Are Christians the best that God has?

[axeman1]

Something that has been troubling me lately is the increasingly vitriolic tone that many Christian people use when referring to other Christians, or what they disdainfully refer to as 'church folk'.  Even though it is clear and somewhat understandable that what drives their disdain is their perception that many of these church folk are too judgemental and legalistic, still I often wonder; when these people are making all this negative commentary about the people called by God's name, who are they comparing them to?  I mean, what group of people in the world would you replace them with?

I hear people say all the time, (pastors especially) things like, 'people in the world treat you better than church folk do'.  This may be true but let's not always confuse treatment with loving and caring.  Think about the treatment that we received from our parents when we were doing something that we weren't supposed to be.  Those folks that care the least about us are the ones that treat us great even though we are on the road to destruction. 

I am convinced that what causes most of the bitter venom that is spewed when speaking about 'church folk' is plain old spiritual immaturity and carnality.  It is people that want to subsist on milk and not meat. They want to do what they want to do regardless of what the word says.  They may want the truth but they only want it doled out in doses.   

What we have to realize is that if we truly seek a personal relationship with Christ, he will lead you into all truth and will create in you a perfect spirit that will give you a love for all people especially other Christians  regardless of their ignorance or other short comings real or perceived.  The bible tells us that in the counsel of a multitude there is safety.  If I'm going to be counseled by a multitude, I'd much rather it be folk that are concerned about my soul rather than my feelings (flesh).

Oh, and to answer my own question....Yes, with all of our imperfections Christians are absolutely the best that God has and I believe he wants us to start acting like we know it.

[OleJ]

When I use the term 'church folk', I'm talking about the folks who project the holier than thou type of image, like they can't do any wrong, and then, they get all out in the streets and get all buck wild and they KNOW they're wrong. You know the type, to borrow a verse from an old song, "Go to church and shout all day Sunday, go out and get drunk and raise hell all day Monday?" The church seems to be full of more of them than folks who try to honestly live right all 7 days of the week.

[LaylaMonroe]

When I use the term "church folks," I'm referring to people who go to church.     It's not a derogatory term for me.  I remember when I first joined LGM, I said something about church folks, and Jonathan just about took my head off! 

But anyway, excellent post, Axeman!

I have a lot more to add, but I'm a little on the sleepy side and I don't want to babble incoherently.

[LaylaMonroe]

Oh, and to answer my own question....Yes, with all of our imperfections Christians are absolutely the best that God has and I believe he wants us to start acting like we know it.

And to answer your question, I agree with you: TRUE Christians are indeed the best that God has.

[seemunny]

And to answer your question, I agree with you: TRUE Christians are indeed the best that God has.

Aww come on now! Fake christians need luh too!

Wait a minute!!....how we know who the fake christian is?...hmmmm 
Ok, im stuck!...

[sjonathan02]

When I use the term "church folks," I'm referring to people who go to church.     It's not a derogatory term for me.  I remember when I first joined LGM, I said something about church folks, and Jonathan just about took my head off! 

But anyway, excellent post, Axeman!

I have a lot more to add, but I'm a little on the sleepy side and I don't want to babble incoherently.

 

[changedman]

In 2008?  I say no.

They're not.

Because the 2008 definition of the word "Christian" is not the same as it was in 1998 (in the mind of the Believer).

I believe they were MEANT TO BE the best that God has, but are not....sadly.

[Fenix]

I have a lot more to add, but I'm a little on the sleepy side and I don't want to babble incoherently.

A little on the sleepy...ma'am, it was 2 in the blessed morning when you posted this. Go to bed.

WOW!!!!! 

 

Get back to bed RIGHT NOW!!!!!

What are ya'll thinking posting so early in the morning? 

[uriahsmusic]

....my thought is this...you can seek God till you turn blue in the face....if you ask for the spirit to guide you and you are Holy Ghost Filled and fire baptized...speaking in tongues as the spirit give utterance....repented for every negative thing you ever did and hope to do.....and decide to be nasty in the morning anyway.....you are gunna be perceived as nasty!

...and that is the state of church folk.....there are some who are sweet as sugar....it's a decision!...the Spirit doesn't make you do anything....it reminds you of what to do!!!!....YOU DECIDE WHAT TO DO....NOT THE SPIRIT...NOT GOD....NOT JESUS...AND SURELY NOT THE DEVIL!

Nasty folks in the church are nasty because they decide to be nasty....They are not stupid or ignorant...they are simply choosing to ignor that little voice in their head that says ...THAT IS WRONG...DONT DO IT!

.....SO WHEN WE DECIDE TO BE NICE.....JUST LIKE FOLKS THAT DONT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE SPIRIT...YOU WILL BE PERCEIVED AS NICE....

We as Christians have the Spirit to help us...but we must DO IT.....

[axeman1]

In 2008?  I say no.

They're not.

Because the 2008 definition of the word "Christian" is not the same as it was in 1998 (in the mind of the Believer).

I believe they were MEANT TO BE the best that God has, but are not....sadly.

