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Gospel Instruments => Organ Room => Topic started by: pianomanbaby on August 16, 2007, 10:16:58 AM

Title: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: pianomanbaby on August 16, 2007, 10:16:58 AM
What do you think about this questions?
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 16, 2007, 10:19:13 AM
define "worldly".
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: pianomanbaby on August 16, 2007, 10:31:58 AM
By worldly music I mean like if you have been signed with a gospel record label and all of a sudden we catch you playing worldly music on the CD does it make it right or wrong. So should gospel musicians play worldly music or not?
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 16, 2007, 10:34:22 AM
What do you think about this questions?

I think it's just ONE question. :-\ :D
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: pianomanbaby on August 16, 2007, 10:47:21 AM
Wow this is a very simple question.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 16, 2007, 11:45:24 AM
no, what is "worldly?"

Lil Jon?

Chick Corea?

Isley brothers?

Gap Band?

James Brown?

Loofa Vandross?

Gershwin?

Irving Berlin?

Rodgers and Hammerstein?

Chalie Parker?


Or is it something that dont got "JESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESU S" all over it?
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: docjohn on August 16, 2007, 12:14:31 PM
What music ISN't wordly? WE all absorb and bring our past experiences into what we do.It's a heart issue,for example there' s a lot of music in church where JESUS  is an afterthought or a gimmick.Many profess CHRIST in music @ service,and NEVER mention HIM again-ESPECIALLy to the lost.who MIGHT benefit! Some annointed minstrels may HAVE to play less GODLY material to pay the freight.I play weddings and parties occasionally,never have asked for a dime to play for service, When i'm out in the world,gives me a chance to testify to those who REALLY need LORD. We have liberty in CHRIST;the balance is to walk the line as HE leads/allows.Very good question bro! simple but deep!!!   www.wayofthemaster.com
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 16, 2007, 12:16:48 PM
no, what is "worldly?"

Lil Jon?

Chick Corea?

Isley brothers?

Gap Band?

James Brown?

Loofa Vandross?

Gershwin?

Irving Berlin?

Rodgers and Hammerstein?

Chalie Parker?


Or is it something that dont got "JESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESUSJESU S" all over it?

Good questions. :D
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: pianomanbaby on August 16, 2007, 02:50:56 PM
Yes if its not a gospel artist then yes is worldly and other styles of music don't count I'm talking about yes Lil John, Snoop Dogg, Isley Brothers, etc....
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 16, 2007, 03:05:45 PM
so......

Mozart, is worldly.

Chuck Mangione is Worldly.

John Williams is worldly.

George gershwin is worldly.

Stravinsky is worldly.

Ravel is worldly.

Louie Armstrong is worldly.


AND.. what if I am saved, BUT im not a "gospel" artist? that is, the music that that I publish dont fit into the "gospel"
catagory?

I make this argument because we forget that there is other music besides "RnB, HipHop, and Rock"-the genres we use to point out that which we eschew. 
Music is a vast diaspora. It would be more accurate to mention certain songs, or even ceretain genres, but to use a blanket phrase IMO, is erroneous.

Yes we've talkied about this before, and I said it then, will say it now. Music cannot be easily boxed in.


still love ya tho. Now gimme five.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 16, 2007, 03:09:02 PM
so......

Mozart, is worldly.

Chuck Mangione is Worldly.

John Williams is worldly.

George gershwin is worldly.

Stravinsky is worldly.

Ravel is worldly.

Louie Armstrong is worldly.


AND.. what if I am saved, BUT im not a "gospel" artist? that is, the music that that I publish dont fit into the "gospel"
catagory?

I make this argument because we forget that there is other music besides "RnB, HipHop, and Rock"-the genres we use to point out that which we eschew. 
Music is a vast diaspora. It would be more accurate to mention certain songs, or even ceretain genres, but to use a blanket phrase IMO, is erroneous.

Yes we've talkied about this before, and I said it then, will say it now. Music cannot be easily boxed in.


still love ya tho. Now gimme five.


^5 ;) 8)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: MMCOGICboy on August 16, 2007, 03:15:33 PM
for my answer i will post a bulletin i got from Kevin Bond on myspace:

"As A Christian Should I Be Playing Worldly Music ?"

Greetings Friends,
I'm often asked questions that I believe will benefit the body if properly answered. Today I share my reply with you regarding one such question.


