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Author Topic: Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?  (Read 8552 times)

Offline Divinecontroller

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What About?
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2005, 04:18:38 PM »
Have you thought about an internet label and radio station. Those are doing really well right now. I guess the sacrafice is not worrying about mainstream exposure which is kind of a catch 22, because you are trying to get people that have taken a hold of the airwaves and adopted corruption and partiality to money to play tasteful and respectful music. I would think that you would have to get away from the mainstream to get the mainstream audience, but who are we kidding that philosophy has taken over a lot of the churches as well and so it is all about money. Do what you can do and I will pray that the Lord lead us and help us to attain the things that we desire in our heart. I have seen the things that you have to offer in your lessons and the posts that you have. I know that GOD will bless you to attain that goal. Let me know if there is any other way that I can help you cause I would be glad to.

Offline uriahsmusic

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thanx
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2005, 05:03:47 PM »
I am working on it....i will deffinately contact you for help!

Offline Divinecontroller

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GOD Blessed
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2005, 05:41:05 PM »
Where 2 or three are gathered together touching and agreeing in my name (JESUS) I will be a GOD in their midst.
At your service Brother.  8)

Offline B3Wannabe

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2005, 06:52:52 PM »
I remember attending a rehearsal recently where the musicians remixed a song that they were singing. I look at them like "OMG! That's RUN DMC!". When I told them, they honestly said that they had no idea. To them it just sounded good. That music could also be viewed as tainted, but how would they know if they had never heard it? On the extreme side, someone could do some rock move that Marilyn Manson had used without knowing it. I know I've never heard any of his music, so I'd really be shocked if someone told me. Would I stop using it then? I don't know, because it wouldn't have been my intent in the first place. I may though....just because....Marilyn Manson is someone whose music I wouldn't want to play around with.

Offline B3Wannabe

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Offline Divinecontroller

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Yeah
« Reply #25 on: April 21, 2005, 04:47:30 PM »
Well this goes back to letting the Spirit lead you. All music has been played before. There is not a new chord or melody, just variations and different arrangements. Once you add the lyrics it plays a detrimental part in the spirit and nature of the song. I agree that if you were to listen to some Marilyn Manson music that there is a possibility that you may find some similar melody or chord, but it is the spirit in which it is presented and that presentation that makes the difference. I think you can feel in your spirit when someone invokes something of a worldly nature into a spiritual song or atmosphere. GOD has given us the power to rebuke those things and spirits that are in conflict with his. Use your power if you possess it, if you don't it's past time that you be getting about getting that power.

The second track is more lively but it will depend on the mood and the situation. The frist track is some of that old school gospel and harmonics that kindda point to the bluesy references that we discussed earlier. That's why I think Blues and a lot of other music was lifted from what African Americans started as Gospel and Hymnal music.

Hey not to venture off of the subject, but what do you guys think about the remake that Cheryl Pepsi Riley did of "What If GOD Was One Of Us"? Actually this is kind of an example. The original probably wouldn't be classified in the Gospel category but I really love her version and it really moves me. Please let me know what you guys think on this one. I may even have to start a new post on this subject. It's on the "Diary Of A Mad Black Woman" soundtrack.

 :lol:

Offline 7stringer

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2005, 12:27:19 AM »
My $.02

 Im new to gospel but allready a pro in other formats. Music connects us all in multiple ways...rythm is inherent in us all...melody is inherent in us all...playing a bass solo at 3 in the morning is inherent in us all. This is Gods gift.

 Most of my gigs are blues gigs, but i know many musicians who play blues at night and church in the morning....do I think less of them..NO, God gave them the ability to play different styles...

  In my life the lines drawn on what music is and isn't have been my own shortcommings and negative influences.  

  heres the question that I cannot find an acceptible answer to...What is tradition?  And before that? And before that? And before that? What is considered "tradition" was once "radical".

