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Author Topic: types of suspended chords?  (Read 14733 times)

Offline hugg

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types of suspended chords?
« on: August 12, 2005, 10:35:35 AM »
hello.

there's the sus4 right?

what about the sus2, where do you use that chord?

any other more suspened chords?


thanks. :)  :lol:  :D

Offline walterh

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types of suspended chords?
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2005, 08:56:14 PM »
CFG Sus 4
CFGBb sus 7
CDG or C DGC

With the exeption of the first chord I usually group them as quartal harmony.

Offline Qantares

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types of suspended chords?
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2005, 06:51:59 PM »
Sus 2
Sus 4
Sus 6

Offline T-Block

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types of suspended chords?
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2005, 03:41:31 PM »
Basically any chord can be suspended.  All u have to do is hold down a note from the previous chord while playing the other notes regular.  Then a split second later, move that note to the correct note.  Just in case u don't understand that, here is an example:

C-E-G
A-E-F  *notice here the E is held over from the first chord
A-D-F  *notice here the E goes to D

When u have a suspension, you have all the notes in the chord except for 1.  Later, that 1 note that is out of the chord resolves to a note in the chord.
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Offline diverse379

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i dont remember what this is called
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2005, 03:40:59 PM »
but this is a minor sus 7 where the sus is a major suspended which resolves to the flat seven

dfac# - dfac
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Offline musallio

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2008, 10:04:03 PM »
Ok, this needs a revisit imo..

Guys, no longer have to be scared of being cursed for sharing what you know ;D

Don't just stated it's a sus2 chord..
explain how it's formed so that...*blahblah* ;)
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Offline diverse379

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2008, 10:27:16 PM »
Ok, this needs a revisit imo..

Guys, no longer have to be scared of being cursed for sharing what you know ;D

Don't just stated it's a sus2 chord..
explain how it's formed so that...*blahblah* ;)

this post was from 2005

i think a lot of us were figuring there was so much other information on this subject in other posts at the time we just gave little answers

back then t-block and I were just little guys

aljiers was contributing big on topics like this

but enough reminiscing

a suspension is where you raise a tone up a half step or a whole step



the usual tones to raise

are the third
the root and the seventh

the root when raised creates a sus 2
you raise the root a whole step

the third when raised creates a sus4

the seventh is raised on a minor chord
to a major seventh

and resolved down to the flat seventh


traditionally the suspensions are resolved
but now days
they are left suspended

final notes
the sus 2 are sus 2 when there is no seventh present in the chord
if there is a seventh then the 2 becomes a 9th
and is no longer considered a suspension

the sus 4 is still a sus if there is a 7th
but if there is a third in the chord then it is an 11th not really a sus4
 

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Offline musallio

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2008, 10:43:23 PM »
Diverse, some areas I disagree with you.
but I'll be back when I'm thinking straight..right now my bed is shouting out my name..
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Offline diverse379

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2008, 10:39:15 AM »
Diverse, some areas I disagree with you.
but I'll be back when I'm thinking straight..right now my bed is shouting out my name..

well let me know I will point you to all the literature where I got my information

cuz you know I dont play

and I dont write things I cant validate

To be or not to be that is the question you anwer when you pray practice and read your word

Offline T-Block

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2008, 11:43:54 AM »
a suspension is where you raise a tone up a half step or a whole step

the usual tones to raise

are the third
the root and the seventh

the root when raised creates a sus 2
you raise the root a whole step

the third when raised creates a sus4

the seventh is raised on a minor chord
to a major seventh

and resolved down to the flat seventh


traditionally the suspensions are resolved
but now days
they are left suspended

final notes
the sus 2 are sus 2 when there is no seventh present in the chord
if there is a seventh then the 2 becomes a 9th
and is no longer considered a suspension

the sus 4 is still a sus if there is a 7th
but if there is a third in the chord then it is an 11th not really a sus4

And there you have it.  Just for a little more clarity purposes, the suspended chords apply to the RH part of the chord moreso than the LH.
Real musicians play in every key!!!
Music Theory, da numbers work!

Offline musallio

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2008, 12:50:35 PM »
this post was from 2005

i think a lot of us were figuring there was so much other information on this subject in other posts at the time we just gave little answers

back then t-block and I were just little guys

aljiers was contributing big on topics like this

but enough reminiscing

a suspension is where you raise a tone up a half step or a whole step



the usual tones to raise

are the third
the root and the seventh

the root when raised creates a sus 2
you raise the root a whole step

the third when raised creates a sus4

the seventh is raised on a minor chord
to a major seventh

and resolved down to the flat seventh


traditionally the suspensions are resolved
but now days
they are left suspended

final notes
the sus 2 are sus 2 when there is no seventh present in the chord
if there is a seventh then the 2 becomes a 9th
and is no longer considered a suspension

the sus 4 is still a sus if there is a 7th
but if there is a third in the chord then it is an 11th not really a sus4
 




The boldened part highlights my area of query:
Are you saying the 3rd will still be present there?