Greetings Chief,

What are your thoughts on 'Christian Musicians' on not-so Christian gigs? I'm sure you know exactly what I'm talking about. The whole.."I do this for a living mentality...", "...this is my job..." thing. I have personal thoughts and feelings about it. Fortunately I have been blessed to be playing for a Christian artist however, if a major R&B gig came along would I be wrong for taking it because I'm supposed to "come out from among them and be separate"?, or because "we are a peculiar people"?

I have always been intrigued by your insight...just curious as to what your thoughts are from a personal AND MORE IMPORTANTLY a biblical standpoint.

If the answer for this is too long to type..thats understandable. Some reference scriptures will be just fine.

Thanks,

Blogger




Greetings Blogger,
I'm familiar with all the scriptures and I urge you to study them IN PROPER CONTEXT, not just the words but the sustained meanings as well.

But here's the question. If we're God's body then how will they hear unless we go? For years preachers have bashed minstrels for doing what their name's applied. Minstrel: strolling musician who traveled about playing music.

The funny thing is that while they were bashing musicians for living out their call many of them were secretly plotting their own opportunities, or coveting the gift and the opportunities afforded the minstrels and psalmists. That's the reason why we see and have heard many of them change their message to do business and affect the community. It's because they too have come to realize that the greater gain both soul-wise and financially is not in the church but in the world. More church leaders have entered the worldly business sector than musicians of late. Thus the message has been tone down in a major way. It’s almost non-existent except in the fire and brimstone churches.

But I must add that one must be mature to be able to go into the world and compel men, or just to go and be light in the midst of darkness. Without the proper foundation one will succumb to sin and fall into lust and lewd behavior. So this arrangement must be prayerfully considered and one must know his/her limitations and spiritual state. The word states that If I'm IN Christ then I'm a new creature and the old has passed away and now my world is new. This speaks of the regeneration process wherein I'm no longer affected by my former worldly lusts. Bear in mind that the Godly process takes place immediately, but we must submit our total being to God in order for it to take place in us flesh-wise. So a proper relationship replete with study and the hearing of the word is paramount.

This has been and will always be hotspot in the body of Christ. But I choose to follow Christ' lead on this one. He said GO into all the world. Notice he didn't say Go into every tabernacle, synagogue, church, or temple. He urged us to get out of our comfort zones and meet the sinners where they are. After all how will we reach them if we don't know where they are and won't go where they are?

Most if not all say that I'm just doing it for the money. But I say, "Let MINISTRY be your GUIDE and MONEY will be GUIDED back to you to fund your ministry mission."

~BONDED~
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: 2tight on August 16, 2007, 04:25:49 PM
alot of gospel artists use the music from a rap and r:b song and put gospel lyrics.We should quit focusing on the music and just focus on the lyrics.

ex.a local artist here used beyonce' deja vu music and put gospel lyrics.

Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 16, 2007, 04:57:08 PM
alot of gospel artists use the music from a rap and r:b song and put gospel lyrics.We should quit focusing on the music and just focus on the lyrics.

ex.a local artist here used beyonce' deja vu music and put gospel lyrics.


I'd love for you to ask David or Saul about that. ::)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Ramar on August 16, 2007, 04:59:18 PM
I'm not sure whether you are talking about playing worldly music in church, or on a recording (Music album), but I am refering to playing in church. It totally depends on the individual's convictions and the spirit of the individual, and also the song that is being played... there are some people who play Lil Jon music in church with the intent of bringing the club atmosphere in the church. They might want to get the church "crunk", so they play that type of music... and the problem with that is that if you look around the church you will often see some of the young folks doing worldly dances, because that type of music teaches them that it is okay to do that... on the other hand... It can have advantages... I played R. Kelly's "happy people" in the church during offering.. and it helped usher in the spirit of joy in the church... people were gettin excited-both young and old... people began to praise God and get happy... and no--they weren't shaking their butts or doing worldly dances, they were standing and clapping, shouting and praising God- I played the song in the right spirit- I wanted to spread joy, besides the song is not vulgar at all, nor does it have any sexually explicit or offensive lyrics. But as I stated before it depends on the individuals convictions-- some people can do it without feeling bad, and some people's conscience wont allow it. Also we must be sensitive to others in the church... If there are some in the church that are offended, and you know that they are offended, then please don't do it-- you are sewing discord among the people, and that's not what Christians are to do
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Ramar on August 16, 2007, 05:20:27 PM
I apologize, i did not answer your question correctly... I just read where you talked about if a person was signed to a record label and released a CD...

