A little lesson I learned

[dwest2419]

Hi guys. I just want to talk about something a thought to my problems I have been quite having. I started analyzing the I-IV-V chord progression. The thought that came to me is that I get that the chord progression is in a major key and not minor. That was the first clue. Secondly, was to identify the avoid note for the C major scale and that is the 4th scale degree in the key C for example the avoid note is F. So as I analyzed my chord progression. I said in a example, I can apply the C major pentatonic scale over the I chord. One I realize that the C major pentatonic scale does have all the notes in a C major triad. e.g. C major pentatonic C, D, E, G, A. So all three notes are of C E and G are safe notes to land on.

 But when I get to the IV chord in my I-IV-V chord progression I have to avoid that 4th scale degree - so I omit that note and leave it out. Why? Because if you haven't read in a major chord progression the F note which is the 4th scale degree is Ionian's avoided note. Because F is a half step above C major's chord tone which is E the major third. Now when the chord progression moves to a IV major chord - what to play over a IV major chord? What I noticed is that the C major pentatonic scale does have the major 3rd and perfect 5th chord tones of the IV chord. The notes are A and C. Which again are safe landing notes for this particular chord. So I could be playing C major pentatonic and land on the major third or perfect 5th of the IV chord tones and it'll sound good. Remember as long as I land on 3rd or 5th chord tones in this particular case I am safe.

Now when the chord progression moves to a V major chord - what to play over a V major chord? First, The C major pentatonic scale does has the root and perfect 5th chord tones of the V chord which are safe notes to land on. e.g. (G ->root), A, C, (D -> perfect 5th), E. So what I noticed is that the C major pentatonic scale would do the job over this particular chord progression. As long as I land on here in this case the root and the perfect 5th, and it'll still sound good.

I which I had a recorder or something to show how the chord progression would sound. But I believe the Lord gave me this insight on this particular subject. And has been very beneficial to me.

[funkStrat_97]

Try a D Dorian (or its pentatonic equivalent)....D is the relative minor to F and you'll also find D in your C pentatonic major scale.  Otherwise, just heed the advice of a wise man who once said: "shut up and play your guitar"  .

[gtrdave]

What in the world is an "avoided note"??

Seriously, are you making this stuff up? If not, it seems you are getting yourself way too caught up in some kind of nonsense theory and not spending enough time actually practicing what is worthwhile.

[funkStrat_97]

What in the world is an "avoided note"??

Seriously, are you making this stuff up? If not, it seems you are getting yourself way too caught up in some kind of nonsense theory and not spending enough time actually practicing what is worthwhile.

I don't think he's making it up (perhaps a misunderstanding of the application).  Between service this past Sunday, our sax player - who is really into jazz - was discussing with us about a jazz theory in which the 4th interval is considered to be a dissonance with respect to the tonic.  As such, the 4th is often avoided which is why (my own conclusion) one of the standard jazz chord progressions is the ii-V-I.  Here, the major IV chord is replaced with its relative minor - the ii minor.  It's also why (I think) you can fake your way through a lot of songs with just the I and V chords.  This avoidance theory also could explain why the IV is omitted from the pentatonic major.  But I don't really understand the theory myself in practical terms.  I see no reason why the IV would be considered a dissonance especially since it is one of the primary chords - although if you've ever tried to play what would be a Major 7 natural 11th chord, it wont sound too good.

[gtrdave]

Okay, I get what you're saying now, although I'd still never heard the term "avoid note" used in any of my jazz improv training.
Here's another explanation of the concept:
What constitutes a wrong note in jazz improvisation is often subjective. As jazz has evolved the harmony has in some cases become more complex or abstract. When bebop musicians started to use #11ths (or b5ths) in the 40s, the more traditional players and critics considered these to be ”wrong” notes. Similarly avant garde players of the 50s and 60s shocked the jazz establishment with their use of atonality.

It is almost impossible to provide a complete set of rules regarding what sounds ”good” or ”bad”. The following are conventionally considered to be wrong notes (sometimes called ”avoid” notes), unless used as passing notes.

A 4th over any major chord (unless it is an 11th or sus 4 see ex. 4e)
A major 3rd on a minor chord
A minor 3rd (#9th) or minor 7th on a major 7th chord
A root note as a sustained note over a major 7th chord
A b9th on a major 7 or minor chord
A b6th on a major 7 or minor chord
A major 7th on a minor 7th or (dominant) 7th chord

The key to these notes is that they are "passing tones", not notes to never be played or avoided.