Well I'm not changing the definition of the word.  By 'Christian', I'll just stay with the "whosoever believeth" definition.  The road of the believer is filled with so many ups, downs, ins and outs, times of little belief and times of no belief, that if we try to be the ones to determine who is or isn't a "true Christian" at any given time in a person's Christian walk, then we run the risk of judging. 

Now, I feel the need to distinguish the difference the difference between couseling and judging because there is a distinct difference that is too often lost on people.  Counseling is using the word of God to tell people what is or isn't right in the eyes of God.  Judging is telling people who is or isn't right.  This is not for us to do because we don't know the status of a person's personal relationship at any given time.  That's why God tells us to judge not that we be not judged. He never said not to tell others the criteria he established for righteousness.  He just wants us to present His word and let Him do the judging.

Now back to the original point.  Jesus's followers fell asleep when he needed them to keep watch over him, one lost his temper and tried to cut off a guy's head but instead only got his ear causing Jesus to have to clean up the mess, another denied even knowing him.  Yet Jesus loved them and used them to complete his purpose not because they were perfect, but because they were the best he had. I believe he could have done a more extensive search to find others that had better personal qualities than those guys but instead he used the ones that made an attempt to follow him.

[axeman1]

....my thought is this...you can seek God til you turn blue in the face....if you ask for the spirit to guide you and you are Holy Ghost Filled and fire baptized...speaking in tongues as the spirit give utterance....repented for every negative thing you ever did and hope to do.....and decide to be nasty in the morning anyway.....you are gunna be perceived as nasty!

I agree with what you are saying but I get the impression that you are misunderstanding the point I'm making when I talk about seeking a personal relationship with God. What I mean to say is that if we truly seek a personal relationship, he will lead us into truth thereby giving us confidence that we are in his will so that when others offend us by waking up and deciding to be nasty, our love for them, for ourselves and for God is unchanged.  Therefore we won't feel the need to speak disparagingly about them inspite of their faults.  We have to remember that these are indeed the very ones that he desires for us to eventually become one with.

[LaylaMonroe]

I agree with what you are saying but I get the impression that you are misunderstanding the point I'm making when I talk about seeking a personal relationship with God. What I mean to say is that if we truly seek a personal relationship, he will lead us into truth thereby giving us confidence that we are in his will so that when others offend us by waking up and deciding to be nasty, our love for them, for ourselves and for God is unchanged.  Therefore we won't feel the need to speak disparagingly about them inspite of their faults.  We have to remember that these are indeed the very ones that he desires for us to eventually become one with.

Very rich post... good stuff, Axeman.  Heavy.

[seemunny]

....my thought is this...you can seek God till you turn blue in the face....if you ask for the spirit to guide you and you are Holy Ghost Filled and fire baptized...speaking in tongues as the spirit give utterance....repented for every negative thing you ever did and hope to do.....and decide to be nasty in the morning anyway.....you are gunna be perceived as nasty!

...and that is the state of church folk.....there are some who are sweet as sugar....it's a decision!...the Spirit doesn't make you do anything....it reminds you of what to do!!!!....YOU DECIDE WHAT TO DO....NOT THE SPIRIT...NOT GOD....NOT JESUS...AND SURELY NOT THE DEVIL!

Nasty folks in the church are nasty because they decide to be nasty....They are not stupid or ignorant...they are simply choosing to ignor that little voice in their head that says ...THAT IS WRONG...DONT DO IT!

.....SO WHEN WE DECIDE TO BE NICE.....JUST LIKE FOLKS THAT DONT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE SPIRIT...YOU WILL BE PERCEIVED AS NICE....

We as Christians have the Spirit to help us...but we must DO IT.....

Wow...hard to improve on that one.

[musallio]

Wow..
I'll reserve my comments on this 1..


A quick comment though..

God's very best are the ones that avail themselves to Him to be used according to His will...ie, it can either be a Christian as strictly implied in the bible or not..
See Uriah's post for further clarity..

So it's not Christian's that are God's best, evryone open to His Will is..But ideal, God would want it to be Christians.

[EBChurchLady]

Wow..
I'll reserve my comments on this 1..


A quick comment though..

God's very best are the ones that avail themselves to Him to be used according to His will...ie, it can either be a Christian as strictly implied in the bible or not..
See Uriah's post for further clarity..

So it's not Christian's that are God's best, evryone open to His Will is..But ideal, God would want it to be Christians.

Axeman & Uriah, you guys have posted some good stuff!...a good reminder for me to check myself:
If I'm making myself available to the Lord (which I am)
Then every day I need to make sure I'm deciding to let the Spirit lead.
It's so easy for me to get caught up in negativity when people around me are complaining. The flesh wants to join right in, but the Spirit wants me to rise above it & be part of the solution & not part of the problem.
Good thread.

Musallio, I think it IS Christians that are God's best, because God's will is for us to bring others to Him. If a person isn't a Christian, then no matter how many good things they are doing, they won't have that same concern for souls as a Christain would (or should).