But my reply is this:

The thing about music is that it has the power to evoke emotion-- It can make you cry or laugh, it can make you cheerful or depressed, it can make you angry or any other type of emotion. The spirit and feelings of an individual can be captured in a few chords or in a simple melody... there are often times where worldly musicians will play just the right notes to give a gospel artist the chills... ( I ain't the only one in here who loved the "circle of life" from the Lion King)... those very chords/melody may be exactly what the artist needs to get his message across... Believe it or not, it IS possible to listen to worldly music just because of the music and not the words... it's not possible for everybody but it is possible for many... often times, myself included, people listen to worldly music and just wish it were made for gospel-- we can even come up with the perfect lyrics, the perfect harmonies, and ideas for the song that would just blow the original song out the water!!!! So when an artist does play a bar or two of a worldly song, don't blast him/her... it may have been exactly what the musician needed to express himself/herself... and if it does offend you-- remember... you DON'T HAVE to listen to it... it may not be for you, it could be for someone else to listen to and feel the power of God!!! God Bless You!!!
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Julie spivey on August 17, 2007, 06:15:22 AM
Food for thought.....Does it give God the Glory? Would you consider this song or another if Jesus was on the front row and this was your last curtain call...
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: jgause2 on August 17, 2007, 09:49:24 AM
so if i wanted to write/ compose like for example wedding songs  for married couples, or songs of love (for married couples).....would that be considered worldly too???   
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 10:26:57 AM
so if i wanted to write/ compose like for example wedding songs  for married couples, or songs of love (for married couples).....would that be considered worldly too???   


It would be; but, I believe that you'd be ok, because your audience is married couples. Now, that's just ME talkin'.


I think the above poster said it best, does it bring glory to God, either directly (via you) or indirectly (meaning that your purpose is to meet a need of the people you're serving i.e. writing love songs for married couples; writing movie scores; etc).
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Ramar on August 17, 2007, 10:59:52 AM
I feel that too often Gospel artists and "church folk" feel that they are beyond the things of this life. As long as we are in this world, we will have to face "worldly" issues. There is nothing wrong with writing love songs for married people... It's apart of life. We often forget that some of life's issues can cause a person to go astray from God and fall. Marriage is a perfect example. Love is from God, and there is no denying that certain "non-gospel" love songs can create certain emotions such as love. There is nothing wrong with that... The Bible does instruct husbands to love their wives, and vice-versa. Love songs (not sex songs, people!!!!....) can create certain moods that are necessary for a married couple to express their love... once again love is from God and is present whether the artist chooses to acknowledge God or not. Just because a song doesn't have JESUS-JESUS-JESUS all over it does not mean that that it is wrong. When a man talks to his wife about paying bills does his conversation have "Jesus" in every sentence? I doubt it. Love songs are usually a reflection of what is going on through the artists mind and what's in his heart at that time. And you'd be lying to me if you said that Jesus was on your mind 24/7
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 11:07:12 AM
I feel that too often Gospel artists and "church folk" feel that they are beyond the things of this life. As long as we are in this world, we will have to face "worldly" issues. There is nothing wrong with writing love songs for married people... It's apart of life. We often forget that some of life's issues can cause a person to go astray from God and fall. Marriage is a perfect example. Love is from God, and there is no denying that certain "non-gospel" love songs can create certain emotions such as love. There is nothing wrong with that... The Bible does instruct husbands to love their wives, and vice-versa. Love songs (not sex songs, people!!!!....) can create certain moods that are necessary for a married couple to express their love... once again love is from God and is present whether the artist chooses to acknowledge God or not. Just because a song doesn't have JESUS-JESUS-JESUS all over it does not mean that that it is wrong. When a man talks to his wife about paying bills does his conversation have "Jesus" in every sentence? I doubt it. Love songs are usually a reflection of what is going on through the artists mind and what's in his heart at that time. And you'd be lying to me if you said that Jesus was on your mind 24/7

You make interesting points. If I may, I suggest trying to separate those points with a little thing I like to call, "The Paragraph" ;) :D
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Ramar on August 17, 2007, 11:10:56 AM
thank you... I'll try that
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: PianoWizard on August 17, 2007, 11:30:11 AM
To be honest it’s a judgement call. Just recently a friend of mine who is not a Christian asked me if I could be involved on his CD that he is making. He is singing "WORLDLY MUSIC", I was wondering wither or not I should do this.

