new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?

[floaded27]

back story:
playing for my jurisdictional choir was a blessing because it gave me the opportunity to play with some good musicians but its come with its set of problems. when i first started playing i was upset because i was the one playing at rehearsals (the main bass guy was in school so he couldnt make it to rehearsal) but he would take over and play every song the day of the musical. I was mad at him (and my brother was mad when i told him after he would always ask why i wasnt playing). But i found out what was really happening. It wasnt that he wanted to take over (of course he wanted to play, what musician doesnt at a musical?), rather he was told to play by the president of the jurisdictional music ministry because he was the better bass player. The Lord explained it to me better by reminding me of what happened to me playing for our church b-ball team years ago. Coming to every practice, hustling my butt off, following directions etc just to be sat on the bench to give time to dudes who didnt even show up to any practices (some just joined the team right before the game). But I couldnt be mad at the guys (they just wanna play). its the COACH's fault!!!! So i understand it was not his doing, and we're cool.


current situation:
So this year they wanted him to play keys, and the president was getting requests from others to play bass, and she asked him who to get because he was the main bass player. he said nobody, only me and the other guy should play bass because we been there (but the pres. didnt tell me all that, he did) So at the initial rehearsal, it was announce that I would be the main bass player, and the other backup would be the 2nd bass player, and the original bass player, who was moved to keys, would help us out with the material. And we were all cool with that.

So i go to rehearsal yesterday evening and some dude with a bass is sitting there. in my mind im like "who are u and why are u here" but i didnt say nothin. so im going to set up and the pres. comes over there talkin to him and i overhear the conversation. she is basically telling him that she called him in to learn the material so he can play for the musical and they gonna pay him. saying she wants a professional and all that stuff. so im heated, i didnt even want to hook my stuff up. why should i. so im just standing there and the vice pres. (he works directly with the musicians and also plays keys or organ on some of the songs) came to me and said "is everything ok" and i just told him "im just gonna keep it to myself" and i was about to say and then i said again "i'll just keep it to myself" and he looked at me and said "i know what ur thinking. we're on the same page. im gonna take care of it"

so in the meantime dude sees my GK MB²500 and starts askin me questions about it. im trying my best not to flip out on this dude, so i try to answer the questions as cordial as possible but also brief as possible. I KNOW its not his fault, he's just there because he was ASKED to be, but i still dont wanna say NOTHIN to this dude!! then she sees me standing there and asks am i gonna plug up my stuff, and im like in my head "why the *heck* should i" but i know thats not me, so i say yeah. Then dude asks to use my tuner. Im like dude is just askin for me to flip, just askin. So the first song starts and I start playing (im basic and pocket when playing so i dont do riffs every opportunity, but i guess to some people that just means i cant play.) so he asks me can he play because she wants him to learn this song. I am so ready to act like a 10-year old right now. but i just do the shoulder shrug w/ the "i dont know" like im clueless about what he's saying (y'all know that move. lol) so she looks over and says to me "let him play this song". im pissed but i just let him play.

So im sitting there ready to quit (mind you the other guy thats supposed to play took his bass and left, and i think he quit altogether). I was like i didnt wanna make a scene because im sure other people didnt understand and it'll look like once again a whiny musician didnt get his way or didnt get to play and is acting like a child. and i figured that because other people looked clueless about it or didnt even notice. But all of the musicians asked was i ok, because they knew what the deal was once they saw this new dude there.

im like this and i told the vp "i understand if y'all want the music department and all its activities to be great. and thats cool. but if you feel that im not good enough for that vision to happen, tell me that. i can be doing other things. i turned down people askin if i could play bass because i was workin with y'all. but dont tell me im going to be doing something and then get someone else". The VP told me he told her and the other lady about that, and that next rehearsal will be totally different. So i'll see what happens next rehearsal.

*modified word (no profanity on LGM*

[ddwilkins]

Put it like this, don't be used by anyone. If they wanted a "professional" to play, then he should have had his own equipment with him. When she asked you to allow him to play, you had every right to take your equipment down. I've done it before and don't care about doing it again. It's 2010, and I have a new mindset when it comes down to music and me playing for someone or groups. So to answer your question, you did neither the right thing nor wrong thing, imho. Let the president know where you stand and go from there. Don't sit back and let the VP speak for you.

