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Author Topic: Soul Playing....  (Read 5116 times)

Offline gtrdave

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2009, 11:28:15 PM »
you mean, his "royal been playing the same 3 songs with different titles on every cd for 20 yearsness"?? lol...i used to love Joe, but man has he gotten repetitive to me...

Preach it!
I was a big Joe fan during his early years, but I couldn't hang with anything past "Flying in a Blue Dream". Like Yngwie and many others, every "new" album sounded like all of the previous albums.
Music theory is not always music reality.

Offline jlynnb1

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #21 on: January 20, 2009, 02:46:57 AM »
Preach it!
I was a big Joe fan during his early years, but I couldn't hang with anything past "Flying in a Blue Dream". Like Yngwie and many others, every "new" album sounded like all of the previous albums.

exactly...there are songs on all his cd's i dig...but i always think, this sounds like THAT song. i guess all instrumental stuff is like that to an extent, but with satch you know you are going to get you up-tempo mixolydian rocker, ballad, mid tempo lydian thing, and a dorian based funk tune. he just never seems to stretch...

Offline Gibby

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #22 on: January 20, 2009, 06:52:18 AM »
hmmm...sit and play modes to get the sound and mood of the scale...crazy but might work!!!

Isn't that what Eric Johnson does in all of his live versions of "cliffs of dover"?  ?/?

Offline Fenix

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #23 on: January 20, 2009, 08:21:23 AM »
hmmm...sit and play modes to get the sound and mood of the scale...crazy but might work!!!

Isn't that what Eric Johnson does in all of his live versions of "cliffs of dover"?  ?/?

Dude, it does work. Yesterday i sat down and played around with a couple of minor modes and i was stunned at the variety of sound you can get if you mix 'em up. I got some new soloing ideas just by doing that.

Good stuff.
The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline Rown

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #24 on: January 20, 2009, 10:57:40 AM »
    I bet this guy do not know what a mode is.We are getting so technical with our playing.Trust in what GOD blessed you with.
                     YOUR EARS

Offline Fenix

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #25 on: January 20, 2009, 11:51:58 AM »
    I bet this guy do not know what a mode is.We are getting so technical with our playing.Trust in what GOD blessed you with.
                     YOUR EARS

Which guy do you mean Rown cuz if you mean Satch, he MOST DEFINITELY knows his modes. ;D 
The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline gtrdave

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2009, 11:54:58 AM »
    I bet this guy do not know what a mode is.We are getting so technical with our playing.Trust in what GOD blessed you with.
                     YOUR EARS

Amen...but some of us are blessed with a desire to want to know more and to better understand that which God gave us. Music is just another language and I'd like to know more than my basic ABCs so that I can better communicate with others in that language.

If all you see or hear in what you don't understand as "technical" then I'm afraid that you're missing the beauty and diversity inherent in the language of music. God placed it there. All we're doing is trying to understand it and then use it in a way that is unique to how God made us.
Music theory is not always music reality.

Offline Rown

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #27 on: January 20, 2009, 12:15:28 PM »
Which guy do you mean Rown cuz if you mean Satch, he MOST DEFINITELY knows his modes. ;D 
No,not him.The other guy. ;)

Offline Rown

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #28 on: January 20, 2009, 12:18:12 PM »
Dave you are so right.I left out alot,cause i trying to do this and watch tv at the same time.

Offline gtrdave

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #29 on: January 20, 2009, 12:21:45 PM »
Dave you are so right.I left out alot,cause i trying to do this and watch tv at the same time.

Gotcha, my friend. I happened to have a couple minutes to sit and blab with my fingers.
If I didn't you would have gotten the short answer.  ;D

Ok, now I gotta get back to work.
Music theory is not always music reality.

Offline jlynnb1

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #30 on: January 20, 2009, 02:02:54 PM »
    I bet this guy do not know what a mode is.We are getting so technical with our playing.Trust in what GOD blessed you with.
                     YOUR EARS

sorry Rown...there is nothing wrong with wanting to know what you are playing. i will never understand why people don't want to inform their musicianship with knowledge.

because of theory and knowledge...i can hear the first few brs of a song and immediately recognize the tonality, what scales will work, what won't...i can immediately predict what chords will be played, can feel the movement of the song. i'd much rahter have that knowledge than to just be stumbling around hoping i hit the right notes.

