Chik Filet vs Chi,Boston,San Fran + more

[betnich]

Went to the Chik-Fil-A by our church this afternoon...very busy, 30 min. wait, line out the door, with several outside waving American flags, so joined the line of cars going through the take-out. Asked the guy taking orders if it had been like that all day; he nodded and said 'yes'.

Here's an article from the NY Daily News -

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/chick-fil-a-appreciation-day-supporters-crowd-fast-food-chain-locations-anti-gay-stance-fire-article-1.1126673?localLinksEnabled=false

[sjonathan02]

I didn't know he said that. Where's the source??

Interesting tidbits about where Chik-Fil-A spends their dollars


The article also includes lawsuits against the company.


From the above article, you can get to the article written in Forbes back in 2007. Where you'll find the quote Malthumb mentioned

It's in paragraph 8:

"If a man can't manage his own life, he can't manage a business," says Cathy, who says he would probably fire an employee or terminate an operator who "has been sinful or done something harmful to their family members."

Another interesting nugget:

Chick-fil-A, the corporate parent, has been sued at least 12 times since 1988 on charges of employment discrimination, according to records in U.S. District Courts. Aziz Latif, a former Chick-fil-A restaurant manager in Houston, sued the company in 2002 after Latif, a Muslim, says he was fired a day after he didn't participate in a group prayer to Jesus Christ at a company training program in 2000. The suit was settled on undisclosed terms.

[MissMusic04]

I love Chick Fil A. I didn't go yesterday. When I eat fast food, it's always Chick Fil A or Zaxbys. I eat it all the time. I did get breakfast this morning though.

I just wasn't going to wait in a long line for food. That's me everyday, lol.

If Chick Fil A said that they were for gay marriage, I probably would still eat there. I don't hate gays but I don't support that lifestyle. I love and interact with all people.

I heard a guy here say that we(African Americans) should understand because it's like the civil rights movement of the 50's and 60's.

 I try not to talk politics at work because it's so many anti-black people here, but I had to voice my opinion on that.

OAN, I saw a picture of Paul S Morton at Chick Fil A yesterday.

[malthumb]

SJon.....thanks!  That is exactly the quote I was referring to.  I didn't realize it was from 2007.  My colleague who showed it to me didn't mention that, so I assumed it was a recent statement.  In fact, I thought it was the statement that sparked this whole issue.  Guess I wasn't really paying attention that day.

[Hasmonean1]

Interesting tidbits about where Chik-Fil-A spends their dollars


The article also includes lawsuits against the company.


From the above article, you can get to the article written in Forbes back in 2007. Where you'll find the quote Malthumb mentioned

It's in paragraph 8:

"If a man can't manage his own life, he can't manage a business," says Cathy, who says he would probably fire an employee or terminate an operator who "has been sinful or done something harmful to their family members."

Another interesting nugget:

Chick-fil-A, the corporate parent, has been sued at least 12 times since 1988 on charges of employment discrimination, according to records in U.S. District Courts. Aziz Latif, a former Chick-fil-A restaurant manager in Houston, sued the company in 2002 after Latif, a Muslim, says he was fired a day after he didn't participate in a group prayer to Jesus Christ at a company training program in 2000. The suit was settled on undisclosed terms.

I read that article and what jumped out to me was use of the word "if" and "might".   It seems when those words are mixed with accusations,  the writer is trying to lead the reader.  "If" and "might"  can be attributed to any given business or corporation where concrete accusations should turn off a nation. 

[malthumb]

....... . Aziz Latif, a former Chick-fil-A restaurant manager in Houston, sued the company in 2002 after Latif, a Muslim, says he was fired a day after he didn't participate in a group prayer to Jesus Christ at a company training program in 2000. The suit was settled on undisclosed terms.[/i][/b]

THIS is the sort of thing that will get CFA and any other company that behaves this way in a lot of legal trouble.

DEMONSTRATING morality = a good thing
FOLLOWING LAW = a required thing
SUBSTITUTING PERSONAL MORAL CONVICTIONS FOR LAW = dangerous legal waters.  Especially wrt hiring practices and employee treatment.  This is where I think CFA is.

I understand their point, but their actions to achieve it can get them in a lot of trouble.  The various mayors?  I think there's a bit of posturing going on there.

[docjohn]

The 3 store near the ranch were jammed pretty much all day with a 1 1/2 hour wait@ one.

The hateful /anger /intolerance of gays towards others was on demonstration -for a group that preaches "tolerance";they are readily intolerant.As one of the ladies @ church was saying,for a group that uses the term "gay" (implying happy)-many are really snarly/hateful if you dare to cross them!