[betnich]

It sounds like you and the president have some issues that need to be discussed...go to her directly.

[under13]

Put it like this, don't be used by anyone. If they wanted a "professional" to play, then he should have had his own equipment with him. When she asked you to allow him to play, you had every right to take your equipment down. I've done it before and don't care about doing it again. It's 2010, and I have a new mindset when it comes down to music and me playing for someone or groups. So to answer your question, you did neither the right thing nor wrong thing, imho. Let the president know where you stand and go from there. Don't sit back and let the VP speak for you.

It sounds like you and the president have some issues that need to be discussed...go to her directly.

I agree.

I guess thats just part of being an up and coming musician. Almost everybody goes though something like this. I'm glad that you didn't flip out, because that would not have been good for you reputation.

I honestly wouldn't  even wait until the next rehearsal to speak to the president, I would call her today and see whats going on.

[floaded27]

It sounds like you and the president have some issues that need to be discussed...go to her directly.

to be honest, i wouldnt even know what to say. i know she means well, but i dont think she fully understands how decisions like this affect the people involved. if someone was to do this spitefully, i'd know how to handle it, but these kinds of cases im really unsure how to handle things or what to say.

I agree.

I guess thats just part of being an up and coming musician. Almost everybody goes though something like this. I'm glad that you didn't flip out, because that would not have been good for you reputation.

I honestly wouldn't  even wait until the next rehearsal to speak to the president, I would call her today and see whats going on.

and i'd rather see what happens next rehearsal since my equipment is still there. if things didnt work out, i'd rather not have to come back to pick up my stuff and be subject to questions and all the other stuff. i'd rather just cut things and be on my way.

the problem in church is that to most people ur ALWAYS "up and coming" UNLESS a) you make a name for yourself (which is next to impossible to do exclusively as a musician and NOT on the organ) or b) ur pops or ur moms is someone well known or some other relative

[ddwilkins]

...

and i'd rather see what happens next rehearsal since my equipment is still there. if things didnt work out, i'd rather not have to come back to pick up my stuff and be subject to questions and all the other stuff. i'd rather just cut things and be on my way.

...

Why worry about questions and what others have to say? If that's your equipment, you may do as you please and have to answer to no one. I had to recently send an email to my pastor and assistant pastor about someone messing with my board (motif es7). I copied my band leader and asked him was I too harsh. He said I could have said it differently, but he said sometimes you have to get your point across. My email was just straight to the point, "no one is to touch my board without my permission." I don't see gray, I see black or white and as my stepfather says, "I call a spade a spade." I'm not going to beat around the bush. BTW, just tell the President how you feel. As the president and an adult, she should be open to how you feel about the situation, if not, that's not the position for her.

[6stringapprentice]

Man I absolutely HATE stuff like this. I will say I have been on the other side of the fence. People ask you to come to a rehearsal and you show up and there is already a bass player there. So you are standing there with your gigbag looking like a class a dunce and people start saying oh let him play. Let me tell you it is one awkward situation. I try to do myself show myself friendly. Introduce myself "Hey man do you mind me playing this song?" Stuff like that. I am MOST certainly about to plug into someone elses rig without there permission esp if they are right there. I can tell you that if a pres or someone tried that foolishness with my rig my power and speakon cables would magically dissapear and so would I.

I am a firm believer there is a way to do things. I am not sure why non-musicians ei directors, choir presidents, pastors etc dont realize that most musicians don't deal with our fellow musicians like this and when they pull stuff like this they are creating unecessary and unmerited animosity between musicians. I am sure no pastor would appreciate if he was getting up to preach if his bishop walked in and took the podium and gave the message.

I'm not usre why people don't believe in sharing anymore. It's like there is these musicians and they HAVE to play or else the whole thing will fall apart. I try to make sure anytime I am at an event with other bassist to make sure and ask if anyone else wants to play.

Anyways I would suggest you talk to the other bassist and see where his head is. If he's cool tell him the situation and you can probably get some support from him when talking to the president. I know most musicians aren't for mistreatment of our fellow musicians. Now if they start talking about messing with his money you might be on your own.

[ddwilkins]

.... I am MOST certainly about to plug into someone elses rig without there permission esp if they are right there. I can tell you that if a pres or someone tried that foolishness with my rig my power and speakon cables would magically dissapear and so would I.