I believe it was Hammondman! who taught that that's the sus2..I also saw this in 1 of his short vids where he explains them..I also saw that this is the same way Geres explains the sus2..

All along, I've been told that you lower the 3rd a whole step to form the sus2..meaning that the root can still be present...

Just in case I'm incorrect, I've double checked with a couple of chord finders:
here is one:
http://www.hearandplay.com/pianochords.html

so the formula I use is 1-2-5..

Do you use 2-3-5?

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Offline diverse379

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2008, 01:30:31 PM »
you came correct you brought all your sources

I serioulsy respect that


My understanding is that the in a sus 2 chord the
1 is actually the note that is suspended

so you have a 2.3 5 in the chord

and the 2 will then resolve down to the 1
it is a familiar sound


DEG
CEG

you asked another question

can the C be present along with the D

Usually when you have both the root and the 2 in the same chord

this is called an add 9 chord



I never heard of this device that you say hammondman and aljiers taught
with the D going up to the E as being called suspended in formal theory circles

but
I have seen jazz musicians use it but they usually
are referring to is as a tension resolving upward

not a lowered suspension
because to suspend means to hang above just by definition

in any case
the sound that they create sounds wonderful
and there is nothing wrong with it


the problem comes into play with what do you call it

you really can call it whatever you like
but to avoid miscommunication

I tend to be a little exact

so that is why
I will maintain that

a 2 added to a triad is an Add9

and if the Tonic is missing it is an sus2

if the 3 is missing then it is a chord fragment

and sometimes labeled Cadd9 no3
but that is cumbersome

but that is how it is usually spelled in chord charts


I like the fact that there are others on this site who are concerned with the correct ways to call chords and principles ''
because this is how we can really help develop each other

if we all speak the same language

we can transmit tons of information

To be or not to be that is the question you anwer when you pray practice and read your word

Offline musallio

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2008, 01:45:36 PM »
My understanding is that the in a sus 2 chord the
1 is actually the note that is suspended

so you have a 2.3 5 in the chord

and the 2 will then resolve down to the 1
it is a familiar sound


DEG
CEG



Ok, so that's the formula you use as I had understood.





I never heard of this device that you say hammondman and aljiers taught
with the D going up to the E as being called suspended in formal theory circles

but
I have seen jazz musicians use it but they usually
are referring to is as a tension resolving upward

not a lowered suspension
because to suspend means to hang above just by definition

in any case
the sound that they create sounds wonderful
and there is nothing wrong with it


the problem comes into play with what do you call it

you really can call it whatever you like
but to avoid miscommunication

I tend to be a little exact

so that is why
I will maintain that

a 2 added to a triad is an Add9

and if the Tonic is missing it is an sus2

if the 3 is missing then it is a chord fragment

and sometimes labeled Cadd9 no3
but that is cumbersome

but that is how it is usually spelled in chord charts


I like the fact that there are others on this site who are concerned with the correct ways to call chords and principles ''
because this is how we can really help develop each other

if we all speak the same language

we can transmit tons of information

Quote

Twas good that you misquoted me there because you ended up explaining the underlying concept of sus chords 8)

I think this should be locked now so that the fundamental principle of sus chords which has been explained is not missed ..

Nice 1 Diverse :)
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Offline Gibby

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2008, 06:50:03 AM »
isn't 11th's suspended chords? it's like the sus4 but the 4 is an octave up.

i like to use minor and major 11th's when a song slows down and the MOM tells me to carry the progression on my guitar.

Offline diverse379

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2008, 08:09:26 AM »
isn't 11th's suspended chords? it's like the sus4 but the 4 is an octave up.

i like to use minor and major 11th's when a song slows down and the MOM tells me to carry the progression on my guitar.

yes and no
techncally it would be up an octave but it doesent have to voiced up an octave what makes it 11th is that the 7th iis in the chord so now the 11th also appears usually we sharp the 11th if the third is present
just like a 2 becomes a 9th if the 7th is in the chord

and a 6 becomes  13 if there is a 7th in the chord
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Offline seemunny

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2008, 12:11:12 AM »
I'll give this a shot. I can take correction if needed and some of this might be repeating what has already been said:

  • 1-2-5 = _________________sus2
  • 1-4-5 = _________________sus4
  • 1-4-5-7 = _______________7sus4
  • 1-2(9)-3-5 = ____________ Major add 9 (when the 3 is present, the 2 becomes a 9)
        so a better way to say it is:
        1-3-5-9

  • 1-b3-5-7 = ______________ m/Maj7

  • 1-b3-4(11)-5-b7,9 = ______ minor7,9,11 (when the 3 is present, the 4 becomes an 11)
        so a better way to say it is:
        1-b3-5-b7-9-11

8)

Offline seemunny

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #16 on: June 02, 2008, 12:42:50 AM »
Musallio, there you go, dusting off them old threads again!  :D :D :D
I'm just now noticing this was originally from 2005! looool

Offline rspindy

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #17 on: June 02, 2008, 12:42:41 PM »
We need to sort a few things out here.

