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Author Topic: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?  (Read 6660 times)

Offline betnich

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #20 on: February 17, 2010, 11:21:27 AM »
One of the worst things you can do is try to mess with a musician that has a heart for God. Many of us have instruments but some of us are just playing.  :D


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Offline browntree

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2010, 11:34:34 AM »
Put it like this, don't be used by anyone. If they wanted a "professional" to play, then he should have had his own equipment with him. When she asked you to allow him to play, you had every right to take your equipment down. I've done it before and don't care about doing it again. It's 2010, and I have a new mindset when it comes down to music and me playing for someone or groups. So to answer your question, you did neither the right thing nor wrong thing, imho. Let the president know where you stand and go from there. Don't sit back and let the VP speak for you.

Good points...I've shown up to a rehearsal and there was another bass player (that I knew nothing about).  It had nothing to do with skill (most of the time it doesn't)...it was just folk and their ego tripping and power struggle issues.  In my case, I had a personal conversation with the other bassist and explained to him that I was the bass player and he had no idea he was being used.  Then I left and got the situation straight with the proper authorities.

Trust me professionalism is more than just being able to play well.  Don't let others define your professionalism.  It involves, business sense, effective communication, having the proper resources, and when that's said and done, performance. 

Browntree

And David spake to the chief of the Levites to appoint their brethren to be the singers with instruments of music, psalteries and harps and cymbals, sounding, by lifting up the voice with joy. I Chronicles 15:16

Offline Mysteryman

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #22 on: February 17, 2010, 11:47:22 AM »
I understand an individual's need for power and money and yet it still baffles me when I see selfish people fighting over position, power, and prestige. If God doesn't anoint you for a position you're just warming a seat for someone else.  :D
Vision without action is just day dreaming. I miss practicing.

Offline dhagler

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2010, 05:29:53 PM »
In my case, I had a personal conversation with the other bassist and explained to him that I was the bass player and he had no idea he was being used.  Then I left and got the situation straight with the proper authorities.

I like the way you handled that. :)

Offline kevmove02

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #24 on: February 18, 2010, 12:13:06 PM »
You have a really difficult situation because it appears that whatever action you decide to take, someone will be able to say, "you could have handled it differently". If I were in your situation, I know what I would like to do. However, I am going to try to advise you on what you should do.

As much as I would like to think otherwise, you are participating in a semi-cooperative, competitive environment. While each person is motivated to play well with others (literally and figuratively), each person also has consider that their "seat" is granted to them by the authority of another. Therefore, each person has to retain the "right" to be first chair based on their relationship with and the perception of their value to the leader. In your case, the president, by her actions, is clearly telling you that she does not think you have earned the right to first chair. So unless you believe she is open to reconsidering her perception of your playing ability, it is not likely that she will change her mind of her own accord.

So your next decision is whether you can live with this until a change comes. If you are certain that her perception of your skill can be changed by determination and hard work, then it may be worth sticking it out, especially if you are getting a lot of benefits out of rehearsals with your group of musicians. However, if she is dead set against you playing first chair, regardless of your skill level, then you may want to move on to greener pastures. You may be tempted to believe that staying is the right thing to do and is best course of action to preserve your "witness" but keep in mind that PEOPLE CHANGE JOBS ALL THE TIME. If you are unhappy in your place of work, do you stick it out or do you look for a better employment opportunity?

We tend to look at activities related to the church as though we have to stay in the same part of the vineyard until we are "graveyard" dead. But each week, there are thousands of fellowships that desire to have commited musicians who will play for the "love of the game." If you choose to stay in your current situation, it's because you think there is something there that is worth overcoming some adversity to achieve. However, if that is not the case, respectly resign and seek another opportunity. One of the world's largest evangelistic movements got started because its leader didn't fit in in the mission he tried to join. One day, he was told that he didn't fit. He agreed and and left to start Operation Mobilization.

Offline floaded27

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #25 on: February 18, 2010, 11:31:10 PM »
so i get a text message today saying that a meeting was held with the president and they decided that they werent gonna use that guy as one of the bass players, but Dwayne Wright will be playing for the musical. So im supposed to be ok because its Dwayne Wright!!?? Isnt this still the same situation??? I dont care who name u fill in the blank with, it still isnt right. And if you make me main bass player shouldnt u even ask am I ok with that? It was bad enough when I didnt get to play when they invited the Clark Sisters, but was made to come on stage and sit there for all 3 songs our choir sang. But i took one to the jaw cause I was the backup. But you make me the main player and im subject to the same thing?


