LearnGospelMusic.com Community
Gospel Instruments => Gospel Keyboard / Piano => Topic started by: diverse379 on July 15, 2008, 06:34:57 AM
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the task of playing in every key can be daunting
especially when you take so much effort getting all those phat crazy passes and runs down in one key
now you have to learn them 11 more times in 11 more positions
you have to over come muscle memory
its like solving a puzzle a difficult puzzle
well here is a suggestion that may help some of you with this dillema
and it really isnt too hard
do it one key at a time
what do I mean?
ask any musician church musician that is
9 times out of 10 they will tell you there favorite key is either Ab or Db
or C or F
the first answer Ab or Db will be more contemporary musicians
the second answer will come from more traditional players
probe them further they will tell you
they like Eb and Bb as well
rarely will you hear Gb B E or A unless they are israel fans or former blues players
so if the average church musician without really trying will become proficient in 6
keys
and this is without trying
because these keys represent where most gospel songs are written
and there is a similarity
Ab and Db are similar
and Bb is similar to Eb
eb is similar to Ab
so somehow a natural progression develops that enables a musician who plays enough to develop a certain amount of proficiency in these 6 keys
oh I forgot how F and C come into the mix
well C is so easy to see so most people teach moves in C
and most people start out learning lean on me in
c
F is the key that amazing grace is taught and written so F is a good hymn key
so that being said
what would happen if you just learn how to play in what ever key appears one half step up or down from the key you are in
up one down one
I learned this concept before but it was up till now that I realize the importance and the genius of the concept
if you love the key of Db
and you learn all your songs in D natural as well right along with the Db
then D will eventually become just as easy to play as Db
and you automatically have a modulation at your fingertips
if you learn down one
then C will become as familiar and you can start in C and modulate twice
you have now set the foundation to master three keys
remember I said most musicians who play in Db will also learn in Ab
well when you go to Ab
learn in A as well
and in G
now you have mastered 6 keys and you havent even gotten to Eb Bb
F and C
it is inevitable that you will have to learn at least one or two songs in Eb
and if you are going to play some hymns you will be learning a few in the key of F
with that you will have mastered all the keys
one key at a time
first go up one
then go down one
that is all it takes
start today
it is never too late
up one down one
make this your mantra
up one down one
say it with me
up one down one
up one down one ..............................
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Thanks so much D, this is good advice. I have to ask though, why is Db the favorite keys for most contemporary musicians? Before i started with the GospelKeys DVDs, C was my favorite key. Now its C#/ Db. Then Gb. Even i cannot tell why i like Db, i just do.
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Thanks so much D, this is good advice. I have to ask though, why is Db the favorite keys for most contemporary musicians? Before i started with the GospelKeys DVDs, C was my favorite key. Now its C#/ Db. Then Gb. Even i cannot tell why i like Db, i just do.
I would be lying if I told you I know the answer for that question I can only tell you why I like it
the first song I learned that meant anything to me was in Db
it was battlefield by norman hutchins
and it was the funkiest song I knew and I patterned everything after that song
next was total praise so between those two songs Db became a strong key for me
funny because one of my first gospel songs was oh when the saints I learned that in C
and I learned my first group of devotional songs in the key of F
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Thanks so much Diverse..
I like the concept you are teaching here, as informal as it might seem.
I actually learnt like this :D 8)
I started off in Gb..but then I realized that I couldnt modulate...& when I was asking people about their worse keys, I'd get responses of G, A etc..So I told myself I was going to learn all the keys that people around me shy away from.
I also did the half step up & down connection..I had a bit of Ab stuff since half the people around me played in that key.
SO I learnt G & it became my 2nd fav 8) Now I could connect from Gb to Ab.
I decided to learn F since it was a half step below my fav..
I then moved on to Eb since it felt a whole lot like Ab to me..
I also went to Bb because it felt alot like F.
I went to Db & B because they felt like Gb..
Along came the others.
