Sick Of Calvin Rodgers?

[Rjthakid]

LOL... gospel cats continue to get the game twisted! Stop focusing so much on who gets the work and FOCUS ON YOURSELF. Instead of asking why someone else got the gig, ask yourself why YOU didn't get the gig! Were you at the audition? Have YOU done everything in YOUR power to get YOURSELF heard? Have YOU practiced? Can YOU play it like the record? Do YOU have a press kit?...
If you are sitting at home with no gigs, do what I do... make a gig! Oh, you can't do it? Chambers did it. Weckl did it. What's your problem, churchboys? What are you waiting for? You ARE good enough, aren't you?... I knew you were!
Set your goals higher than any gig. Don't be known as "the guy who used to play for..."
Much luv to errrbody!

God bless

Got a brutha thinkin...

[JrDADrumma]

LOL... gospel cats continue to get the game twisted! Stop focusing so much on who gets the work and FOCUS ON YOURSELF. Instead of asking why someone else got the gig, ask yourself why YOU didn't get the gig! Were you at the audition? Have YOU done everything in YOUR power to get YOURSELF heard? Have YOU practiced? Can YOU play it like the record? Do YOU have a press kit?...
If you are sitting at home with no gigs, do what I do... make a gig! Oh, you can't do it? Chambers did it. Weckl did it. What's your problem, churchboys? What are you waiting for? You ARE good enough, aren't you?... I knew you were!
Set your goals higher than any gig. Don't be known as "the guy who used to play for..."

Much luv to errrbody!

God bless

This is very true. I'm kinda stuck on the fence with this one. DOD made some valid points about having to get in with the right people to truly make it. However, I do think that if more of our gospel drummers were really educated as opposed to just "talented", then we'd get the gigs. Sure dudes can play, but do they understand music? Dudes like Marvin, Calvin, those guys have studied their craft. They didn't stop at just being talented. One way to get in is to know some people, get the right connects, and sure you can get a gig that way. But I find it hard to believe that if you are truly educated, studied up, and prepared to handle all musical situations, that it will be ignored. Everybody is talented nowadays, you have to raise the bar if you want to separate yourself and get that "monster" gospel/r&b gig. Being talented isn't enough anymore, and if you rely on talent alone, then you will be stuck having to catch breaks and trying to get in with the right people. The fact is, most gospel cats(me included) are TOO LAZY to work on their craft. Honor your gift. The Bible says that your gift will make room for you, but it also says to STUDY to show thyself approved. That's what will separate you from the pack. There will always be the uber-talented, lazy types in the gospel game. If you are willing to put in the work and study your craft, I believe you will stand out. Not study for chops, or shed all the time, but study to understand music. Do this, and pray. That's pretty much it. My mom always tell me "do your part, and God will do the rest." If we study, educate ourselves, push ourselves, and really work hard, then if it's in God's plan for our life, he will make up the difference. There will always be exceptions, but that's the case with any situation. Just my two pennies. 

[fretai03]

Don't be known as "the guy who used to play for..."

I don't know Flat... seems that every gospel drummer I've come across has been attached to some artist (Gospel or secular).

Spanky & Pudge with Tye.
Calvin with [literally everyone]
Marvin with Fred
etc etc

I personally would like to be known as "the guy who used to play for..." because I'll know I was part of something great and I won't live the rest of my life wondering "what if" (like most church drummers do).

[BEATBOXERZ]

LOL... gospel cats continue to get the game twisted! Stop focusing so much on who gets the work and FOCUS ON YOURSELF. Instead of asking why someone else got the gig, ask yourself why YOU didn't get the gig! Were you at the audition? Have YOU done everything in YOUR power to get YOURSELF heard? Have YOU practiced? Can YOU play it like the record? Do YOU have a press kit?...
If you are sitting at home with no gigs, do what I do... make a gig! Oh, you can't do it? Chambers did it. Weckl did it. What's your problem, churchboys? What are you waiting for? You ARE good enough, aren't you?... I knew you were!
Set your goals higher than any gig. Don't be known as "the guy who used to play for..."

Much luv to errrbody!

God bless

This thread is DONE with this comment right here!!!! Good word Gearld... Everbody HUSH YOUR MOUTH and PRACTICE MORE, and HUSTLE, and then watch GOD work for you.

[bigblackdrummer]

  Ya smell that! Its a good discussion smell!!!!

