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Author Topic: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?  (Read 8942 times)

Offline Wolfram

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Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« on: June 24, 2008, 04:50:12 PM »
I am improving my own jazz chops and I thought it be fun if I shared what I am learning with everyone here.  If you are interested, I could try to drop in music and chords etc... so that we all learn together.  I think that learning this style will make you a monster in everything else that you do.

Let me know if you are interested.

wolf

Offline 4hisglory

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2008, 04:56:43 PM »
I am in.  Just let me know what to do and how I can help.
:)

Offline sjonathan02

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2008, 05:21:11 PM »
I'm a beginner, so I'm interested. I'm really trying to find a way to foster independence in both hands. :-\
Despite our communication technology, no invention is as effective as the sound of the human voice.

Offline Muziqmann

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2008, 09:59:37 PM »
Yeah doc, I definatly interested. Sounds like a great opportunity for all of us, and we all should concider it.
When the minstrel played, the hand of the LORD was upon him.  II Kings 3:15

Offline seemunny

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2008, 03:58:40 AM »
I'm a beginner, so I'm interested. I'm really trying to find a way to foster independance in both hands. :-\


Are mine eyes deceiving me! Did Sjon misspell a word?
Uh oh! I think Jesus is on His way!

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Offline jonesl78

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2008, 04:51:24 PM »
I'm in

Offline Maestro87

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2008, 11:39:43 PM »
Count me in
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Dameron Growe

Offline diverse379

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2008, 06:51:20 AM »
I am down lets start

To be or not to be that is the question you anwer when you pray practice and read your word

Offline 4hisglory

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2008, 08:48:43 AM »
Waiting for what Wolfram has in mind.
:)

Offline diverse379

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2008, 09:28:58 AM »
Waiting for what Wolfram has in mind.
yeah me too

To be or not to be that is the question you anwer when you pray practice and read your word

Offline Wolfram

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2008, 02:23:02 PM »
Okay I think what I want to do here is start out with a refresher for everyone.  If this is all old hat to you let me know and I will move forward.  We will probably end up having two or three different threads going on this subjest:

Jazz 101. Jazz Intermediate and Jazz Advanced.  This way we do not waste a lot of time going over stuff that some of you already know and I can still help out those that are just starting out.  The only way to determine where YOU are is to be honest with yourself.  Push yourself to take in as much as you can.  I will tell you that I will use standard notation here if I can. (I am working on a flash program now, Maybe I can get the mods to let me post documents?)  Anyway that is the plan.

The first part is about language.  We will be using standard jazz lingo here so I wanted to make sure than we all know what that is:

Jazz uses the Roman Numeral system much like Gospel.  Let's lay out an Eb major scale:

                                                    Eb      F      G      Ab      Bb      C      D      Eb
Now, let's take that scale and place roman numerals under it:

                                                     Eb      F      G      Ab      Bb      C      D      Eb
                                                      I       II      III    IV        V       VI    VII     I

What does this all do for us?  It gives us a beacon for future reference and allows us to call the scale degree a proper name when talking about it in theory / improv.

I = Tonic.  The Key Note of the song (Prime)
II = Supertonic
III - Mediant.  (Halfway point from tonic to dominant)
IV - Subdominant
V - Dominant.  (This is the dominant element of the key)
VI - Submediant.  (Halfway point from tonic to subdominant)
VII - Leading tone. (with melody tending toward the tonic)

It does not matter what key you are in or what alteration you use this numbering system will stay the same

Examples:

C Harmonic Minor

C     D     Eb    F     G     Ab     B     C 
I     II     bIII   IV    V     bVI    VII   I

C Melodic Minor

C     D     Eb    F     G     Ab     B     C     Bb     Ab     G     F     Eb     D     C
I      II     bIII  IV    V     bVI   VII    I     bVII   bVI    V     IV    bIII    II     I

As you can see we can alter the roman numeral in these cases by adding an accidental in front of it (b or #) otherwise they stay the same, no matter what key.  This is called a moveable Do in solfage.  The tonic moves to the note that the key of the song centers on.

Ok, tell me when that settles and we will go on....

Offline ifiwereu

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2008, 09:40:55 PM »
Just thought I'd chime in here...since I see where you're going.