PianoWiz...
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Rev_G on August 17, 2007, 12:39:09 PM
Hello again. First of all we must understand music as a universal language. It is not catagorilized untill you put words to it. Even tho there are instumentals that are in a catagory. If I play boom-chuck-boom,boom chuck on my drums, am I playing jazz, blues, religious, country, rock, heavy metal, RnB, hip hop, top 40? Well yes and no. It may fall in a catagory but it is just a beat. The old "flashlight" bass line from Parlament if speeded up can be found in praise music. The beat of George Benson's "on Broadway" can be found in a lot of music! So because the chords progression reminds you of a worldy song doesn't mean you are playing worldly music. You are using your skill. Anyone that took music lessons didn't learn only religious, country, rock or hip hop. You learned chords and progressions. Minors, majors, flats and sharps. The music to Mary Mary's "Yesterday" if you think about it can be blues or jazz. But because of the words, it is religious. (I say religious because the gospel is preached. it is not sung or music. read your Bibles) and to the Gentleman who does wedding music, in my opinion it is GODLY music because hopefully the words you write and if the couple sings it to each other is just expressing words or their vow to each other in song. Be blessed! 
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: 2tight on August 17, 2007, 03:34:58 PM

I'd love for you to ask David or Saul about that. ::)

I would love to ask them that question.I played sean paul gimme the light while the youth choir was singing im walking by donniw mcCLurkin.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: nessalynn77 on August 17, 2007, 03:43:28 PM
alot of gospel artists use the music from a rap and r:b song and put gospel lyrics.We should quit focusing on the music and just focus on the lyrics.

ex.a local artist here used beyonce' deja vu music and put gospel lyrics.


We can't quit focusing on the music.  The music is a part of the ministry, it all needs to be holy and acceptable to God.  I also submit that people in the congregation who had prior "affiliations" with certain songs that are completely unlike God in content, would have a problem worshipping to the same familiar song, even if the words were different.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 04:22:19 PM
We can't quit focusing on the music.  The music is a part of the ministry, it all needs to be holy and acceptable to God.  I also submit that people in the congregation who had prior "affiliations" with certain songs that are completely unlike God in content, would have a problem worshipping to the same familiar song, even if the words were different.


Exactamundo.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Ramar on August 17, 2007, 05:34:53 PM
We can't quit focusing on the music.  The music is a part of the ministry, it all needs to be holy and acceptable to God.  I also submit that people in the congregation who had prior "affiliations" with certain songs that are completely unlike God in content, would have a problem worshipping to the same familiar song, even if the words were different.

Some music/songs ain't for everybody... God deals with each of us accordingly. There are some songs that might be just what a particular person needs to hear. Everybody doesn't worship to the same music. Just because a song may not be acceptable unto you does not mean that God won't accept it. Unless the actual song/music is in direct opposition to God... there is nothing wrong with it.

I do feel that if you are going to use a familiar tune, you should change the words completely. For example don't be up there singin Michael Jackson's "Thriller" and the only thing you change is the words from "This is the thriller" to "He can deliver"... you gonna have people moonwalkin all over the church!!!!
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 17, 2007, 06:49:13 PM
i resign it to a question that cannot and should not be globally answered. Its an individual thing.


I remember listening to Israel's Christmas CD. (it is the TROOF by the way) and as a musician, i was like WHOA......

I heard a lil' Luther, MJ, a LOT of classic soul in there. he really showed his "musician" roots. 

some folk would have an issue with it. I dont.

One must do what is right for them(and according to the word). And execpt it be written in black and white(and in some versions, red) skripchah, what's right for you may not be wright for another.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 07:08:45 PM
i resign it to a question that cannot and should not be globally answered. Its an individual thing.


I remember listening to Israel's Christmas CD. (it is the TROOF by the way) and as a musician, i was like WHOA......

I heard a lil' Luther, MJ, a LOT of classic soul in there. he really showed his "musician" roots. 

some folk would have an issue with it. I dont.

One must do what is right for them(and according to the word). And execpt it be written in black and white(and in some versions, red) skripchah, what's right for you may not be wright for another.