I wonder how much of that  anger is really directed @ the LORD?  If you're dumb enough to shake your hand or spit in HIS FACE;I wonder what spirit is behind that? They spend a fair amount of effort to demonize the heteros.

Beginning of WISDOM,UNDERSTANDING,and KNOWLEDGE is fear of the LORD.If you don't have a respectful,healthy fear of LORD-where is your hope?

As 13 (?) alludes to,if you pit people vs. people and destroy the family-just a part of destroying a culture,and guess whose plan that is?So you have one group mocking the group that dares to lift what LORD states are HIS VALUES;the attention winds up being about what a a man(men) says/thinks.

As Paul says-think always on the LORD.Focus on/sow to the flesh=reap from the flesh;i.e. wars/destruction.

[LaylaMonroe]

Jonathan/Malthumb, Google led me to those same articles last night but I was too tired to comment. Two things: one, it wasn't Dan Cathy who said that, it was his father Truett. Two, as has been pointed out, that was 5 years ago so other doesn't have a lot to do with what's going on today (imo).

[Mysteryman]

Jonathan/Malthumb, Google led me to those same articles last night but I was too tired to comment. Two things: one, it wasn't Dan Cathy who said that, it was his father Truett. Two, as has been pointed out, that was 5 years ago so other doesn't have a lot to do with what's going on today (imo).

So that's where Truett's comes from. They have some good greens and sweet potato dessert.

[LaylaMonroe]

Another point that crossed my mind late last night. I saw that they had 12 employment discrimination cases against them since 1988. 12 times in 24 years may be a lot. Or it may not be. I have no idea. I would have to compare the ratio to that of Wendy's, McDonalds, BK, Popeyes, KFC, etc. to see whether that's as bad as it sounds.

People ought to read their mission statement. I read it some time ago when having a debate with a friend about their Sunday closure. They are a Christian-owned company with Christian values and a truly Christian mission. Their mission isn't to get rich. It's almost like an ongoing Chicken Dinner Sale after church. Their mission is to earn money for the purpose of supporting Christian values and advance the cause of Christ. Earning money along the way, for them, is just a bonus. OFf the top of my head, I can't think of many fast food restaurant chains that aren't publicly owned. They chose to keep it in the family instead of putting it on the market to earn MORE money.  This is not just business to them; it's ministry. Why would you go to work for a company like that if you're a Muslim or have some other beliefs that don't align with their values??? For that reason, the lawsuits don't move me.

[funkStrat_97]

Another point that crossed my mind late last night. I saw that they had 12 employment discrimination cases against them since 1988. 12 times in 24 years may be a lot. Or it may not be. I have no idea. I would have to compare the ratio to that of Wendy's, McDonalds, BK, Popeyes, KFC, etc. to see whether that's as bad as it sounds.

People ought to read their mission statement. I read it some time ago when having a debate with a friend about their Sunday closure. They are a Christian-owned company with Christian values and a truly Christian mission. Their mission isn't to get rich. It's almost like an ongoing Chicken Dinner Sale after church. Their mission is to earn money for the purpose of supporting Christian values and advance the cause of Christ. Earning money along the way, for them, is just a bonus. OFf the top of my head, I can't think of many fast food restaurant chains that aren't publicly owned. They chose to keep it in the family instead of putting it on the market to earn MORE money.  This is not just business to them; it's ministry. Why would you go to work for a company like that if you're a Muslim or have some other beliefs that don't align with their values??? For that reason, the lawsuits don't move me.

Chick-fil-A may be a ministry at heart, but legally it isn't...it's a for-profit business and as such is subject to the appropriate laws.  I agree that if I were of a different religious faith or an outright non-believer that it wouldn't make sense to want to work for an overtly Christian company, but even at that the company is walking a very fine line with its current policies.

[LaylaMonroe]

Chick-fil-A may be a ministry at heart, but legally it isn't...it's a for-profit business and as such is subject to the appropriate laws.  I agree that if I were of a different religious faith or an outright non-believer that it wouldn't make sense to want to work for an overtly Christian company, but even at that the company is walking a very fine line with its current policies.

Well they've made it abundantly clear that they don't discriminate on the basis of gender, race, creed, or sexual orientation, so they aren't in the habit of breaking laws. (Obviously I can't comment on the 12 lawsuits because I don't know anything about them). All I can say is that I would never go to work for a Muslim-owned company if I knew that it upheld Muslim values and expected compliance of its employees.