I-major triad or major 7th
II-minor triad or minor 7th
III-minor triad or minor 7th
IV-major triad or major 7th
V-major triad with dominant 7th
VI-minor triad or minor 7th
VII-half diminished 7th or minor flat 5th 7th

Although I prefer to relate to the C scale, in the context of Wolfran it would be
Eb major 7th, F minor 7th, G minor 7th, Ab major 7th, Bb dominant 7th, C minor 7th, and D half dim or minor flatted 5th 7th.

Bear in mind that is by no means a comprehensive scope. This is only the beginning. I imagine the next step would be to learn the inversions of those chords. I would learn it in C and not try to overwhelm myself with all keys just yet.

Jazz is like a language. One must learn what to do before learning how to do it. Learn the letters, then words, syllables, sentences, then passages.
In other words, learn the notes, then intervals like thirds, sixths, fifths...then 10ths later, and notice I said later. After intervals, comes chords. Start with simple triads then add the major and minor or dominant 7ths. Once chords are mastered then progressions follow. Ok...I'll quit for now...cause it gets better....

Offline Wolfram

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2008, 09:45:14 PM »
Don't jump ahead yet my young padawan... :)

We are only talking about the begining building blocks.  Once we get into chordal structures we can discuss how to your the Roman Numeral system for this (capital and small lettering)

:o)

I placed things in Eb for our Gospel based brothers...  I can do things in C if everyone is agreed...

Offline seemunny

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2008, 01:37:26 AM »
Let me just say, i think this is a wonderful learning activity. However, (to everyone participating), just keep in mind as we go along to "keep it user friendly", and although musical terminology is very needed to a degree to communicate your musical ideas, try to keep in mind "simplicity" and don't allow your "academic prowess" to take away from the people's actual UNDERSTANDING.

Very simple ideas can sometimes be spoken in the most "difficult" ways. Just watch out for that! Even if you have to use "baby talk" lol. Because it's more important to "understand" from baby talk, than to NOT understand from great linguistic skills. lol

Don't try to "out-do" one another with unnecessary "big words & impressive complexed concepts" when teaching & sharing your thoughts.

I appreciate all of this, and i'm not being negatively critical. But, since this is STILL only in the beginning stage,  i just thought the point that i'm attempting to make is sooooo very important to keep in mind to make this a more successful experience.

That's all. I think this is a wonderful idea!

8)

Offline Wolfram

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2008, 06:51:31 AM »
Alright... That was lesson one.  I put it in the Jazz 101 section and will continue that run there.  In the Intermediate section I will start talking about the A/B voicing for II - V7 - I chords and why they are SOOOO important to get a handle on, so if you want to jump ahead that would be a good place to go.  Finally, In the Master Class area a discussion has started about voicing preferences.  It should proove to be fun.

See you soon with more stuff.  I am still waiting on a response from the mods about posting pdf files so I can use actually written examples here.  A picture is worth a 1000 words.

Wolf

Offline diverse379

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2008, 11:37:05 AM »
Alright... That was lesson one.  I put it in the Jazz 101 section and will continue that run there.  In the Intermediate section I will start talking about the A/B voicing for II - V7 - I chords and why they are SOOOO important to get a handle on, so if you want to jump ahead that would be a good place to go.  Finally, In the Master Class area a discussion has started about voicing preferences.  It should proove to be fun.

See you soon with more stuff.  I am still waiting on a response from the mods about posting pdf files so I can use actually written examples here.  A picture is worth a 1000 words.

Wolf

pdf files will be a big plus how bout it mods
To be or not to be that is the question you anwer when you pray practice and read your word

Offline Wolfram

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2008, 11:40:02 AM »
Aha,

I will just have to use jpg's then  bwaaa haaa haaa haaa..

See Jazz 101 thread :)

Offline musallio

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #17 on: August 05, 2008, 08:31:23 PM »
Exercises 54 & 55 are just what I needed from the intermediate section.
I can't wait to see what lesson 2 is about.. 8)
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Offline dereknae

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2009, 02:12:37 PM »
count on me

Offline Yulandop

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Re: Anyone want to improve their jazz chops with me?
« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2009, 07:44:53 PM »
I'm in
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