Some really good points made!!! Now I think the right advice would be to take what Flat-Fifth and Dude On Drums have said. They both go hand in hand! BUT Sabian User has a very good point but you have to remember, there is always new talented artists who will give you a chance but you have to be out there to be seen and you have to be professional!!! Re-visit Flat-Fifths and Dude On Drums post for some ideas.

The other thing is dont put yourself in a box!!! I find that Black Gospel is really the only genre of music where its the same musicians over and over and over again (and that's too bad because it all starts to sound the same after awhile). Ive preached on here for several years to go outside the Black Gospel box and really start working on your musicianship so you can play the Christian contemporary, contemporary worship and praise, rock, folk, Bill Gather southern gospel...The more white contemporary stuff......But oh no, not you guys, you cant shed and show off and prove to the pastor and the girls how much you can play old Calvin Rodgers licks (cause he aint playing like that anymore) and how much better you are then the other drummers who can only play time!!!!!

SIDE NOTE: Gospel AND R&B musicians have lost focus on the drums as an instrument of individuality!!!! WHY on every friggin show do you all sound that same, doing the same licks, acting the same way!!!! That's why a lot of you don't get noticed, you're nothing but a clone, a sheep!

Be professional, put in the time to master your craft, and self promote like mad!!! You might be called gay by haters BUT haters are the ones who are lazy and want everything handed to them!!!!

 

[JFunky]

Ya smell that! Its a good discussion smell!!!!

Some really good points made!!! Now I think the right advice would be to take what Flat-Fifth and Dude On Drums have said. They both go hand in hand! BUT Sabian User has a very good point but you have to remember, there is always new talented artists who will give you a chance but you have to be out there to be seen and you have to be professional!!! Re-visit Flat-Fifths and Dude On Drums post for some ideas.

The other thing is dont put yourself in a box!!! I find that Black Gospel is really the only genre of music where its the same musicians over and over and over again (and that's too bad because it all starts to sound the same after awhile). Ive preached on here for several years to go outside the Black Gospel box and really start working on your musicianship so you can play the Christian contemporary, contemporary worship and praise, rock, folk, Bill Gather southern gospel...The more white contemporary stuff......But oh no, not you guys, you cant shed and show off and prove to the pastor and the girls how much you can play old Calvin Rodgers licks (cause he aint playing like that anymore) and how much better you are then the other drummers who can only play time!!!!!

SIDE NOTE: Gospel AND R&B musicians have lost focus on the drums as an instrument of individuality!!!! WHY on every friggin show do you all sound that same, doing the same licks, acting the same way!!!! That's why a lot of you don't get noticed, you're nothing but a clone, a sheep!

Be professional, put in the time to master your craft, and self promote like mad!!! You might be called gay by haters BUT haters are the ones who are lazy and want everything handed to them!!!!

 

...I approve the above post.

[fLaT-fIfTh]

I don't know Flat... seems that every gospel drummer I've come across has been attached to some artist (Gospel or secular).

Spanky & Pudge with Tye.
Calvin with [literally everyone]
Marvin with Fred
etc etc

I personally would like to be known as "the guy who used to play for..." because I'll know I was part of something great and I won't live the rest of my life wondering "what if" (like most church drummers do).

I'm sorry you feel this way, because with this statement, you allow the gig to define you. Gigs come and go, my friend... Spanky doesn't need Tye. If you heard the name "Spanky" in a conversation, you would know exactly who  he is without mention of Tye. He has established his own name... Even moreso for Calvin. He is established to the point where you don't even need to mention his last name! He so outta control with his game all you have to do is say "Calvin." Am I wrong?

Marvin with Fred
etc etc

He don't play with Fred no more... see my point?

God bless

[TayeDrums]

Im loving this!
I feel like we are all fam in this fourm!!!

[bigblackdrummer]

I love to listen to Calvin, BUT I would love to see and hear other cats with fresh ideas (Im not saying that Calvin dont bring it) bringing a new vibe to the table. If your health care didn't suck Id even more consider moving to the US. You guys have so much opportunity and most of you just sit on it!

[fretai03]

I'm sorry you feel this way, because with this statement, you allow the gig to define you. Gigs come and go, my friend... Spanky doesn't need Tye. If you heard the name "Spanky" in a conversation, you would know exactly who  he is without mention of Tye. He has established his own name... Even moreso for Calvin. He is established to the point where you don't even need to mention his last name! He so outta control with his game all you have to do is say "Calvin." Am I wrong?