Fenix:
Db is not my fav, but for talk music I find myself playing in that key if not B because the key uses all the black notes & it just feels way more natural for my fingers to play on "all black" notes...allowing for easy sliding "on top"..
I don't know about others.
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so that being said
what would happen if you just learn how to play in what ever key appears one half step up or down from the key you are in
up one down one
I learned this concept before but it was up till now that I realize the importance and the genius of the concept
if you love the key of Db
and you learn all your songs in D natural as well right along with the Db
then D will eventually become just as easy to play as Db
and you automatically have a modulation at your fingertips
if you learn down one
then C will become as familiar and you can start in C and modulate twice
you have now set the foundation to master three keys
up one down one
make this your mantra
up one down one
say it with me
up one down one
up one down one ..............................
Now that's some simple, yet powerful advice right there.
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D!!!!! This is amazing. The only sad thing about this is that I just logged on and I see more people viewed how to play a Tye song rather than play in every key. IMHO, i think it should be the other way around, I'm not saying that I'm not into Tye or his music, (Born and raised in Philly i've seen him plenty of times). Trust me when I tell you, we as minstrels, we should strive to learn every key. I was just talking with one of Tye's musicians last night and he told me how you get more respect for playing a hymn in every key, than to play an entire cd just like someone. When you strive to play in every key, you open up your own creativity. Rather than just the way that an immature musician thinks (head and not heart). We don't need another Mike Bereal or John Peters, or PJ Morgan, Jamal, Jermaine, Sebastian. What we need are innovators that will challenge our musical minds to think musically outside the box. I'm not saying that i don't like the DVD's I have them as well, but I truly think that we need to dig deep and re-invent ourselves.
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D!!!!! This is amazing. The only sad thing about this is that I just logged on and I see more people viewed how to play a Tye song rather than play in every key. IMHO, i think it should be the other way around, I'm not saying that I'm not into Tye or his music, (Born and raised in Philly i've seen him plenty of times). Trust me when I tell you, we as minstrels, we should strive to learn every key. I was just talking with one of Tye's musicians last night and he told me how you get more respect for playing a hymn in every key, than to play an entire cd just like someone. When you strive to play in every key, you open up your own creativity. Rather than just the way that an immature musician thinks (head and not heart). We don't need another Mike Bereal or John Peters, or PJ Morgan, Jamal, Jermaine, Sebastian. What we need are innovators that will challenge our musical minds to think musically outside the box. I'm not saying that i don't like the DVD's I have them as well, but I truly think that we need to dig deep and re-invent ourselves.
I wouldn't mind having you as my friend..
______minds think alike ;D
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D!!!!! This is amazing. The only sad thing about this is that I just logged on and I see more people viewed how to play a Tye song rather than play in every key. IMHO, i think it should be the other way around, I'm not saying that I'm not into Tye or his music, (Born and raised in Philly i've seen him plenty of times). Trust me when I tell you, we as minstrels, we should strive to learn every key. I was just talking with one of Tye's musicians last night and he told me how you get more respect for playing a hymn in every key, than to play an entire cd just like someone. When you strive to play in every key, you open up your own creativity. Rather than just the way that an immature musician thinks (head and not heart). We don't need another Mike Bereal or John Peters, or PJ Morgan, Jamal, Jermaine, Sebastian. What we need are innovators that will challenge our musical minds to think musically outside the box. I'm not saying that i don't like the DVD's I have them as well, but I truly think that we need to dig deep and re-invent ourselves.
this is truly inspiring stuff
I like the quote you get more respect for playing a hymn in every key thatn playing an entire cd just like someone
playing in every key opens up your creativity
I like what you say
I dont agree that dvds encourage us to be like others
but I do agree that playing in every key opens us up as musicians
but when we look at monsters like john petersor pj morgan
and some of the other musicians on these dvds
we get a chance to learn from a top performer
the danger which is what I think you are trying to say is that we are just imitating and not finding our own voice.
interesting
I look forward to reading more of your posts
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Same Here..... I'm with that!!!!!