Offline nardo73

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Concernig gospel that sounds too worldly
« Reply #27 on: May 12, 2005, 02:54:06 AM »
Concernig the gospel that sounds too worldly. You have to remember that God will use anything that he want's to get us to give him the glory.  Gospel music ministers to those who give a ear to it. We as his servants are here to take back everything that the locust stole from us, and (If it's the music that's been stolen or perverted) we have to take that back so that God get's the glory out of it. After all when life was taken from us, Christ himself died on the cross and went to hell to take back what the enemy stolen from us. (Now "death where is your sting")?
     I also want to add that we should be careful not to knock someone else's ministry, because there ministry is toutching people like drug dealers, etc. that we can't ordinarily toutch. I think there's a big mis-education in the body of christ. Hip-hop and secular music was never really born in the church, but on the streets, which caused a big gap between both styles of music. When these styles are callaborated, artist like, Kirk Franklin and others reach millions of souls who would never really listen to gospel, that's a big change from ten or fifteen years ago, when gospel had no appeal to mainstream. Anyway. (Christ can't return until every man hears his word and that he is lord), and sitting in our churches alone is not gonna get it.

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II Kings 3:15  But now bring me a minstrel. And it came to pass, when the minstrel played, that the

Offline fenderjazz

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #28 on: May 12, 2005, 02:40:37 PM »
Gospel music that sounds worldy is a demonstration of the influence that the world has on the Church. That is not to say that all gospel musicians should only play old hymns, but why is it that whatever becomes popular in the world always has to be popular in gospel? Marketing a gospel CD to a broader demographic than typical church-going Christians is one thing. Causing a drug-dealer who knows nothing about Jesus to realize why he needs to repent and receive salvation is something entirely different. Jesus effectively ministered to some of the worst kinds of sinners, but he never compromised his identity to do it. The Bible says for us not to conform to this world, but in our music we immediately conform to whatever the new trend is. I personally believe if we seek God, He will give us a music far more compelling than anything out there.

Nakia518

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #29 on: May 12, 2005, 03:57:51 PM »
My 2 cents...

In the old testement, music was intended to worship God. From what I read in psalms, "Praise him with all instruments".
My opinon is all music should worship God period. What is in the secular world (and this is what the enemy does) is preverted. Anything that we do/use/say to worship god has been preverted in the world. Before we knew what secular was all we knew was gospel. Think about slave time... It wasn't until someone decided to make a change that the music became sexual/preverted/ungodly. I believe that in the time right now we need to take over the music industry and not conform to it. We need to fight to get gospel played on the main stream Prime time and not just on Sunday morning between the hours of 6:00a and 8:00a.

Have you heard what is being played on the radio? Its sickining. I stopped listening to the radio months ago. One because I got tired of what was being played and 2 because of what was being said on the radio. I was in the car yesterday with my brother and we were listening to 105.1FM(very popular in NYC) And I couldn't believe my ears. They were cussing and carrying on. Talking about who slept with who. Who had a baby by who. I mean really out there. Thank God For CD players and Gospel CD's. It just made me sick.

But again we need to take the preversion out of "Our" music. Because before man fell we were in close relationship with God and all he wants is for his people to come back to him.

Be Blessed

Offline nardo73

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #30 on: May 13, 2005, 12:48:53 AM »
If Gospel music that sounds worldy is a demonstration of an influence the world has on the church, then we're certainly influenced by how we dress, eat, sleep and think. The word tells us not to become so spiritual that we become no earthly good. (I mean how is it that a person can't even talk to us about a foot ball game or the practical things in life, because we're to busy being spiritually minded that we loose the connection with them) I think that's where we lost alot of our youth today, It's not that we won't relate to them, but the fact that we don't know how to relate to them. (Maybe this isn't for everyone that don't have the heart or strength of David). But the word says in you I will do a new thing,this is not compromising our identity because we sing a new song. It's the same word, with a new melody which impacts millions for the current time leading many into a new season.
     Another thing on this note is that we as ministers and muscians  can't measure the word of God, why? because it will suprise you every time. My biological cousine was raised under the islamic faith, and was heavily dealing with drugs and a number of issues, but there deliverance came through listening to a marketable Gospel CD that reached them in that low place. (God Is Awsome) And now God uses them to bless others in ministry.
     Gospel music should not have any stipulations on how it should be played, neither should the word of God, it should cater to all. After all was it not the Jews who thought of the gentiles as unclean, remember there's a need for all nations and people to hear the gospel no matter the style, It's time to plant the seeds.

