yeah, the church is really getting away from this.  Everybody has some sort of wall up, or some don't feel any responsibility to their church family as far as dealing with people and personalities-- they won't make any effort to go past their comfort zone when it comes to making an effort.

I think the devil is satisfied with that.  It's easier to isolate and conquer people than to conquer them when they stay close to one another in communication and fellowship. 

Ol' Abe said it best; "A house divided against itself cannot stand."

[Fenix]

Yeah, the church is really getting away from this.  Everybody has some sort of wall up, or some don't feel any responsibility to their church family as far as dealing with people and personalities-- they won't make any effort to go past their comfort zone when it comes to making an effort.

I think the devil is satisfied with that.  It's easier to isolate and conquer people than to conquer them when they stay close to one another in communication and fellowship.

+1

[nessalynn77]

Ol' Abe said it best; "A house divided against itself cannot stand."

Yep.  I had to talk to a difficult person in our church this week, and I learned something important.  I'm one to avoid people that are just unnecessarily difficult, but every time I prayed, it seemed like God would bring this chick up.  I was thinking I'm not the one with the problem so she can go jump as far as I'm concerned, lol.  It took a while but God finally showed me the bigger picture.  We think we make the devil mad by alienating people and winning personal conflict battles with our brothers and sisters.  In actuality we make the person mad and the relationship weaker, and the devil is overjoyed.  But when you reach out to understand someone, or to love them in spite of how you perceive them to be, then the devil has a fight on his hands.  He no longer has a huge dark spot in the church where he can operate and wreak havoc virtually undetected. 

I don't care if the pastor has a 2nd grade education, people have no concept of how to run a church, and the musician only knows three chords, if you can get those people to reach out and really care about one another, and all contribute and build what they have, that group is going somewhere faster than the fully educated, fully funded, fully equipped church that can't ever get past petty interpersonal issues.

But I digress... 

[Fenix]

Yep.  I had to talk to a difficult person in our church this week, and I learned something important.  I'm one to avoid people that are just unnecessarily difficult, but every time I prayed, it seemed like God would bring this chick up.  I was thinking I'm not the one with the problem so she can go jump as far as I'm concerned, lol.  It took a while but God finally showed me the bigger picture.  We think we make the devil mad by alienating people and winning personal conflict battles with our brothers and sisters.  In actuality we make the person mad and the relationship weaker, and the devil is overjoyed.  But when you reach out to understand someone, or to love them in spite of how you perceive them to be, then the devil has a fight on his hands.  He no longer has a huge dark spot in the church where he can operate and wreak havoc virtually undetected. 

**Feeling very challenged**

Does this mean I have to like the chick in the choir who always invariably goes off key on every song she sings?

Please say no...

^__^

[sjonathan02]

Yeah there are many people hurting. Some of it could be prevented if somebody cared especially in the church. I like people to fellowship outside of church at times for this very reason. People need people as they say. Money and power is just a high. After you come down you've still got to live.

This.


*'quick' story*

Our church was supposed to have a family breakfast.  We shared this with the congregation.  At first, it was merely a fellowship outing.  All of a sudden, either my pastor or the FL thought, during a leadership meeting, this would be a good opportunity to 'make' folks commit to a particular ministry...without telling the congregation.


Many of us thought this was a bad idea but said nothing.  Luckily, God intervened and it 'snowed' that day cancelling the breakfast.


I share that to say we get so busy with church, Bible study, etc. that we tend to forget to just be with one another.

[sjonathan02]

**Feeling very challenged**

Does this mean I have to like the chick in the choir who always invariably goes off key on every song she sings?

Please say no...

^__^

Like her? No. You have to LOVE her.


Which may mean saying, 'Looka here, if you don't go somewhea and SADDOWN...'

[nessalynn77]

**Feeling very challenged**

You and me both.  I still have one more.  The graphic design lady in the jurisdiction.  I'm praying, I have to get there.  Our theme this year is Operating in the Secret Place.  Only one month in and it is cutting me up, lol!