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This is good stuff. Thanks a lot.
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HEY D...EVERYTHING YOU SAID IS TRUE I LEARNED HOW TO PLAY IN ALL KEY EXCEPT B,A,E....ALL THE REST I KNEW I LEARNED HOW TO PLAY OUT OF ALL OF THEM BUT Eb IS BEGINNING TO BE MY FAVORITE KEY...BUT IM STILL LEARNING NEW THINGS IN THE REST OF THEM AS I LEARN MORE SONGS AND DIFFERENT RUNS LICKS AND TRICKS....BUT THANKS 4 DA ADVICE...MUCH LOVE AND RESPECT TO ALL MY FOLLOW MUSICIANS INCLUDING MY DAD AND MY COUSIN....
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HEY D...EVERYTHING YOU SAID IS TRUE I LEARNED HOW TO PLAY IN ALL KEY EXCEPT B,A,E....ALL THE REST I KNEW I LEARNED HOW TO PLAY OUT OF ALL OF THEM BUT Eb IS BEGINNING TO BE MY FAVORITE KEY...BUT IM STILL LEARNING NEW THINGS IN THE REST OF THEM AS I LEARN MORE SONGS AND DIFFERENT RUNS LICKS AND TRICKS....BUT THANKS 4 DA ADVICE...MUCH LOVE AND RESPECT TO ALL MY FOLLOW MUSICIANS INCLUDING MY DAD AND MY COUSIN....
Ha! So it's a family affair ;D your dad & cuz also play?
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yup my cuz and dad my inspiration
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Awesome 8)
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This is some very good stuff INDEED!!!
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I grew up in smallville USA….no players at all, I went to a pipe organist for 3 lessons, just to learn what key I was in(slow learner right?). I started on organ at 14, and could chord 2 hands in Eflat nearly immediately, but play nothing else(I mean zilch) in other keys…Aflat, and Bflat came next. I grew up cogic, so I used those 3 keys for congregational (of course all shouts in Aflat). At 16, a shift came to my life we started doing “worship” music, So I picked up Dflat and F, I grew in those keys, and then one day at 18 while fooling around Bnatural and F#opened up to me. 19 years I ventured and played for a Baptist church, so I learned C for hymns, and tune up chords. So for many years, E,A,D,G were my weak or non existent keys. A white brother came from an Assembly of God to sit under me ( I was MOM). He led worship from the guitar, so of course I picked up E, A. I then figured why settle at good enough, so I took on the challenge, and worked(and am still working) with my fluency in D & G. I’m 33, and play more piano than organ now, but F# major is actually my favorite key, prophetically Eflat minor, Bflat minor, and A natural has great clarity to me. I prefer to play in B, over Bflat major, I prefer E over F …and I prefer A natural over G. Funny thing is 20 years ago I played EVERY song in Eflat…..now, it’s like I avoid it, I typically don’t play in it, unless someone is singing in it(except Eflat minor)
I don’t have perfect pitch, so when I’m at home and practicing, I’ll hum a song or tune, and when I reach the piano, that's the key I have to start in, and I must modulate and play the song in all keys, without my pretend audience being able to decipher which keys are my weak or strong, my practice session is over, when I’ve gone thru all the keys seamlessly….but when I’m worshipping at the piano, I just choose a key and play my best to HIM.
I encourage you all to find the balance of working at your craft..... and ministering directly to God(your giftgiver)thru your playing
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Thanks great advice indeed. I must admit I loves me some Db and Ab, still working on the other keys.
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The thing that I did to learn my keys was convert everything I knew into numbers. I was then able to manually transpose to any key. Learning by numbers does INDEED make things much easier. ;) Thanks LGM!!!
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good stuff D;thank LORD this is for KEYBOARDs,until this church;most praise teams were guitar -centered;most of these kats ONLY play in E+G,to play 1 !!!! song in Eb like pullin' teeth,gotta get the kapo out,"it's hard to play" yada,yada,yada bunch o whimps
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very good info thanks alot.