He don't play with Fred no more... see my point?

God bless

Flat, I bolded the word "personally" for a reason.

If I ever had someone ask me "So you played with/for [insert artist name here], what was it like?"

I will give them the generic answer that they expect but the musical/professional/spiritual learning + fellowship combined, that I gained from playing with/for that artist, is what I'm talking about.

I'm sure most pro drummers/musicians (heck even artists) keep THOSE experiences to themselves because it holds a special place in their hearts.

Why wouldn't I be proud to associate myself with them. Its semi-self marketing isn't it?

(Which is why Marvin is still recognized for the work he did with Fred).

EDIT: After reading yours and my posts again. It seems we are on 2 different wavelengths. I'm talking about something else & so are you. Agreed?

[cdrums116]

Yo, good thing I aint easily offended like my dude Spanky...LOL!!! That's a joke, I swear it is. Spank is my dude for life, and I know exactly how he feels. That's another story tho. I wanted to comment on this topic becuz, well I feel like I can...LOL

While I'll agree that the industry is highly political, it's waaaaaaay more than a bunch of butt-kissing. There are tons of talented musicians everywhere, especially in Chicago! But talent isn't even 50% of what it's about. Like one of the guys said, it's about getting along with people. You might be able to play circles around the next guy. But can people deal with your attitude? Real talk fellaz, it aint about kissin' up, being friends with the artist, hanging out....NONE OF THAT! I played and worked for R.Kelly for 2 1/2 years. We never EVER held a conversation. I never EVER hungout WITH HIM. Why would I? I don't need to. Rob hired me himself. I was doing a jingle session and he heard me soundchecking my drums. He sent Donny Lyle(his M.D.) over to collect my info. Now, I had established somewhat of a reputation in the gospel community, because I was playing with JPK then. But that didn't mean diddly to them. They actually hired another dude first, who came recommended as a good RnB drummer. But he wasn't cuttin it. So, they called me down to play a rehearsal. They asked me to solo, play pocket program....all that. And at the end of the day, I didn't do anything but count the songs off and play pocket. That gig wasn't about skill. It was about maturity and my ability to gel. We were out for a year straight. You gotta be able to get along with people, to be out that long.

As far as me working so much, it's true that I've developed relationships with certain artists and producers. But those relationships wouldn't mean anything if I couldn't deliver. I get work because I can read. Because I show up on time. Because I learn the music. Because I understand theory. Because I can arrange. Because I take care of my gear. Because I'm always prepared. This is what the game is about. Me and Aaron Lindsey are tight! But if he called me for a session and I didn't learn the music, he wouldn't call me anymore. Guess what, we still gon be tight too!!!

Flat made a great point too.....it's something I've said all my life!!! I've always wanted to be me. I didn't want anybody to say "Calvin, that used to play with Fred or Ricky Dillard". You know why? Because most times, they don't even remember your name!!! It usually sounds like this: "What's the dude name that played drums for Ricky Dillard, before Brent". LOL That's wack!!!

Lastly fellaz, stop thinking that drummers don't help drummers. That aint the truth. Teddy helped me, I helped Rex, I'm helping cats right now. But the thing is, I aint insecure. Also, the guys I help gotta have the right mindset. Gerald helped Aaron get on, and aint think twice about it. Why would he? What RnB gig hasn't Gerald done???? Envy and jealousy will get you nowhere!!! Okay, I'm done

Holla

[SabianKnight]

Yo, good thing I aint easily offended like my dude Spanky...LOL!!! That's a joke, I swear it is. Spank is my dude for life, and I know exactly how he feels. That's another story tho. I wanted to comment on this topic becuz, well I feel like I can...LOL

While I'll agree that the industry is highly political, it's waaaaaaay more than a bunch of butt-kissing. There are tons of talented musicians everywhere, especially in Chicago! But talent isn't even 50% of what it's about. Like one of the guys said, it's about getting along with people. You might be able to play circles around the next guy. But can people deal with your attitude? Real talk fellaz, it aint about kissin' up, being friends with the artist, hanging out....NONE OF THAT! I played and worked for R.Kelly for 2 1/2 years. We never EVER held a conversation. I never EVER hungout WITH HIM. Why would I? I don't need to. Rob hired me himself. I was doing a jingle session and he heard me soundchecking my drums. He sent Donny Lyle(his M.D.) over to collect my info. Now, I had established somewhat of a reputation in the gospel community, because I was playing with JPK then. But that didn't mean diddly to them. They actually hired another dude first, who came recommended as a good RnB drummer. But he wasn't cuttin it. So, they called me down to play a rehearsal. They asked me to solo, play pocket program....all that. And at the end of the day, I didn't do anything but count the songs off and play pocket. That gig wasn't about skill. It was about maturity and my ability to gel. We were out for a year straight. You gotta be able to get along with people, to be out that long.