So even if i said ok, i'll make an exception because its him (as if!!), here would be the deal. Either
1. he would come to rehearsal and play every song, leaving me with no practice time with the rest of the band, but actually just learning songs on my own (i could do that at home...wait, i do. sometimes even upload videos here on LGM)
OR
2. he wouldnt show up at rehearsal at all, leaving me playing all the songs with the band in rehearsal but dont get to play during the musical, which straight up aint fair!!

so its a lose-lose situation, so i'm going in monday to pick up my equipment and resigning as bass player for the jurisdiction. i may even ask for my $10 back for the bus for the out of town engagement that the are going to.
For my God... let "Golden Axe" prevail.

Offline betnich

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #26 on: February 18, 2010, 11:42:53 PM »
Communication - letting you know via text message IMO was not cool.
Looks to me like the Powers That Be want to keep you on 'second string' - like a benchwarmer on a football team, sent in to play when the starting player can't make it. Only you can decide if you're willing to do that.

...Seems you are not the only one who could have 'handled it better".....

Offline under13

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #27 on: February 18, 2010, 11:59:25 PM »
That was very disrespectful of them. I think you did the right thing.

Offline cordney

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #28 on: February 19, 2010, 04:55:04 AM »
I would be very angry but remember it isn't DW's fault! 
‎"It is okay to fail, it is unacceptable to become a failure"

Offline berbie

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #29 on: February 19, 2010, 07:19:54 AM »
It is understandable where you are coming from.  You have a toe hold on a enviable posittion. Hope springs eternal, and you believe (wish) that if you hold on, success will come to you to the extent that you will be fully accepted and respected as the go to bassist in all situations for your organization.  So even in the face of clearly unjustifiable behavior on the part of the powers that be, you remain. Relax.  Many have been there.

Only you can decide.  Loyalty, trust, respect is a door that must swing two ways, though. It didn't seem to be swinging for you.  Would it really change? 

Best wishes for you whatever your decision. 



 

Offline ddwilkins

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #30 on: February 19, 2010, 09:09:36 AM »
Few points:

1. its very disrespectful to recieve a text about a decision.
2. remember, its not DW's fault
3. last but not least, man up next time and speak up on how you feel initially. Don't rant about your feelings up here and never say anything to the president.
Keep God first and he'll do the rest!!!

Offline floaded27

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #31 on: February 19, 2010, 09:48:33 AM »
I know its not his fault. I just hate the fact that its assumed that the situation is ok because its him. There was nothing wrong with the other guy, except for the fact that he shouldnt have been called in in the first place. Like i said before its certain people they make all these exceptions for. Im the type of person that likes to play for a coach that says "if you dont come to practice you dont play in the game" and that applies to everyone, from the star player down to the dude that rides the bench the whole game. I can play for a team like that, whether i get in the game or not.

i didnt get a chance to say anything. it was best i didnt say anything when i felt how i felt at the moment, because what i wanted to do and say would have been very inappropriate and would have shamed me and shamed God. Everybody cant keep a cool head and take action. For some, keeping a cool head is just keeping ur mouth shut. So it isnt about manning up. I hear what everyone say they wouldve done, but none of you are ME, you are yourselves, and even many that wouldve done fairly the same thing, you would have done it in a different manner.

Im an old school idealist, living in a fantasy world that somehow places some value on dedication, reliability and dependability.
For my God... let "Golden Axe" prevail.

Offline under13

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #32 on: February 19, 2010, 10:22:04 AM »




so in the meantime dude sees my GK MB2 So the first song starts and I start playing (im basic and pocket when playing so i dont do riffs every opportunity, but i guess to some people that just means i cant play.) so he asks me can he play because she wants him to learn this song.


I've been thinking, do you think that if you 'played out' a little more you would be in this situation? Maybe the bass riffs and runs was the sound they were going for...it was a musical, not a service. Were the other musicians in that group playing out or where they playing pocket?

just a thought, nothing personal.