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II Kings 3:15  But now bring me a minstrel. And it came to pass, when the minstrel played, that the

Offline fenderjazz

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #31 on: May 13, 2005, 09:51:48 AM »
The Bible says let ALL things be done decently and in order. So there has to be at least some stipulations in all levels of ministry in order to distinguish between decency and indeceny. Throughout the Bible, from the Old Testament to the New Testament, God has always required his people to be different from everyone else. This isn't always convenient or logical but it has to be maintained. Then too, we can't get so caught up in being different that we adopt a "holier-than-thou" attitude. There should be some balance. The Bible also says that no man can come to God unless the Spirit is drawing him. If God is drawing someone by His spirit, it really isn't necessary to dress the music up in a Ludacris costume for God to save people. God did say He would do a new thing in us and the Bible says sing a new song. I'm not sure He meant for us to find out what the new thing or song is in the world and attach the word Christian or Gospel to it. I've never listened to a rap song and said "Oh, I thought that was a country song." I've never listened to a rock song and said "Oh, I thought that was house music." However countless times I've listened to gospel and said "Oh, I thought that was R&B, or rap, or jazz, or whatever." There's something unsettling about that. It's almost like the world has become our example instead the people of God being their example.

Offline nardo73

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #32 on: May 13, 2005, 09:39:36 PM »
Please don't misunderstand the things that are writtin. Music is a interpretation of the word of God, just like preaching is an interpretaion of the word of God. But in this interpretation of music, there is a language that speaks to a particular group people that will here what it's saying.
     History shows that we went from old negro hyms, to the bules, and then gospel. We've evolved through the times like a bad habit. So then, how pure could that style of music have been if it was the word that brought us our liberty. I beleive peter seen someone casting out demons, and because they were dressed in diffrent it baffiled him, jesus corrected him and said there not against us but for us. How could we judge. (Where the spirit of the lord is, they is liberty). People can be healed
     If I handed down an older suit to my son, and he wears it out of appreiciation, sooner or later he will begin to find his own interpretation of how he should wear that suit or even get  newer threads. He's still the same person with the same priciples, but with a new suit.
     Technically speaking, our first translation of the bible was called the Septuagint, or LXX. 70 scholars were brought to Alexandria, Egypt to create it's Greek translation. This work began around 280 B.C. Then came the Sinaitic Manuscript-A.D. 340 which was written in Greek, and can be located in the British Museum. The Vatican Manuscript-A.D. 350 (Italy), Alexandrian Manuscript-A.D. 450 (British Museum), Ephraem Manuscript-A.D. 450, Latin Vulgate-A.D. 450. John Wycliffe's was the first English version-1382, Miles Coverdale was the fist to print the English version, the Geneva Bible-1560 by william Whittingham was the first to use verse and chapter divisions. Then came the King James version-1611 and many, many, many versions were made after it, like the N.I.V. and the A.M.S. version and others to follow. It doesn't mean we're less pure or out of order, but we have a new interpretaion, and that's not wrong in God's eye's because we don't speak that original language as the Greeks or Hebrews but we have various interpretations of the word.
     You know I think we should never forget God's instuctions on worship, because in the end we'll be judged for what's in our hearts and our measure of faith.  Truth is, some people aren't sincere about new or old gospel music, but that's for God to judge. But if he can use a mule to talk to someone, then he can use anything to get the message across, and I don't want a donkey to talk to me because I'm not doing what I'm suppose to.