[funkStrat_97]

Well they've made it abundantly clear that they don't discriminate on the basis of gender, race, creed, or sexual orientation, so they aren't in the habit of breaking laws. (Obviously I can't comment on the 12 lawsuits because I don't know anything about them). All I can say is that I would never go to work for a Muslim-owned company if I knew that it upheld Muslim values and expected compliance of its employees.

Yeah....but....it's like they are (weather intentional or not) skirting the law.  I mean you obviously can't openly discriminate against people and thumb your nose at the law, but the corporate culture may make it uncomfortable for certain groups of people to be employed there.  While that technically may not break the law, it does leave an organization vulnerable to charges of discriminatory practices.

[betnich]

Slippery slope between private support/boycott of a group or company because of views or values (think of the brohaha over the Dixie Chicks' politics during the Bush presidency) and government sanctions because of same (as in city leaders' threatened denial of Chik-Fil-A building permits)

Questions -

Would you support or boycott a Muslim-run or owned business?
What if you knew and didn't like their views on women's rights, terrorism, the state of Israel or the Palestinians?
What about a business run by someone who didn't agree with your political platform?
Where does one draw the line?

[funkStrat_97]

If they view terrorism as okay, then I wouldn't feel bad about boycotting them because terrorism kills people.

Clearly, if a business is funding any sort of criminal activity, there really isn't any two ways about the issue.  But if it's funding something that you don't like and you feel strongly enough about it, then take your money elsewhere......or start your own (oh boy....I can see someone coming up with a chain of gay themed chicken joints......and probably be having the bomb fried chicken too)!

[LaylaMonroe]

Slippery slope between private support/boycott of a group or company because of views or values (think of the brohaha over the Dixie Chicks' politics during the Bush presidency) and government sanctions because of same (as in city leaders' threatened denial of Chik-Fil-A building permits)

Questions -

Would you support or boycott a Muslim-run or owned business?
What if you knew and didn't like their views on women's rights, terrorism, the state of Israel or the Palestinians?
What about a business run by someone who didn't agree with your political platform?
Where does one draw the line?

Maybe I should, but I just don't get that deep into what a company's philosophies and values are. I have no idea what Target stands for, but I spend a lot of money there. Same goes for Macy's, Pizza Hut, Publix, Nail Spa, Sula's Hair Salon, Office Depot, Comcast, Georgia Power, etc.... I don't know what any of them believe. But I still give them my money.

I guess if I was aware of problems with them, I might hesitate to patronize them, but I wouldn't go out of my way to investigate.

[malthumb]

Jonathan/Malthumb, Google led me to those same articles last night but I was too tired to comment. Two things: one, it wasn't Dan Cathy who said that, it was his father Truett. Two, as has been pointed out, that was 5 years ago so other doesn't have a lot to do with what's going on today (imo).

Agree that Truett's statement is NOT what touched off the current maelstrom.  But it does demonstrate a consistency of tone, so for that reason alone it is / will become relevant. .

[malthumb]

Gah where is the deductive reasoning of Solomon when you need it? This is so silly, and they're just looking for an excuse to shut down a Christian establishment.

12 cases in 24 years does not seem like a lot. But, I don't have anything to compare it to.

I find it funny that we're acting like this group with it's sinful agenda (we are clear that that's what it is, right?) should be expected to not be hypocritical, unfair, and hateful.

This very well could be the case.  And if it is, that makes it that much more important that CFA not mix business philosophy with religious doctrine.

[LaylaMonroe]

Agree that Truett's statement is NOT what touched off the current maelstrom.  But it does demonstrate a consistency of tone, so for that reason alone it is / will become relevant. .

Agreed.

[malthumb]

..... Why would you go to work for a company like that if you're a Muslim or have some other beliefs that don't align with their values??? For that reason, the lawsuits don't move me.

Survival.  Opportunity.  A couple examples:

• A lot of Detroit residents have been saved from illiteracy, life on the streets, homelessness, by enrolling in and successfully completing FocusHope's Machinist Training program and other vocational programs.  Some have gone back to work or volunteer at FocusHope.  FocusHope was founded by a Catholic priest and one of his parishioners and still holds to their central values.
• For several years, my kids attended a Quaker school.  Actually, the Obama girls attend the Washington branch of that school.  Anyway, some of the teachers at the Detroit school are Jewish.
• The Marriotts (hotel chain) are Mormon.  I'd venture to guess that most of their employees are not.
  

Granted, the differences between Baptist and Catholic or Presbyterian and Quaker  or Mormon and COGIC are not as wide as CFA family values and Muslim, but the point still remains.....you don't have to have the same social or religious values as your employer.  You just have to know how to get along with people.