I am a firm believer there is a way to do things. I am not sure why non-musicians ei directors, choir presidents, pastors etc dont realize that most musicians don't deal with our fellow musicians like this and when they pull stuff like this they are creating unecessary and unmerited animosity between musicians. I am sure no pastor would appreciate if he was getting up to preach if his bishop walked in and took the podium and gave the message.

......

My type of magician, oops I mean musician!!!!!!

You said something that is so true. Incidents like this cause animosity amongst musicians all because non-musicians have no clue of how to handle things from a musicians stand point. I have no problem, like you, sharing the stage or set with other musicians, as longs as we are all aware of this and egos don't get involved. I've been there, done that.

[arthur59]

why waite until the next rehearsal,if you do you may have sleepless nights worrying about this situation I went through this same thing years back...if she feels like your not good enough and wants another bass player, she needs to let you know ASAP so you won't waste your time..and the other dude needs to bring his own equipment.

[Torch7]

Hey floaded27, I just want to say... "I think you totally did the right thing!"...  Even in your post you made statements, that show that God was working in the midst of the situation.

I am not trying to excuse the situation, in my opinion it probably could have been handled differently, on the part of those running the rehearsal.  But on the outside looking in, I think God would be smiling about the way you handled the situation.  Like you said, you could have thrown a temper tantrum, and lots of folks would say your were justified in doing so.  But I believe God uses situations just like this to develop our Character. 

I know it may not mean much, but I am proud of you Man of God!  Keep suffering well, and he will reward you.

Peace.

[floaded27]

Why worry about questions and what others have to say? If that's your equipment, you may do as you please and have to answer to no one. I had to recently send an email to my pastor and assistant pastor about someone messing with my board (motif es7). I copied my band leader and asked him was I too harsh. He said I could have said it differently, but he said sometimes you have to get your point across. My email was just straight to the point, "no one is to touch my board without my permission." I don't see gray, I see black or white and as my stepfather says, "I call a spade a spade." I'm not going to beat around the bush. BTW, just tell the President how you feel. As the president and an adult, she should be open to how you feel about the situation, if not, that's not the position for her.

its not questions about the equipment. i do what i want with it for sure. The questions i mean was people i know and are cool with asking me why im quitting and trying to convince me to stay aboard should i choose to leave.

And they do cause animosity between musicians. but so does the sense of entitlement that other musicians have as well. so when certain people just pop up in rehearsal, they just have to play (almost exclusively organists and keyboardists on this side). so while people be tellin me to stand up, they take the same crap, just a different shade of brown.  Im like this, if im playin ball on the courts and Lebron James shows up, he need to call "next" if he wanna play. But i just dont know where the line is of getting this point across and being representative of a saved respectful man. (cause the things in my head i wanna say or do sometimes be far from Christ-like and i dont want to make God ashamed of me and my behavior, because i can come off quite harsh) and thats my biggest concern above all else.

[Torch7]

But i just dont know where the line is of getting this point across and being representative of a saved respectful man. (cause the things in my head i wanna say or do sometimes be far from Christ-like and i dont want to make God ashamed of me and my behavior, because i can come off quite harsh) and thats my biggest concern above all else.

I once heard someone say, you can't stop birds from flying over head, but you can stop them from making a nest.  If we are all truthful, we could tell you that Crazy thoughts are always popping into our heads, sometimes people don't even have to be bothering me and crazy stuff jumps right in.

We have to remember we have a Carnal nature that fights against God and the things of God.  But the fact that you endured every temptation that came your way that day says, that says you are blessed, your behavoir isn't the thoughts that hit your mind.  You behavior is how you act despite the things that hit your mind.

James 1:12 "Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him"  I find it ironic that it says, he that endures tempation, is blessed, not him that doesn't face it at all... Stay blessed br'er!

- from another over analytical brother

[mjl422]

its not questions about the equipment. i do what i want with it for sure. The questions i mean was people i know and are cool with asking me why im quitting and trying to convince me to stay aboard should i choose to leave.