As far as me working so much, it's true that I've developed relationships with certain artists and producers. But those relationships wouldn't mean anything if I couldn't deliver. I get work because I can read. Because I show up on time. Because I learn the music. Because I understand theory. Because I can arrange. Because I take care of my gear. Because I'm always prepared. This is what the game is about. Me and Aaron Lindsey are tight! But if he called me for a session and I didn't learn the music, he wouldn't call me anymore. Guess what, we still gon be tight too!!!

Flat made a great point too.....it's something I've said all my life!!! I've always wanted to be me. I didn't want anybody to say "Calvin, that used to play with Fred or Ricky Dillard". You know why? Because most times, they don't even remember your name!!! It usually sounds like this: "What's the dude name that played drums for Ricky Dillard, before Brent". LOL That's wack!!!

Lastly fellaz, stop thinking that drummers don't help drummers. That aint the truth. Teddy helped me, I helped Rex, I'm helping cats right now. But the thing is, I aint insecure. Also, the guys I help gotta have the right mindset. Gerald helped Aaron get on, and aint think twice about it. Why would he? What RnB gig hasn't Gerald done???? Envy and jealousy will get you nowhere!!! Okay, I'm done

Holla

Real Talk from a Real Pro. Thank you Calvin!

[SabianKnight]

BBD you brought up some very real points on Self-Promotion, networking... which I have posted on few times in the past. it really comes down to PROFESSIONALISM... conducting yourself as a master craftsman instead of a common apprentice. Not just "professing" how good you think you are but proving it with your presentation of a press kit (biz, demo, resume, bio, headshot) and it would be more business like if you have a real web site to conduct business. A the end of the day the music business is business.

In the words of Will Smith, "If you stay ready you don't have to get ready."
I recently heard a Pastor teach, "Favor is when Preporation meets Opportunity." Now, I previously learned that was the formula for success but life will teach you harder than the Holy Spirit that without favor you preporation may be a disappointment. It all has to line up.

Lets prove we are game tight by mastering the rules of the game. Decent and In Order.

[JFunky]

...yall dudes are funny.  A lot of this "new" information has been in M.D. Mag. for years.  I suggest yall cats pick up the Mags. and start "reading" to generate more good threads like this.  Leave the youtube clips alone already.

...thanks to Calvin for his always humble teachings......I'm a student.

[E.R.]

Yo, good thing I aint easily offended like my dude Spanky...LOL!!! That's a joke, I swear it is. Spank is my dude for life, and I know exactly how he feels. That's another story tho. I wanted to comment on this topic becuz, well I feel like I can...LOL

While I'll agree that the industry is highly political, it's waaaaaaay more than a bunch of butt-kissing. There are tons of talented musicians everywhere, especially in Chicago! But talent isn't even 50% of what it's about. Like one of the guys said, it's about getting along with people. You might be able to play circles around the next guy. But can people deal with your attitude? Real talk fellaz, it aint about kissin' up, being friends with the artist, hanging out....NONE OF THAT! I played and worked for R.Kelly for 2 1/2 years. We never EVER held a conversation. I never EVER hungout WITH HIM. Why would I? I don't need to. Rob hired me himself. I was doing a jingle session and he heard me soundchecking my drums. He sent Donny Lyle(his M.D.) over to collect my info. Now, I had established somewhat of a reputation in the gospel community, because I was playing with JPK then. But that didn't mean diddly to them. They actually hired another dude first, who came recommended as a good RnB drummer. But he wasn't cuttin it. So, they called me down to play a rehearsal. They asked me to solo, play pocket program....all that. And at the end of the day, I didn't do anything but count the songs off and play pocket. That gig wasn't about skill. It was about maturity and my ability to gel. We were out for a year straight. You gotta be able to get along with people, to be out that long.