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good stuff D;thank LORD this is for KEYBOARDs,until this church;most praise teams were guitar -centered;most of these kats ONLY play in E+G,to play 1 !!!! song in Eb like pullin' teeth,gotta get the kapo out,"it's hard to play" yada,yada,yada bunch o whimps
thanks for your compliment
i guess every genre has its pitfalls
I remember whe I used to play guitar
everyone liked E and G and A
those were the first keys we learned
the truth is they like those keys because of the open strings the way you can have an open string ringing as a drone note while you play a lick against the open pedal tone
it is a favorite guitar trick
these are tricks that you can only do in those keys
they just cant be done in the other keys
unless you use a kapo
or maybe they just know open tunings and there fore should be burned alive
so dont be too hard on them
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good stuff D;thank LORD this is for KEYBOARDs,until this church;most praise teams were guitar -centered;most of these kats ONLY play in E+G,to play 1 !!!! song in Eb like pullin' teeth,gotta get the kapo out,"it's hard to play" yada,yada,yada bunch o whimps
Doc you are so right, when playing with a guitar player in Eb you hate to hear them sigh as they put on the Kapo (as if you broke one of the 10 commandments)...so I figured I'd just stretch and do what I should have already done, and thats work in D,A, and E. Our church has typically been multicultural. But once a visiting pastor came, and he was a white southern pentacostal who obviously had a lil confederate residue still on him....I was playing before service (he could obvioiusly play a lil)..I happened to be in F# (my favorit key)..so he walks over to me on the C3 and in a condescedning manner says, "yea I understand that you blacks only play in the black keys)...I kept my cool and didn't fuss him out in the Holy Ghost, but as I modulated up to G, I politely responded "I'm not sure what them blacks do, but I play in all keys"
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so he walks over to me on the C3 and in a condescedning manner says, "yea I understand that you blacks only play in the black keys)...
Oh my! That's horrible!! :-\
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Oh my! That's horrible!! :-\
it does seem horrible but I wonder if the shoe was on the other foot
and a black guy said to a white guy yeah I understand you white guys like to play on the white keys
the white guy probably would have laughed
the fact is that most of our modern gospel musicians do tend to favor the flat keys
why I dont know.
dont get me wrong it does sound a little disparaging
but I am not sure it would be taken as offensively if the shoe was on the other foot
case in point
When I studied classical music at a local community college
there were several very gifted white students
who could play circles around me but not in Ab Db Eb Bb Gb
but put them in E A G D C or F and they would blast me out the water
they thought it was interesting that we (black jazz gospel musicians ) gravitated toward the Flat keys
I understood that
because of their training a lot of the early classicla music was taught and written in the natural keys (white keys)
and that is why they have such a naturalness in those keys
anyone who favors the flat keys will find E and A uncomfortable
because they are the exact opposite
interms of the mountains and valleys (the Flat keys are the mountains the natual notes are the valleys)
the terrain is the exact opposite so if your hands have that muscle memory
they will be confused by the opposite keys
the fact that the man said black keys could have been intentional
but to be honest a lot of musicians call the flat and sharp keys black keys
and the natural notes white keys
I do myself I had to concentrate and use my back space button to make sure I called them politically correct terms
another thing I notice a lot of things that are said by caucasians toward blacks face to face
are innocent brain farts
sometimes they are intentional but often times it is just their way of trying to be friendly
maybe he was making a joke in poor taste
a joke he may have had with another african american friend
but because you were a stranger it wasnt taken well
then again maybe he was a racist bigot who should be burned in oil
(wow that is the second time i used the burning oil thing today) God forgive me
seriously
we shouldnt take everything so seriously often times we are wrong and totally misunderstood.
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D....you are right, there is not anything in your post that I disagree with ....and I used to be that guy who could only play in the black(flat keys)...and although I don't think this brother should have been burned in oil(although conceptually the idea is a gag)... I actually do think he was trying to connect, and just made a bad joke, but remember I said "in a condescending manner"..this gentleman was full of pride and arrogance.