So as though you don't already know, yes you have to like her, and you have to confront problems with her and give her every opportunity to improve, and give yourself every opportunity to find the good in her.

[SirTJ]

You and me both.  I still have one more.  The graphic design lady in the jurisdiction.  I'm praying, I have to get there.  Our theme this year is Operating in the Secret Place.  Only one month in and it is cutting me up, lol!

So as though you don't already know, yes you have to like her, and you have to confront problems with her and give her every opportunity to improve, and give yourself every opportunity to find the good in her.

You made that edit quick. 

[nessalynn77]

You made that edit quick. 

Have to.  There's snipers everywhere, lol.

[sjonathan02]

Have to.  There's snipers everywhere, lol.

Good job, sis. 

[SirTJ]

Have to.  There's snipers everywhere, lol.

Yes, there are. 

[nessalynn77]

Good job, sis. 

And lest my colloquial speaking snare me, there are snipers everywhere, LOL!

[nessalynn77]

You were just a little quicker than me, lol.

[LaylaMonroe]

LOL @ this page, and *nodding head* at the moral of Jonathan's story. Good stuff.

[Mysteryman]

Yeah, the church is really getting away from this.  Everybody has some sort of wall up, or some don't feel any responsibility to their church family as far as dealing with people and personalities-- they won't make any effort to go past their comfort zone when it comes to making an effort.

I think the devil is satisfied with that.  It's easier to isolate and conquer people than to conquer them when they stay close to one another in communication and fellowship.

I'm working more and more on getting past the flaws of people. I get annoyed at times but sometimes fellowship is needed for the sake of the other person. Some people have not been effectively taught how to communicate verbally when dealing with adversity in relationships. Other sides of the issue are some people don't know when to be quiet or be considerate.

[SisterT]

Yeah there are many people hurting. Some of it could be prevented if somebody cared especially in the church. I like people to fellowship outside of church at times for this very reason. People need people as they say. Money and power is just a high. After you come down you've still got to live.

Wonderful responses to this. Might I suggest another problem....

The church is guilty of giving false hope, thereby, we fail to give proper help. For instance, we hear it all the time, "Just have faith, it will cure everything." "Just name it and claim it." "Just sow a $212 seed and you will get what you need." We offer hope and God in a formula. Unfortunately many in and out of the church walk away feeling like a failure or feeling something is wrong with them.

Church folk will always tell you about their victories, but never admit their struggles, and they walk around as if everything is "perfect" in their life because of their faith.

Lately, I have seen an increase in people seeking counsel because of what I call the Doctrine of False Hope. People are not getting real help from churches because church folk refuse to keep it real! Many churches don't have counseling services available to the church and community. God created other people to help one another. Sometimes church folk can be so heavenly that they are of no earthly good.

Recently I discovered the problem can be an insecure Sr. Pastor. A pastor had the audacity to say I should ask his permission to counsel HIS MEMBERS who seek out my counsel. What the what? First of all that would be a breech in confidentiality. Secondly, even I am not qualified to counsel all cases, so if a counselee seeks out another for help and/or is more comfortable with another, that's great. It is about HEALING, right?  The church has many self-centered, insecure, egomaniacs who are not concerned about really helping others. And since when does a pastor decide who GROWN FOLK should go to for help. Come one, this was not an issue of making sure they receive sound advice, but one of "fear of losing members." SMH!

[Mysteryman]

Agrees with SisterT. I was just saying that to my dad Sunday when we were watching a tbn program. The preacher kept saying you will never be hurt again if you follow some principles he had which I said basically gives people that false sense of hope. We are now starting to feel some of the effects of the prosperity movement. It took a recession to do it. I normally feel uncomfortable when preachers say there is no recession for the saints.  If the ship sinks then what.

[LaylaMonroe]

IRT getting past people's flaws (or ignoring, dealing with them, etc). One thing that has helped me tremendously (especially in my dealings with the young ladies who mostly drive me insane) is the reminder that somebody dealt with me when I was young, draining, needy and knew it all. Even today, though I've outgrown THOSE flaws, there are still people who overlook my flaws or confront them to help me be a better me.