I'm not saying there aren't a LOT of unsaved folk out there who act nicer than true Christians, but it comes down to what Uriah said about CHOOSING to do what's right, and ultimately, to do God's will, you have His Spirit guiding you.

[nessalynn77]

I'm late, but you gave a great word here, axeman!

[musallio]

Axeman & Uriah, you guys have posted some good stuff!...a good reminder for me to check myself:
If I'm making myself available to the Lord (which I am)
Then every day I need to make sure I'm deciding to let the Spirit lead.
It's so easy for me to get caught up in negativity when people around me are complaining. The flesh wants to join right in, but the Spirit wants me to rise above it & be part of the solution & not part of the problem.
Good thread.

Musallio, I think it IS Christians that are God's best, because God's will is for us to bring others to Him. If a person isn't a Christian, then no matter how many good things they are doing, they won't have that same concern for souls as a Christain would (or should).
I'm not saying there aren't a LOT of unsaved folk out there who act nicer than true Christians, but it comes down to what Uriah said about CHOOSING to do what's right, and ultimately, to do God's will, you have His Spirit guiding you.

Gotcha

When I said this, I was proly thinking more along the lines of other people who are in fact seeking God's Will in their lives although they might not still be Christians..& not so much the Ghandis of this world.
illustr.:

There was this crusade once upon a time.
A local pastor from that area was going to preach in 1 of the sessions..
People were given the opportunity to testify..

This pastor saw this girl who he knew as a notorious/ promiscuous person around the area...also not saved!
So when the pastor saw the girl up there, he was hinting for her to get off stage..fortunately the girl didn't look his side.
The girl started off with a song "I Surrender All"..tears trickling down...this girl wasn't just singing..it' like she was repenting there of all that people knew her for..need I say that the whole house immediately experienced the presence of the Holy Ghost & the pastor just read from the scripture & started praying for folks since His message was going to be on "The Working of Holy Spirit"..

So there and then, this unsaved girl had been a vessel to spread about/ invite the presence of Holy Ghost in the house & who knows how Holy Spirit would have worked had the pastor just relied on his experience as a teacher on The Holy Spirit topic

[seemunny]

Gotcha

When I said this, I was proly thinking more along the lines of other people who are in fact seeking God's Will in their lives although they might not still be Christians..& not so much the Ghandis of this world.
illustr.:

There was this crusade once upon a time.
A local pastor from that area was going to preach in 1 of the sessions..
People were given the opportunity to testify..

This pastor saw this girl who he knew as a notorious/ promiscuous person around the area...also not saved!
So when the pastor saw the girl up there, he was hinting for her to get off stage..fortunately the girl didn't look his side.
The girl started off with a song "I Surrender All"..tears trickling down...this girl wasn't just singing..it' like she was repenting there of all that people knew her for..need I say that the whole house immediately experienced the presence of the Holy Ghost & the pastor just read from the scripture & started praying for folks since His message was going to be on "The Working of Holy Spirit"..

So there and then, this unsaved girl had been a vessel to spread about/ invite the presence of Holy Ghost in the house & who knows how Holy Spirit would have worked had the pastor just relied on his experience as a teacher on The Holy Spirit topic

Good point and interesting scenario Mus!

[EBChurchLady]

Gotcha

When I said this, I was proly thinking more along the lines of other people who are in fact seeking God's Will in their lives although they might not still be Christians..& not so much the Ghandis of this world.
illustr.:

There was this crusade once upon a time.
A local pastor from that area was going to preach in 1 of the sessions..
People were given the opportunity to testify..

This pastor saw this girl who he knew as a notorious/ promiscuous person around the area...also not saved!
So when the pastor saw the girl up there, he was hinting for her to get off stage..fortunately the girl didn't look his side.
The girl started off with a song "I Surrender All"..tears trickling down...this girl wasn't just singing..it' like she was repenting there of all that people knew her for..need I say that the whole house immediately experienced the presence of the Holy Ghost & the pastor just read from the scripture & started praying for folks since His message was going to be on "The Working of Holy Spirit"..

So there and then, this unsaved girl had been a vessel to spread about/ invite the presence of Holy Ghost in the house & who knows how Holy Spirit would have worked had the pastor just relied on his experience as a teacher on The Holy Spirit topic

So, did she get saved that night?
Sounds like her decision had already been made & she was making public what had taken place. That's awesome, BTW!!! 

I see what you're saying about the part in bold. I kinda think of them as PRE-Christian, rather than non-Christian! 

[musallio]

So, did she get saved that night?
Sounds like her decision had already been made & she was making public what had taken place. That's awesome, BTW!!! 

I see what you're saying about the part in bold. I kinda think of them as PRE-Christian, rather than non-Christian! 

I get ya well..

Well, from then on, the people, & certainly the pastor viewed her in a different light.

But like it's been said, Christians are God's best..That is why we are called ambassadors of Christ in II Corinthians...because not just any1 can be an ambassador.