That ideology doesn't work in a corporate setting.  ;)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 17, 2007, 07:14:49 PM
Are you referencing "corporate" as in group of people as in "in church?"
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 07:21:51 PM
Are you referencing "corporate" as in group of people as in "in church?"


Both
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 17, 2007, 07:24:21 PM
ok, I'll agree on the corporate issue, which is contingent upon the "house", as im sure i couldnt play "cross movement" in my church.

My defence is usually like i said, for the individual.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 07:28:33 PM
ok, I'll agree on the corporate issue, which is contingent upon the "house", as im sure i couldnt play "cross movement" in my church.

My defence is usually like i said, for the individual.


I can understand your defense. I'm always thinking corporately when this question arises. It's one of the reasons there's so much 'fluff' in the church now.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 17, 2007, 07:48:33 PM

I can understand your defense. I'm always thinking corporately when this question arises. It's one of the reasons there's so much 'fluff' in the church now.

Defence=british variant of defense. :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P
Its that Jamaican thing. We speak the King's english.


When it comes to the church, I take the position of a servant of the house, that is, ministering to the need of the people. If the demographic is older, i aint gonna bust out with Tye Tribbet's "Victory".

If the demographic is younger, mebbe more contemporary. But I'm aware of the fact that someone hearing a certain song could hinder them. In the church building, it aint my call. I's lets the H.S. do what He do.

But in Wolfy Tabernacle, where D.A. Wolfman is chief prelate, thats a different story.

(altho, we're supposed to do isreal's "who is like the Lord" in a few weeks, wonder how the "California Love"(which is really Joe Cocker's "woman to woman") section's gonna go over....:D)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 17, 2007, 08:26:18 PM
Defence=british variant of defense. :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P
Its that Jamaican thing. We speak the King's english.


When it comes to the church, I take the position of a servant of the house, that is, ministering to the need of the people. If the demographic is older, i aint gonna bust out with Tye Tribbet's "Victory".

If the demographic is younger, mebbe more contemporary. But I'm aware of the fact that someone hearing a certain song could hinder them. In the church building, it aint my call. I's lets the H.S. do what He do.

But in Wolfy Tabernacle, where D.A. Wolfman is chief prelate, thats a different story.

(altho, we're supposed to do isreal's "who is like the Lord" in a few weeks, wonder how the "California Love"(which is really Joe Cocker's "woman to woman") section's gonna go over....:D)


Depends on how long you play it.  ;)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: angiey on August 17, 2007, 10:20:15 PM
I would say to you that the only thing that makes music worldly is the
lyrics that are put to them. Because without the words how do you interpet the meaning?
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: keysarerare on August 18, 2007, 12:06:46 AM
Its very funny in you answering asking that statement.  Its a good topic to discuss.  At times, that thought comes across my mind; other times, I hear older people saying they are briging the world into the church.  However, we have to look into the true meaning of music and how our playing and musical selections will enhance an edify our worship services.  We can ask is music "sin"? No.   I dont think its the music.  Music itself is music. To me its like energy; it can not be created or destoryed.  The notes are the same like if I were to play a selection in the key of A flat in the church and then play in one of Michael Jackson's song in A flat, four flats in A flat scale doesn't change.

Another thing, during praise services, the music is at an upbeat, high volume, and very intensified (focusing on the music rhythm )...the members are dancing, rolling on the floor, juming, crying, lifting up hands, and giving the highest praises to God, could one call that worldly music  or church music.  On the otherhand, If play at a BB King concert and people are doing the same thing, there.  Could one call that worldly music or church music?  So I must conclude that there is no such thing as worldly music, but there is a such thing as taking music and transforming it to the world standpoint. 

So to all musicians play to the glory of God where He may bless the church through your playing.

I hope this will be an aid in answering your question.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 18, 2007, 01:30:59 AM
Funny that you use BB King as an example, as the "blues" and "gospel" share many scale types. (all comes from the same root.)