It's hard to walk away from someone because of their flaws when you know that nobody walked away from you with yours.

[LaylaMonroe]

Wonderful responses to this. Might I suggest another problem....

The church is guilty of giving false hope, thereby, we fail to give proper help. For instance, we hear it all the time, "Just have faith, it will cure everything." "Just name it and claim it." "Just sow a $212 seed and you will get what you need." We offer hope and God in a formula. Unfortunately many in and out of the church walk away feeling like a failure or feeling something is wrong with them.

Church folk will always tell you about their victories, but never admit their struggles, and they walk around as if everything is "perfect" in their life because of their faith.

Lately, I have seen an increase in people seeking counsel because of what I call the Doctrine of False Hope. People are not getting real help from churches because church folk refuse to keep it real! Many churches don't have counseling services available to the church and community. God created other people to help one another. Sometimes church folk can be so heavenly that they are of no earthly good.

Recently I discovered the problem can be an insecure Sr. Pastor. A pastor had the audacity to say I should ask his permission to counsel HIS MEMBERS who seek out my counsel. What the what? First of all that would be a breech in confidentiality. Secondly, even I am not qualified to counsel all cases, so if a counselee seeks out another for help and/or is more comfortable with another, that's great. It is about HEALING, right?  The church has many self-centered, insecure, egomaniacs who are not concerned about really helping others. And since when does a pastor decide who GROWN FOLK should go to for help. Come one, this was not an issue of making sure they receive sound advice, but one of "fear of losing members." SMH!

Very good stuff. I had a similar conversation all week long with a friend of mine IRT marriages. Until recently, I had NO CLUE that she and her husband were struggling. To the outside world (and even to those close to them), things look perfect. He's madly in love with her and always showers her with the love and affection most women want. Well, imagine my shock when she told me that she started making arrangements to separate from him and some things are already in the works. It's crazy. And the problem, after talking to her some more and getting ot the bottom of it, is that there aren't enough married folks who are willing to tell the TRUTH about how difficult marriage is. Everybody wants to share the glory, but nobody wants to share the grime. So you get married and things aren't as wonderful as you expected and you think something is wrong with your marriage so you want to end it, not knowing that there are gazillions of couples out there who OVERCAME the same issue.

Same thing with suicide, depression and backsliding, etc. People are falling away because they don't realize that they're NOT alone in the struggle. It's not just the devil who makes us feel like we're alone in these struggles and problems. WE make each other feel that way by not being transparent and by running our mouths every time someone messes up, and by not creating safe environments for people to fail or have flaws.

[Mysteryman]

Very good stuff. I had a similar conversation all week long with a friend of mine IRT marriages. Until recently, I had NO CLUE that she and her husband were struggling. To the outside world (and even to those close to them), things look perfect. He's madly in love with her and always showers her with the love and affection most women want. Well, imagine my shock when she told me that she started making arrangements to separate from him and some things are already in the works. It's crazy. And the problem, after talking to her some more and getting ot the bottom of it, is that there aren't enough married folks who are willing to tell the TRUTH about how difficult marriage is. Everybody wants to share the glory, but nobody wants to share the grime. So you get married and things aren't as wonderful as you expected and you think something is wrong with your marriage so you want to end it, not knowing that there are gazillions of couples out there who OVERCAME the same issue.

Same thing with suicide, depression and backsliding, etc. People are falling away because they don't realize that they're NOT alone in the struggle. It's not just the devil who makes us feel like we're alone in these struggles and problems. WE make each other feel that way by not being transparent and by running our mouths every time someone messes up, and by not creating safe environments for people to fail or have flaws.

I was given the advice by some don't tell anybody what goes on I'm your house. I understand where they are coming from but I believe if you don't have nothing to hide it doesn't matter. I've gotten much more help from the married couples who were straight up with me. Stress is a major reason why so many people have issues in their health. That in itself leads to other problems.