As far as me working so much, it's true that I've developed relationships with certain artists and producers. But those relationships wouldn't mean anything if I couldn't deliver. I get work because I can read. Because I show up on time. Because I learn the music. Because I understand theory. Because I can arrange. Because I take care of my gear. Because I'm always prepared. This is what the game is about. Me and Aaron Lindsey are tight! But if he called me for a session and I didn't learn the music, he wouldn't call me anymore. Guess what, we still gon be tight too!!!

Flat made a great point too.....it's something I've said all my life!!! I've always wanted to be me. I didn't want anybody to say "Calvin, that used to play with Fred or Ricky Dillard". You know why? Because most times, they don't even remember your name!!! It usually sounds like this: "What's the dude name that played drums for Ricky Dillard, before Brent". LOL That's wack!!!

Lastly fellaz, stop thinking that drummers don't help drummers. That aint the truth. Teddy helped me, I helped Rex, I'm helping cats right now. But the thing is, I aint insecure. Also, the guys I help gotta have the right mindset. Gerald helped Aaron get on, and aint think twice about it. Why would he? What RnB gig hasn't Gerald done???? Envy and jealousy will get you nowhere!!! Okay, I'm done

Holla

Thanks for your insight Calvin. Greatly appreciated.

[bigblackdrummer]

Yo, good thing I aint easily offended like my dude Spanky...LOL!!! That's a joke, I swear it is. Spank is my dude for life, and I know exactly how he feels. That's another story tho. I wanted to comment on this topic because, well I feel like I can...LOL

While I'll agree that the industry is highly political, it's waaaaaaay more than a bunch of butt-kissing. There are tons of talented musicians everywhere, especially in Chicago! But talent isn't even 50% of what it's about. Like one of the guys said, it's about getting along with people. You might be able to play circles around the next guy. But can people deal with your attitude? Real talk fellaz, it aint about kissing' up, being friends with the artist, hanging out....NONE OF THAT! I played and worked for R.Kelly for 2 1/2 years. We never EVER held a conversation. I never EVER hangout WITH HIM. Why would I? I don't need to. Rob hired me himself. I was doing a jingle session and he heard me sound checking my drums. He sent Donny Lyle(his M.D.) over to collect my info. Now, I had established somewhat of a reputation in the gospel community, because I was playing with JPK then. But that didn't mean diddly to them. They actually hired another dude first, who came recommended as a good RnB drummer. But he wasn't cuttin it. So, they called me down to play a rehearsal. They asked me to solo, play pocket program....all that. And at the end of the day, I didn't do anything but count the songs off and play pocket. That gig wasn't about skill. It was about maturity and my ability to gel. We were out for a year straight. You gotta be able to get along with people, to be out that long.

As far as me working so much, it's true that I've developed relationships with certain artists and producers. But those relationships wouldn't mean anything if I couldn't deliver. I get work because I can read. Because I show up on time. Because I learn the music. Because I understand theory. Because I can arrange. Because I take care of my gear. Because I'm always prepared. This is what the game is about. Me and Aaron Lindsey are tight! But if he called me for a session and I didn't learn the music, he wouldn't call me anymore. Guess what, we still gon be tight too!!!

Flat made a great point too.....it's something I've said all my life!!! I've always wanted to be me. I didn't want anybody to say "Calvin, that used to play with Fred or Ricky Dillard". You know why? Because most times, they don't even remember your name!!! It usually sounds like this: "What's the dude name that played drums for Ricky Dillard, before Brent". LOL That's wack!!!

Lastly fellaz, stop thinking that drummers don't help drummers. That aint the truth. Teddy helped me, I helped Rex, I'm helping cats right now. But the thing is, I aint insecure. Also, the guys I help gotta have the right mindset. Gerald helped Aaron get on, and aint think twice about it. Why would he? What RnB gig hasn't Gerald done???? Envy and jealousy will get you nowhere!!! Okay, I'm done

Holla

Calvin seriously, thank you!!! I wish more industrys top would come on and teach....

[JFunky]

Calvin seriously, thank you!!! I wish more industrys top would come on and teach....

...I'm waiting for "Someone" to at least give us a quick lesson or youtube clip lesson on something instead of answering to the negative Bat Sign all the time, ya dig?  

[j_kay]

  LOL 

[BEATBOXERZ]

 

[yamahaboy]

" I am a Sponge, soaking up all this great info "