Sidebar: He went on to lose his church( a sizeable one), involved in moral failure that broke up a family and his own, he now lives in my town, I've even seen him walking in my neighborhood(he won't wave to me). I do not celebrate this brother's demise(was a 4th generation gospel preacher), and I hope God restores him, and those who was hurt in the midst...but my point is "GOD HATES PRIDE"...so if you struggle with pride/arrogance(and I have) get deliverance and get rid of that bad boy...humble yourself, before God allows you to be humiliated !!!
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it does seem horrible but I wonder if the shoe was on the other foot
and a black guy said to a white guy yeah I understand you white guys like to play on the white keys
the white guy probably would have laughed
I guess history is really something huh?
Honestly, I would have not even thought something like that; let alone say it. I don't make assumptions about musicians or people in general.
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does anyone have the chords to the song call it is for me. it start of like this:
What God has for me it is for me
what God has for me it is for me
I know withouta doubt that he will bring me out
what God has for me it is for me.
PLz anyone who know the chords to that song can you share it with a sister. May God Bless you. Thank You in advance.
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D....you are right, there is not anything in your post that I disagree with ....and I used to be that guy who could only play in the black(flat keys)...and although I don't think this brother should have been burned in oil(although conceptually the idea is a gag)... I actually do think he was trying to connect, and just made a bad joke, but remember I said "in a condescending manner"..this gentleman was full of pride and arrogance.
Sidebar: He went on to lose his church( a sizeable one), involved in moral failure that broke up a family and his own, he now lives in my town, I've even seen him walking in my neighborhood(he won't wave to me). I do not celebrate this brother's demise(was a 4th generation gospel preacher), and I hope God restores him, and those who was hurt in the midst...but my point is "GOD HATES PRIDE"...so if you struggle with pride/arrogance(and I have) get deliverance and get rid of that bad boy...humble yourself, before God allows you to be humiliated !!!
you sure did say condescending I forgot about that
but I loved what you wrote about humility
do you know that humility was one of the spices that formed the recipe for my success in the music ministry.
God was the main ingredient
practice and study was another ingredient
but the thing that made it all come together was my humility
don't get me wrong I struggled with some issues from time to time
but in each of my ministries I had to demonstrate extreme humility
it got to the point when I almost knew exactly how to demonstrate humility
and could sit back and wait on the exhaltation from God.
the scripture is true
if you continually humble yourself you can only go higher
More people should really pricitce humility
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good stuff D;thank LORD this is for KEYBOARDs,until this church;most praise teams were guitar -centered;most of these kats ONLY play in E+G,to play 1 !!!! song in Eb like pullin' teeth,gotta get the kapo out,"it's hard to play" yada,yada,yada bunch o whimps
Lemme put it this way. Playing chords on the guitar in keys other than E A C G D is not easy because of the barring you have to do. Barring those chords is not easy. Barring chords that start from the 5th string is not easy at all.
If we are talking about playing lead then i don't need a capo and i don't care what key you are in.
For me i started playing in the white keys. In fact it was only recently i could play on the black keys. Go figure.
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Lemme put it this way. Playing chords on the guitar in keys other than E A C G D is not easy because of the barring you have to do. Barring those chords is not easy. Barring chords that start from the 5th string is not easy at all.
If we are talking about playing lead then i don't need a capo and i don't care what key you are in.
For me i started playing in the white keys. In fact it was only recently i could play on the black keys. Go figure.
really I didnt find this to be true i guess everyone is different and everyone has different sized hands
or maybe since I was more of a jazz gospel player I learned all my stuff in modulating keys
I didnt find playing any one key easier than another in fact
I preferred to play in fifth and eighth position and avoided open position chords
I started out learning funk rhythm guitar
and blues and jazz guitar
and the open position was definitely not my favorite