And they do cause animosity between musicians. but so does the sense of entitlement that other musicians have as well. so when certain people just pop up in rehearsal, they just have to play (almost exclusively organists and keyboardists on this side). so while people be tellin me to stand up, they take the same crap, just a different shade of brown.  Im like this, if im playin ball on the courts and Lebron James shows up, he need to call "next" if he wanna play. But i just dont know where the line is of getting this point across and being representative of a saved respectful man. (cause the things in my head i wanna say or do sometimes be far from Christ-like and i dont want to make God ashamed of me and my behavior, because i can come off quite harsh) and thats my biggest concern above all else.

If it were me, I would remind her that she told me that I was moving to the primary bass position and ask her why did she feel the need to bring in another bass player.  If she says she would rather have him, I would pack my equipment and move on to other opportunities.  Remember, your gift will make room for you.  There are other opportunities for your gifts to be used and appreciated. Don't worry about what other people say/think.  Just don't kill your witness in the process of making your move.   

[jeremyr]

doc i would've packed up and left in the middle of rehearsal. They didn't show you ANY respect.

[Sadowsky1]

Brother Bass Player,

I would handle it as soon as possible because bad feelings tend to brew like over time. It may blow out of proportion. But also if you let go once it will happen again.

James

[Mysteryman]

I've been though this type of stuff for years. lol I try not to let it get to me. That's why I pray alot. I let the Spirit set me apart from the rest. Not sure if I would have let dude play through my stuff or not but I would make sure they know I have other stuff to do if I'm not playing. I would just tell them next time I won't be there. Don't put all your eggs in one basket it a true saying. I've had to play at my church more recently but if the other dude comes back I will be back on course the next week.  Resting, practicing at home, or studying. Last night we had limited time and the directress kept stopping discussing with the altos about their part instead of singing the part with them until they got it. I kept playing most of the time as if we ain't wasting no time tonight. lol At one point I did a Johnny Costa move like going down the keys and slowing down as if everything was coming to a stop. People started laughing and she even laugh. I think she got the picture. lol

It's best to speak your peace then take action. I used to ne the guy that got over looked. Even now I still get over looked. Some how God makes it where they always have to come back to me. Many people actually prefer me playing than the other musician but some of the leaders prefer him over me.

[phbrown]

You are much nicer than me. I would not have even came back after last year.

[dhagler]

First of all, my compliments to my LGM family for giving good counsel.

floaded, I think you have found the source of the problem. It is certainly not with the other bass player, but rather with the president. Pray, take a deep breath, and discuss your concerns with her. Then pray again before you decide what course of action to take next. As for the people who might question your decision, a smile and an "I've prayed about it and I feel that it's best that I leave." should satisfy even the most persistent folks.

[ssab]

Been in your shoes many times in my early years of playing in the church, i'm talking situations just like yours. Now when someone wants me to come play at their church,(which i do not do much anymore.... getting too old for this lol) i always ask two main questions 1) do you have a bassist, if the answer is yes then 2) why dont you use him. Because  i will not tresspass  on another bassist property. It is very UNCOOL to do that to someone especially if that musician doesnt even know someone else is showing up to play. The last few times i thought i might walk into a situation likes this, i enter the church without my bass and chatted with the other musicians first. if something wasn't right i lefted.

[Fingers!]

So you left to right the situation. Wacawacawacah 


All in all I would pray. If God said it's cool to leave I would if he didn't I would definitely talk to the persons involved to make sure they know I don't appreciate that and if it happened again I would take actions. Sometimes you have to put your foot down. If they don't want you to play after that you can do the other stuff you need to do and be available if they need you.

God always exposes people who try to hide stuff I've seen it time and time over. Even it was recently exposed to me the amount of money they were paying the other musician. I actually tried to go to the other musician that I felt he always played over me. He basically denied it said I don't play aggressive enough. lol this was months ago. I really felt he was intimidated by me and just had no respect for me.

I prayed to the Lord recently and said Lord I don't think this guy respects me as a musician prove me if I'm wrong and I will repent. lol A little bold but I believe it was the Lord showing me that he didn't respect me, but the bible says he will make your enemies your footstool.  All you have to do is let God fight for you and stay on your knees. I'm getting his money now temporarily. lol I started not to take it but prayed first. I believe God was blessing me because I've had over $1500 in bills last month. I find it amusing at times like David and Saul. Saul kept trying to kill David missed the fact that God's hand was on David.

One of the worst things you can do is try to mess with a musician that has a heart for God. Many of us have instruments but some of us are just playing. 

Say that again...