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Author Topic: "Borrowed Notes"  (Read 1434 times)

Offline Fenix

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"Borrowed Notes"
« on: April 12, 2010, 04:09:45 AM »
So this past week i have been on a slight theory binge and been really making an analysis of my playing. I noticed that you can "borrow" notes from one scale and use it in another. For example, using the A minor pentatonic or blues scale, you can borrow the F# from the A major scale and it actually sounds good.

I dunno what the theory behind this is, or is this one of those "If it sounds good to you, play it" kinds of things? How do you know what note is appropriate to borrow and what scale to even borrow from? Hope this makes sense.
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Offline docjohn

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2010, 06:29:10 AM »
Try it;if it works-it works.If not,even a little dissonance works-once in a while

Offline Gibby

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2010, 08:44:21 AM »
So this past week i have been on a slight theory binge and been really making an analysis of my playing. I noticed that you can "borrow" notes from one scale and use it in another. For example, using the A minor pentatonic or blues scale, you can borrow the F# from the A major scale and it actually sounds good.

I dunno what the theory behind this is, or is this one of those "If it sounds good to you, play it" kinds of things? How do you know what note is appropriate to borrow and what scale to even borrow from? Hope this makes sense.

I use the Dorian scale (which has the major 6th) when I want to go from major to a bluesy dominant minor.  Nice switch up from the major...

Also, try to use the raised 4th of the major scale when they play those inverted major II chords

Offline JayP5150

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2010, 08:58:14 AM »
F# is A's relative minor, so it work is the minor scale nicely.

I use this a lot. I can't post tab on my phone, but it works as a nice in-between pull-off note in a decending run. For instance, on the B string, a 8 7 5 pull-off... I'll have to tab it for you lol. Give me a few.

Offline jlynnb1

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2010, 09:02:54 AM »
over standard blues progressions you can interchange pentatonic, blues, dorian, and the dorian blues scale. also over a standard imin7-IVdom progression such as Amin7-D9 or the like. adding the Dorian mode to your bag of tricks over those progressions can definitely add a little sophistication to your runs.

this is why a solid grasp of scales/intervals is so important....

Offline JayP5150

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2010, 09:20:31 AM »
Just worked this up real quick to give you an example. (hope it prints right...)

                                                                         ~~~~
---------5-----5—8b-5-------------------------------------
------5----8b-------------8p7p5------5--------------------
--7b--------------------------------7b-----5b--------------
--------------------------------------------------7---------
------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------

                                                                ~~~                                                    ~~~
---------5-----5—8b-5----------------5------------5----------------------------------------
------5----8b-------------8p7p5----------7b------------7/8\7--5—7br--5--------------------
--7b--------------------------------7b---------------------------------7br--5---------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------7\--------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------7\--------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------/5-----

OK, keep in mind that this is off the top of my head, at work, so timing may left something to be desired, as I can’t really play them out lol.

These both start out the same – basic blues run (the b’s are bends. Probably ˝ bends will do). They each resolve a bit differently to show you how to fit in that F#.

In the second one, the bend and vibrato on the F# is a great, slightly-dissonant, note to throw in for tension (it ends up being a slightly flat 7th, or a slightly sharp minor 7th, however you’d like to look at it… it’s the “Dickey Betts” note, basically lol).

The “br” is a bend and release. The “p” is pull off. I would think you’d know the slashies. Those are slides. (this is why I hate internet tabs lol).

Play around with that and see if it sparks ideas.

(as I was typing this, jlynn replied. Listen to the man, he is steeped in the scalar thing much more than I... as is Dave... I'm more of a "does it fit?" kind of player lol.)

Offline Fenix

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2010, 10:02:59 AM »
Thanks Jay, I will try it out as soon as I get to a regular PC. The tab looks like a hot mess on my phone. :)

My present approach to soloing over chords is to think of extensions of the chord and play those notes as part of my riff or whatever. For instance I saw some funky chord called a Maj7#9 and a Maj7#13. I will most likely never play these chords, but I can use the extensions as ideas for a solo.
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Offline funkStrat_97

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2010, 03:36:55 PM »
For instance I saw some funky chord called a Maj7#9 and a Maj7#13. I will most likely never play these chords, but I can use the extensions as ideas for a solo.

Wouldn't a #13th be the same as the b7th one octave higher?
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Offline melrhyne

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Re: "Borrowed Notes"
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2010, 03:50:40 PM »
Are you fluent with upper structures in every key?

That's soloing with the extensions.
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