First, we are dealing with a confusion of classical theory usage and the naming conventions of chord symbols (which were originally developed by guitarist and ukulelelelelists).

For the chord symbols, the "sus 4" and "sus 2" (which is sometimes written as "add 2") are naming conventions to describe a certain combination of notes and are only tentatively related to the classical theory usage.  In a triad, both instances represent a replacement of the chord third by either the 4th or 2nd scale-step above the root.  A C major triad is [C E G]. If the E is replaced with F [C F G], it becomes a C sus4; if replaced by D [C D G] it becomes a C sus2.  In the case of 7th chords, you would rarely encounter a "7 sus2" since the 2 is equivalent to the 9 (although the 2 does imply replacing the third while the 9 implies the presence of the third.)  As far as the "7 sus4", that occurs frequently, particularly in lead sheets that do not indicate anything beyond a 7th chord.  It is functionally practically identical to "x11".  Although, the "11" implies the presence of the both the 9th and the 3rd and the "4" says little about the 9th and implies a replacement of the 3rd by the 4th, in general usage, the 3rd is frequently omitted in voicings since it creates the very dissonant m 9th interval.

Though I have seen it, a "min sus4" or "min sus2" (whether triad or 7th) does not really exist since the characteristic note (the minor 3rd) is missing.  Its only possible practical purpose is that it warns one that the following "chord of resolution" is going to be built on a minor triad as opposed to a major triad.  If the 3rd were added in, then these would be functionally identical to the "min 11" and a "min 9".  In the case of a "min 11" it is generally voiced with the 3rd since there is no major problem with the interval between the 3rd and the 11th and without it, it is functionally identical to a dominant 11.

When working with these chords in the context of chord symbol, it is best to just consider them as an indication of how the notes are combined to form them, since as often as not they do not follow the classical context of "suspension."

Now, the name "suspension" and its derivatives comes from classical usage meaning "suspended resolution".  A classical suspension is a three step process -- preparation, suspension, resolution.  First the note to be suspended is introduced as an essential member of the harmony -- chord tones [1 3 5] and in the case of the dominant 7 [1 3 5 7]  (Note, some books will say "consonant" to the harmony, but this is not necessarily true in the case of a dominant chord since the 7th is dissonant.  But the 7th has been considered an essential part of the dominant 7th for centuries).  Then when the chord changes to the next harmony, a note (or notes) that is (are) dissonant -- not an essential member of the harmony -- is maintained over the other notes of the new harmony.  Finally, the suspended note is resolved to a note that is consonant and an essential chord tone.  The resolution is by step usually descending.  Also, in all instances except when the suspended interval is a 2nd, the upper note is the note of resolution.  If the interval is a 2nd, then the lower note descends.

Rhythmically, a suspension "crosses the bar".  Though the bar line may not actually be present, the preparation and resolution falls on a rhythmically weaker beat or portion of a beat than the actual suspension.  In its most basic form you would have P |S R || (P = preparation, S = suspension, R = resolution.

Let's try first a progression IV - I with a suspension.  In C major:
IV     F / C F A
Isus  C / C F G
I      C / C E G

The suspension is "prepared" by the R.H. "F",an essential tone, and in this case consonant, of the F major triad.  The "F" over the "C" in the second chord is the suspension.  It creates two dissonant intervals -- P4 above "C" (which is considered harmonically dissonant when the lower member is the bass) and a maj 2nd between F and G.

Finally, the suspension is resolved when the "F" descends a half step to "E", an essential consonant interval.

Classical suspensions are classed by the intervals of the suspension and resolution above the bass.  Thus, the above is a "4 - 3" suspension.  Others are the "7 - 8", "9 - 8" and the "6 - 5".  You may say that in the "6 - 5" that the "6" is consonant with the bass.  In this case, the 6th is less stable than the 5th and is not an essential part of the final harmony.

Offline T-Block

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #18 on: June 02, 2008, 03:00:00 PM »
That's what I'm talking about right there.  Good explanation!!!  :D
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Offline madetoworship

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Re: types of suspended chords?
« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2008, 09:42:49 AM »
Good explanation,

In a sus chord the third is replaced with the 2nd or 4th for sus2 or sus4. If you add the 2nd but the 3rd is still present it would be an add9.

I usually use sus2 for the chord IV and sus4 for the chord V.

For example, in the key of C, instead of using a classic progresion like "C Am F G" I use "C Am7 Fsus2 Gsus4". Using that chords the 1st and 5th are always present and it sounds very well.
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