I think the question was moreso directed at a musician personally, in regard to what HE/SHE plays, as many musician when it comes to the church play what the church requires.(or should)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: 2tight on August 19, 2007, 07:19:12 AM
We can't quit focusing on the music.  The music is a part of the ministry, it all needs to be holy and acceptable to God.  I also submit that people in the congregation who had prior "affiliations" with certain songs that are completely unlike God in content, would have a problem worshipping to the same familiar song, even if the words were different.

u r right.it is  up to the indiviual if the want to play worldly music or not.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: musiqisme26 on August 19, 2007, 08:00:06 AM
why has no one mentioned the ministers wether the pastor or the singer who enlist the non-gospel artist. how many times have i seen kelly price, faith evans, lil' mo, brian mcknight, r. kelly, steve harvey and whoever else either record or appear with gospel artist and pastors.

lets not forget the mase debacle

however how does your job in corporate america working for a company that funds things that are not of God and/or not even allow you to pray or read your bible while on the clock allow you to be better off than you dismissing a chance to do music cuz its not considered "GOSPEL".

I also never read in the bible that when Jesus picked his 12 he told them to stop doing their "WORLDLY" jobs, keep in mind one was a tax collector and another was a lawyer
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 19, 2007, 09:15:57 AM
I also never read in the bible that when Jesus picked his 12 he told them to stop doing their "WORLDLY" jobs, keep in mind one was a tax collector and another was a lawyer


Matthew 4

The Calling of the First Disciples
 18 As Jesus was walking beside the Sea of Galilee, he saw two brothers, Simon called Peter and his brother Andrew. They were casting a net into the lake, for they were fishermen. 19 "Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men." 20 At once they left their nets and followed him.

 21 Going on from there, he saw two other brothers, James son of Zebedee and his brother John. They were in a boat with their father Zebedee, preparing their nets. Jesus called them, 22 and immediately they left the boat and their father and followed him.


Matthew 8

21 Another disciple said to him, "Lord, first let me go and bury my father."

22 But Jesus told him, "Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead."


It's implied, bruh. ;)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: musiqisme26 on August 19, 2007, 12:19:41 PM

Matthew 4

The Calling of the First Disciples
 18 As Jesus was walking beside the Sea of Galilee, he saw two brothers, Simon called Peter and his brother Andrew. They were casting a net into the lake, for they were fishermen. 19 "Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men." 20 At once they left their nets and followed him.

 21 Going on from there, he saw two other brothers, James son of Zebedee and his brother John. They were in a boat with their father Zebedee, preparing their nets. Jesus called them, 22 and immediately they left the boat and their father and followed him.


Matthew 8

21 Another disciple said to him, "Lord, first let me go and bury my father."

22 But Jesus told him, "Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead."


It's implied, bruh. ;)


Your taking it out of context. After they cast down their nets did they not use them again to fish for the fish of the sea. You picked out verses that regarding going out to save souls. I stand firm that never were there any specific instruction on what job a man or woman should have but how we should conduct ourselves with the things we choose to do.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: mellowone on August 19, 2007, 01:21:23 PM
Your taking it out of context. After they cast down their nets did they not use them again to fish for the fish of the sea. You picked out verses that regarding going out to save souls. I stand firm that never were there any specific instruction on what job a man or woman should have but how we should conduct ourselves with the things we choose to do.

I agrre with you first of all.  Even though they picked up their nets They still had to be seperate we do things that are carnal all the time but that doesn't mean we are going to the lake. We eat that is carnal but even though we are spirtiual we still need to eat to satisfy our fleshly bodies so we won't starve. We work because we need a place to live and we need food. So even though there are carnal things that are needed that doesn't dismiss the fact that some things have to be different.
leviticus 10:10

10And that ye may put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean;
we know the story of nadab and abihu that is the scripture that distincts what us as saints of the most hi should do.

So not all music can be used their are some things that need to stay where they are.
will music evolve yes it has been doing it for eons, but also keep in mind Deuteronomy12:30
 
30Take heed to thyself that thou be not snared by following them, after that they be destroyed from before thee; and that thou enquire not after their gods, saying, How did these nations serve their gods? even so will I do likewise.

So we should not look at the world and say this is working for them let us use it for us

Also Joshua24:14  states what was going on in egypt they served other gods and he told them to leave those gods that you served in egypt alone while isreal was in egypt

14Now therefore fear the LORD, and serve him in sincerity and in truth: and put away the gods which your fathers served on the other side of the flood, and in Egypt; and serve ye the LORD.

When we get delivered from the world those things that were there need to stay there why 2 Corinthians 5:17

Thats what i think yall might agree and might not but thats cool

Mellowone From Louisville Ky out

Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 19, 2007, 07:10:32 PM
Your taking it out of context. After they cast down their nets did they not use them again to fish for the fish of the sea. You picked out verses that regarding going out to save souls. I stand firm that never were there any specific instruction on what job a man or woman should have but how we should conduct ourselves with the things we choose to do.


