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Author Topic: How do you know chords within the melody?  (Read 12975 times)

Offline T-Block

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #20 on: June 22, 2011, 08:59:06 PM »
I gots to find my way to Florida so I can hear mama T-block sang and preach....and faint while watching T-block play ;D #thatisall4now

LMBO!!! :D
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Offline Blessingss

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2011, 01:44:30 AM »
my organist does that (plays whatever the singer sings) and its blasted annoying. i mean he tries to chord EVERY SYLLABLE!!!!!! #1 it gives you no dynamic expression #2 it gives the singer no freedom.

The trick is to hear the root of the chord (im a bass player, so maybe this comes easier for me because its what i do) and where the chords actually change (they dont change on every syllable, there are key points and those are where your chord progressions happen). Once you do that, you can fill in the chords either with basic triads or larger fuller chords, paying attention to 3rd (determines major or minor) and the 7th. Once you hit those chords at the point of the chord changes, you have freedom to stay there or explore other chords, possibly leading to the next one. Thats space (plus the chords you choose) are your adventure to developing your style. And the possibilities are nearly limitless. (Caution, dont OVERplay. not good.)

Yah, that was me, ok guys I know there are lots of posts on practice tips but specifically for this situation, what sort of practice suggestion do you recommend (with some examples if possible) to get out of this for example let's take this song "give thanks with a grateful heart" by TD Jakes, can you first give the chords with the bad melody habit and then a better way (more than one if possible) to play it or any other simple song.
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Offline T-Block

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2011, 07:06:23 AM »
Yah, that was me, ok guys I know there are lots of posts on practice tips but specifically for this situation, what sort of practice suggestion do you recommend (with some examples if possible) to get out of this for example let's take this song "give thanks with a grateful heart" by TD Jakes, can you first give the chords with the bad melody habit and then a better way (more than one if possible) to play it or any other simple song.

The best practice is to use chord inversions where the melody is not on top. Avoid it at all costs. You may have to write it out and practice it, but after a while you will get used to it it.

When I get some time this weekend, I will post some ideas using that song.
Real musicians play in every key!!!
Music Theory, da numbers work!

Offline floaded27

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2011, 11:14:42 PM »
Yah, that was me, ok guys I know there are lots of posts on practice tips but specifically for this situation, what sort of practice suggestion do you recommend (with some examples if possible) to get out of this for example let's take this song "give thanks with a grateful heart" by TD Jakes, can you first give the chords with the bad melody habit and then a better way (more than one if possible) to play it or any other simple song.

actually never learned that song on keys, so i dont know the chords, but a tip i can give you is to play block chords. 1 per progression. I could give you an example with another song I know off hand thats simple, "How Great Is Our God". Since i dont play melody, it would actually be an exercise to figure out what would be played like that, so i can show you how i play.

        C#
How great is our God

                             Bbmin
Sing with me how great is our God

         F#             Ab
how great, how great

         C#
is our God


Play that and only that. Hold those chords until its time to go to the next one. Each time around you can change the quality of the chord (C# can become a C#Maj9 for example) but play only ONE chord per progression and  hold it.
Another trick, get a good singer to help you out and let them solo the heck outta that song. you have no choice but to stay put because you wont be able to follow them.
For my God... let "Golden Axe" prevail.

Offline SirTJ

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2011, 01:01:06 AM »
So, yall are saying that you don't keep the melody note on top when you're accompanying a singer/choir? For example, in the Key of C,  if the melody note = E, you would play an inversion of a C major chord as C/CEG instead of C/GCE?  Because I was always taught to keep the melody note on top, not for every chord of course, but at least for the majority of them. Most tutorials I watch have the melody note on top.

Offline floaded27

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2011, 09:11:55 AM »
So, yall are saying that you don't keep the melody note on top when you're accompanying a singer/choir? For example, in the Key of C,  if the melody note = E, you would play an inversion of a C major chord as C/CEG instead of C/GCE?  Because I was always taught to keep the melody note on top, not for every chord of course, but at least for the majority of them. Most tutorials I watch have the melody note on top.

my teacher always told me, "Why?" And as i played more, i understood, as well as him explaining. A lot of time, the melody note is there to help the singer find the note, or have the note when there is no singer. But if you have a good singer, they know where to be without u playing that. My teacher plays with bands so he always had a band concept to playing. If you had a guitar or sax playing the melody, would you still have to put the melody note on top? NOPE! So HOW is that any different than a singer? People often treat singers as different than instruments, when really, voice is just a different KIND of instrument.

I found out playing bass that i can do things such as imply chords that arent really being played. For example if a straight major 7th chord is played, i can imply a major 9 by playing that 9 as the chord is being played or somewhere afterwards. Because you just hear the notes, you determine the chords by the combination of notes, not the instruments (kind of like a rootless voicing playing with a bass player). So switch up the roles, and i can play chords that DONT contain the melody note, and let the singer imply the chord by including that note. Although this is kinda hard for a less than average singer or one who DEPENDS on the melody note because they'll get lost. But this helps you throw variety in your playing. But then again, my playing is not as a tradition keyboardist, because i always have a bass and big band perspective and approach to music.

This is partially why you'll hear some folks sound different playing the same song in different keys: because they dont use the same inversions.
For my God... let "Golden Axe" prevail.

Offline jgause2

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2011, 09:21:00 AM »
So, yall are saying that you don't keep the melody note on top when you're accompanying a singer/choir? For example, in the Key of C,  if the melody note = E, you would play an inversion of a C major chord as C/CEG instead of C/GCE?  Because I was always taught to keep the melody note on top, not for every chord of course, but at least for the majority of them. Most tutorials I watch have the melody note on top.

Just echoing off floaded27...They probably just do that for teaching purposes, so you can gain a greater understanding of chord placement, and where the chords fit into the song.  But you're right, it's not necessary for when you're accompanying, beause you'd just be playing over what they are singing...it's redundant. It's the equivalent of running a bass line during shouting music, and you already have a bass player running the bass line (which i have a bad habit of doing, mostly because i've never played with a bass player til last year).  It frees you up to be more creative, and create more sounds.

The only time I play a song with the melody line on top, is if nobody is singing, so that those who hear the song can catch on to what the song is...or I may use it as a tool to help guide the congregation on one unified note, then once they catch on to that note, then I may back off the melody.
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Offline Blessingss

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Re: How do you know chords within the melody?
« Reply #27 on: July 01, 2011, 01:20:02 AM »
This is really great topic and the information is becoming greater and greater as other parts are being explored-more solutions into my mind. :)
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