Offline floaded27

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #33 on: February 19, 2010, 11:28:26 AM »
I've been thinking, do you think that if you 'played out' a little more you would be in this situation? Maybe the bass riffs and runs was the sound they were going for...it was a musical, not a service. Were the other musicians in that group playing out or where they playing pocket?

when he started playing the keyboard player told him "yo, stay in the pocket. you doin TOO much." so maybe that answers that question. but i dont know whats gonna be the case from now on.

but i get where ur coming from. I do what i can do, but only if im familiar with the material (which was another issue i had and wonder if that was determining the perception of my ability). but if im trying to learn the song, why am i going all out? That happens to many people, and it happened to dude in rehearsal. You tryin to do all this fancy stuff and right in the middle of it, the whole song goes somewhere else and u left out there. Why? because u dont know the song, but rather than LISTEN and try to familiarize yourself with the changes and direction of the song, you choose to do otherwise. And because i dont get the material i tend to find myself spending the whole rehearsal learning song after song, instead of coming there knowing already.
For my God... let "Golden Axe" prevail.

Offline malthumb

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #34 on: February 19, 2010, 11:29:08 AM »
Floaded27,

I feel for ya, buddy.  The ONLY thing I would have done differently than you did in this situation is at that first rehearsal I would have sat down with the VP and the Pres IMMEDIATELY after rehearsal and had everything laid out.  It would have been "Am I playing in the musical or not?  Am I sharing time with the new guy or is the new guy THE guy?"

What I did from that point on would have depended on their answer.

As for the text messaging thing.....That was soooo bush league I can hardly comprehend it.  You are definitely doing the right thing by leaving.  You were not appreciated.  It doesn't matter why you were not appreciated, but it is so clear that this was the case. 

Let your step out of this situation be your first step into a better situation.  Be you and do you and it will all fall into place.

Peace,

James
FAITH unites people
RELIGION divides FAITH

Offline ddwilkins

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #35 on: February 19, 2010, 11:35:13 AM »
.....

i didnt get a chance to say anything. .....

But if your original post you said you spoke with the VP? In essence you did get a chance. Basically like we've said, next time nip it in the bud.
Keep God first and he'll do the rest!!!

Offline phbrown

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #36 on: February 19, 2010, 11:48:14 AM »
Im an old school idealist, living in a fantasy world that somehow places some value on dedication, reliability and dependability.

At least now I understand why the president (or was it the vice president) keeps asking for you to come back and play.

It gives the president (or vice) the option to take a risk on a different bass player and when it doesn't work out there you are like a ram in the bush.

I bet the interesting thing is the person in charge doesn't even see this as a problem. In fact from their viewpoint their main goal is to have the best choir possible. and if they lose a bass player, that is fine since it is the jurisdiction choir and there are plenty of bass players who want that spot.

This was just my attempt to understand what the person in leadership may be thinking. It appears (at least to me) that there is no hard feelings just someone attempting to make the best team possible without regards for emotions.

Offline cordney

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #37 on: February 19, 2010, 12:07:06 PM »
This is an irrelavent question: What were the songs that you guys were playing?
‎"It is okay to fail, it is unacceptable to become a failure"

Offline floaded27

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #38 on: February 19, 2010, 12:19:59 PM »
But if your original post you said you spoke with the VP? In essence you did get a chance. Basically like we've said, next time nip it in the bud.

i spoke to him, yes. but i couldnt speak to her at the moment and still be respectful and cordial about it. i just couldnt. we all dont have that in us. maybe u can, but we all cant and maintain the standard that Christ has set for us. It took all that i had not to blow up at the other bass player, so u think i wouldve been able to sit down and have a nice civilized discussion with the pres. at that moment? i dont think so. So after I had a cool head, i didnt get a chance to say anything to the pres.

At least now I understand why the president (or was it the vice president) keeps asking for you to come back and play.

It gives the president (or vice) the option to take a risk on a different bass player and when it doesn't work out there you are like a ram in the bush.

I bet the interesting thing is the person in charge doesn't even see this as a problem. In fact from their viewpoint their main goal is to have the best choir possible. and if they lose a bass player, that is fine since it is the jurisdiction choir and there are plenty of bass players who want that spot.

This was just my attempt to understand what the person in leadership may be thinking. It appears (at least to me) that there is no hard feelings just someone attempting to make the best team possible without regards for emotions.

this is the same conclusion i was coming to.
For my God... let "Golden Axe" prevail.

Offline dhagler

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Re: new issues - did i do the right thing by not quitting?
« Reply #39 on: February 19, 2010, 04:06:24 PM »
Im an old school idealist, living in a fantasy world that somehow places some value on dedication, reliability and dependability.

Funny. I thought I was the only one living in that world. Glad to have your company. :)
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