Show me in the Bible where they went BACK to fishing, tax collecting, and winning cases. ::) ;)

I don't think it's a matter of taking it out of context, I think you may be making it a matter of semantics. ;) :D


On the other hand, I COMPLETELY agree with the underlined statement. We are the salt of the earth, and we are set apart. We can't just live in our little cocoons and expect to win the lost.

I believe it can be summed up this way: It's NOT what we do, it's HOW we do it. ;) :D
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: keyz28 on August 20, 2007, 12:04:13 AM
im not really goin to entertain this topic..... but i will leave u with a scripture that came to mind when i saw this topic.......... its in 1 John 2:15 
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Bruh Kell on August 20, 2007, 03:14:58 PM
2 cents.....

Music is ministry.......

.........just like attitude
.........just like clothing
.........just like speech
.........just like every day life living

The question is what are you saying with your music?
If your music is uplifting/promoting something sinful then you're in the wrong. If your music is uplifting good things then you're fine.

Listen carefully.....I'm engaged to a beautiful woman AND IF I WANNA SING HER UP A GOOD FEELIN' SAYIN "BABY BABY I LOVE YOU" AINT NOBODY GON' CONVINCE ME THAT I'M WRONG FOR IT
After all if the Lord done blessed you wit' somebody, ya s'posed to ac' like he done blessed you!!!!
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: SupremeSaltine on August 21, 2007, 12:59:47 AM
Unless all you're doing is "moanin'" all modern gospel music is worldly.

Where do you want to start it? At slave songs? Bach Chorales?

Every generation of gospel musicians absorbs the "worldly" music of the generation before.  If you think gospel is not affected by jazz and r&b then you have not been paying attention.  "These kids today............."

I play at a church.   I also play in bars.  I make money as a musician.  Big deal.  There's nothing that says that the organist has to be poor. 

/hates gospel hip-hop
//just another way to kill off real musicians
///slashies are fun on the gospel organ board

Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: TheReturn on August 21, 2007, 02:15:51 AM
WELL I LOOK AT IT LIKE THIS, IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU HOLD TO BE TRUE. ITS TIME TO QUIT TRIPPING OFF OF WHAT OTHER PEOPLE SAY BECAUSE, OTHER PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA DECIDE ON IF YOUR MAKING IT TO HEAVEN OR NOT.

I TRULY BELEIVE THAT I CAN PLAY "WORLDLY" AND STILL LIVE SAVED. GOING ON TOUR WITH JAY-Z, FLOETRY, JILL SCOTT, ect ISN'T ANY DIFFERENT THAN BEING EMPLOYED BY A CARNIVAL CRUISE LINE TO PLAY SOME JAMACAN AND JAZZ STANDARDS. (ya fell me?)

IT'S ALL ABOUT HOW STRONG YOUR RELATIONSHIP IS WITH GOD. SOME PEOPLE TRY TO SAY " Well, how could you go any play for someone that's promoting sin and death? " WELL FIRSTLY IF IM A RAPPER; I'M NOT PUTTING A GUN TO THE WHOLE CROWD'S HEAD AND TELLING THEM TO "BOUNCE TO THIS BEAT" OR  "REPEAT AFTER ME" ect. PEOPLE HAVE MINDS OF THEIR OWN. THEY'RE CHOOSING TO SIN. AND JUST BECAUSE I'M PROVIDING THE BACKBEAT FOR SOMEONE TO SAY CERTAIN THINGS DOESN'T MAKE ME WRONG EITHER.

EVERYTHING THAT PEOPLE DO, THEY DO IT BECAUSE OF THE CHOOSES THAT MAKE.
IF THEY SAY "Well it's hard for me not to dance when I hear that snap music or the crunk beat" THEY SHOULD BE AT THE CONCERT ANYWAY. (ya dig)

BASICALLY ALL I'M SAYING IS, EVERYTHING IS ABOUT THE CHOICES THAT PEOPLE MAKE ON THEIR OWN. NO ONE CAN MAKE SOMEONE DO SOMETHING.