Offline Gibby

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #31 on: January 20, 2009, 02:30:14 PM »
sorry Rown...there is nothing wrong with wanting to know what you are playing. i will never understand why people don't want to inform their musicianship with knowledge.

because of theory and knowledge...i can hear the first few brs of a song and immediately recognize the tonality, what scales will work, what won't...i can immediately predict what chords will be played, can feel the movement of the song. i'd much rahter have that knowledge than to just be stumbling around hoping i hit the right notes.

cosign!! How else can you help out other people if you don't know what you're doing?

Offline Fenix

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #32 on: January 20, 2009, 03:08:49 PM »
cosign!! How else can you help out other people if you don't know what you're doing?

Yup! This is why i don't bother asking help from people who know no theory and play solely by ear. I just don't like the "use your ear" answer very much. :)
The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline JayP5150

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #33 on: January 20, 2009, 05:16:38 PM »
sorry Rown...there is nothing wrong with wanting to know what you are playing. i will never understand why people don't want to inform their musicianship with knowledge.

because of theory and knowledge...i can hear the first few brs of a song and immediately recognize the tonality, what scales will work, what won't...i can immediately predict what chords will be played, can feel the movement of the song. i'd much rahter have that knowledge than to just be stumbling around hoping i hit the right notes.

Agreed.

I prefer this order of ops:
1: ears
2: heart/soul/mojo/funk/stank etc. (whatever you may call it)
3: mind

You really can't have any of those three without the others intact, IMHO. Well, to an extent...

Now, that said... I need to hit the (music) books lol...

Offline Rown

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #34 on: January 21, 2009, 12:26:05 AM »
Man i know some theory,it is not all that.It will not make you great.Did Jimi know theory.?NO ;D ;DHey man,learn i the theory you want to.Why you learning, i am JAMMING.

Offline jlynnb1

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #35 on: January 21, 2009, 12:42:53 AM »
for every player that has a special ear and can get by without theory, i'll give you a thousand that couldn't play in key to save their lives.

Offline Gibby

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #36 on: January 21, 2009, 08:20:57 AM »
Man i know some theory,it is not all that.It will not make you great.Did Jimi know theory.?NO ;D ;DHey man,learn i the theory you want to.Why you learning, i am JAMMING.

Rown, pretty soon the "just play" theory runs out.  That's what I was told "just play".  I hit a wall.  Thoery will help you enhance your playing.

Song writers who play guitar MUST know theory.  Jimi had a very unique gift that VERY few people have. 

Experience (jamming) and education (music theory) must co-exist in someone to make them BAADDDDDD!  :D

Offline Fenix

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #37 on: January 21, 2009, 09:31:11 AM »
Rown, pretty soon the "just play" theory runs out.  That's what I was told "just play".  I hit a wall.  Thoery will help you enhance your playing.


That accursed wall. Its horrible man! You just get to the point where you hate your instrument cuz its the same sounds coming out of it and you want a new sound but don't know how to get it.

I have a few books on scales and chord progressions. Whenever i feel myself nearing that brick wall, i just learn a new scale and work with that or i learn new chords and stuff.

The car, job, house wife/husband are not the reward, God is.

Offline Rown

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #38 on: January 21, 2009, 11:07:11 AM »
for every player that has a special ear and can get by without theory, i'll give you a thousand that couldn't play in key to save their lives.


Well take away theory, you can still play.If did`t have ears can you play.No cause you could not hear.It is a good thing to have a good ear for music,i don`t care what anybody say.

Offline gtrdave

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Re: Soul Playing....
« Reply #39 on: January 21, 2009, 12:19:04 PM »
Well take away theory, you can still play.If did`t have ears can you play.No cause you could not hear.It is a good thing to have a good ear for music,i don`t care what anybody say.

Why are you choosing to fight an opponent that's not there?
As far as I've read no one said that it's a bad thing to use your ears for music. On the contrary I ALWAYS encourage people to listen at least as much as they play. Listening is as important as saying something.
That said, increased knowledge of any language comes from listening AND from studying. If you just listen, you'll only hear so much and miss a lot, so listening has limitations.
Also, there's another factor to all this and that's in being able to hear more complex music and rightly discern what is going on. Maybe that's for your own understanding and maybe it's to better communicate with others who perform more complex music or to teach others, too.

You don't HAVE TO KNOW theory to know how to play music and there are some (although they're rare) who know very little and yet are great musicians (Todd Rundgren is one person I can think of), but that's no excuse to limit yourself if you have the desire to know more. I know some players who "just play" and they've made a decent living for themselves for decades, playing the same old blues licks over and over. And for every one of them are probably hundreds of others who "just play" and have all but hung up their guitar for lack of knowledge; they hit a wall and have no motivation to get around, over, under or through it.
I choose to not be one of them.
Music theory is not always music reality.
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