CATRON/TheReturn
HOLLA
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: chi_townz_bmg on August 21, 2007, 09:38:46 AM
Quick and to the point... I am music director for a church and I have a secular band.  If we look at the definition of secular, we find it says "not pertaining to or connected with religion" (dictionary.com). There are many things we "ALL" do in life that are secular.  Going to work everyday does not pertain to religion. Is going to public school and obtaining an education against the word of God, it's a secular setting????  Paying your electric bill, buying SUV's and attending BBQ's are not pertaining to or connected with religion.  Basically, everything that falls under the umbrella of "secular" is not bad or against God.  Christian people fall in love too.  So is a song about love and expressing your love for one woman or man (depending on your correct status male/female) against the principles of God? I'm not out there playing 50 Cents, R. Kelly, LiL John, Metallica, Marylin Manson, etc... But Lou Rawls, Sammy Davis Jr, Beethoven, Bach, Gershwin, etc... are not being explicit or over the top.  Love is an emotion that God created, deomonstrates and meant for us all to experience. Materials of a sexual connotation, drugs, calling women out of turn, homosexuality, gang and violence are a totally different story! Those are secular activities that oppose the word of God.

Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: sjonathan02 on August 21, 2007, 10:06:03 AM
Quick and to the point... I am music director for a church and I have a secular band.  If we look at the definition of secular, we find it says "not pertaining to or connected with religion" (dictionary.com). There are many things we "ALL" do in life that are secular.  Going to work everyday does not pertain to religion. Is going to public school and obtaining an education against the word of God, it's a secular setting????  Paying your electric bill, buying SUV's and attending BBQ's are not pertaining to or connected with religion.  Basically, everything that falls under the umbrella of "secular" is not bad or against God.  Christian people fall in love too.  So is a song about love and expressing your love for one woman or man (depending on your correct status male/female) against the principles of God? I'm not out there playing 50 Cents, R. Kelly, LiL John, Metallica, Marylin Manson, etc... But Lou Rawls, Sammy Davis Jr, Beethoven, Bach, Gershwin, etc... are not being explicit or over the top.  Love is an emotion that God created, deomonstrates and meant for us all to experience. Materials of a sexual connotation, drugs, calling women out of turn, homosexuality, gang and violence are a totally different story! Those are secular activities that oppose the word of God.


What you're saying, although it's all bunched together ::), is what Wolfman first asked, "What do you mean by 'worldly'?"

There are songs that promote love in a positive manner and there are songs that don't. Where we get it twisted is trying to lump it all together. You can't.

It's about the heart, always has been.  ;)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: chi_townz_bmg on August 21, 2007, 11:09:10 AM
Sorry about it being bunched up... but I'm actually doing this from work and was rapidly typing  :)
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: Wolfram on August 22, 2007, 11:55:06 AM
The day the faithful embrace the need to pay their musicians for the musical services they provide and embrace the fact that Gospel music is a business just like everything else and has bills to be paid, the day this happens is the day you will see fewer and fewer of us Christian players needing to outsource our talents to the secular music world to put food on the table. It is next to impossible to survive on what the faithful is willing to support as far as music goes.  If music is you livelihood, you will starve and your kids will be running around nekkid... ;D

Ladies, don't let your children gro up to be musicians... or cowboys for that matter...  hehe.

W
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: musiqisme26 on August 22, 2007, 01:51:28 PM
The day the faithful embrace the need to pay their musicians for the musical services they provide and embrace the fact that Gospel music is a business just like everything else and has bills to be paid, the day this happens is the day you will see fewer and fewer of us Christian players needing to outsource our talents to the secular music world to put food on the table. It is next to impossible to survive on what the faithful is willing to support as far as music goes.  If music is you livelihood, you will starve and your kids will be running around nekkid... ;D

Ladies, don't let your children gro up to be musicians... or cowboys for that matter...  hehe.

W


Im glad the churches some of us attend dont collect money to pay to "Worldly" or "Secular" companies (electric, gas, phone) so that they can worship without any involvement for something or someone who is "Worldly"

may be one day i will see it, might be the day where tithes and offering are given as they should be
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: THE WOLFMAN on August 22, 2007, 01:58:37 PM
Mane, i was just thinkin that on the way home. I dont recall seein any "christian" banks or utility companies.
Title: Re: Gospel Musicians Playing Worldy Music
Post by: TheReturn on September 14, 2007, 10:35:02 AM
Mane, i was just thinkin that on the way home. I dont recall seein any "christian" banks or utility companies.


YOU BETTER PREACH IT REV.


HOLLA
CATRON/TheReturn