                                                                                         God Bless
II Kings 3:15  But now bring me a minstrel. And it came to pass, when the minstrel played, that the

Offline tak

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #33 on: May 14, 2005, 03:35:22 AM »
Quote from: Spiritfingers
Guys,
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO CHECK THIS OUT BUT GOT TO WWW.EXMINISTRIES.COM

ORDER THE DVD AND LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK!

ELDER CRAIG HAS A MAKES SOME GOOD POINTS ON THE SUBJECT BUT STILL IT'S TO THE INDIVIDUAL BELIEVERS LEVEL OF FAITH!


I've had the DVD for at least two or three months.  Our Church presented at Bible Study a while ago.  Souls were saved, lives changed, CDs destroyed, spirits fed, strongholds shattered, understanding & knowledge were gained.  People don't seem to fully grasp the gravity of music.  Aside from facial expressions music is the only international means of expression that transcends every boundary save the ability to hear (and bass vibration surpasses that).  It is truly powerful and engages/grasps the mind more effectively than 13yrs of schooling.  We certainly must not forget satans most recognized gift.  What caused him to be cast out.  What is one of his most powerful and INFLUENTIAL tools.  

The reason it is so hard to distinguish good music/bad music is that it is not as easy as distinguishing black from white.  So satan in his craftiness sees the oppurtunity in that.  So we must be vigilant (1Pet 5:8.)  It is a decision that must be made spiritually.   In faith, for w/o faith it is impossible to please God (Heb 11:6).  We must be honest with ourselves about what music does to us.  It is what you are feeding your mind, your spirit.  When we listen we're listening to more than a sound.  There's motive in music.  If faith comes by hearing (Rom 10:17) then so can things detrimental or opposite to faith by hearing.

Everyone has an opinion but as Christians we must seek "what thus saith the Lord" the Bible says seek knowledge at the priests lips i.e Holy Bible based knowledge (Mal 2:7).  With that said...

I think the EXministries DVD should be watched by every Christian who has anything to do with music (listening or playing).  It is an annointed ministry that boldly tells what should've been told afore and has scripture and experiences to back it.  Definitely a ministry that boldy seeks to edify the church in love and knowledge.  Desparate to recue the church from a sleep of complacent naivity and ignorance.  He that hath an ear...

HOSEA 4:6  Don't reject it inject!

Offline tak

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #34 on: May 14, 2005, 03:50:01 AM »
ROMANS 14:23
"for whatsoever is not of faith is sin."
This is a general rule, or axiom, which is not only applicable to the present case, but to any other, whether of a natural, civil, moral, or evangelic kind: "whatsoever does not spring from faith", as the Arabic version renders it, cannot be excused of sin; whatever is not agreeable to the word and doctrine of faith, ought not to be done; whatever is done without faith, or not in the exercise of it, is culpable, for without faith nothing can be pleasing to God; and whatever is contrary to the persuasion of a man's own mind, is so far criminal, as it is a violation of his conscience; whatever men do, especially in a religious way, they ought to make faith of it, or to be fully persuaded of it in their own minds, or they act amiss.

Offline Robbace

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #35 on: May 14, 2005, 07:22:35 AM »
Tak to update you on my progress things are going very very well my proffesor minister of music says that he wants me to step out soon and step up I am playing with the kids choir and praise team and the mens choir the band is very happy with everything and very surprised at how God has overflowed my progress God is making this instrument come alive in me giving all honor to my Lord and savior Jesus Christ

On with the subject our kids today are`widley influenced by the music that they listen to you you can go to your kids and throw out all of the cds that they have and they will find a way to listen to the music they want and whether someones head is bobbling to the music or not what message are we putting out to the public when we are singing what is the motive is the Lord Jesus Christ on your mind and saving souls or are you trying to make a quick buck but Robbace will not listen to worldly music because my mind has to stay open to what the Holy Spirit is trying to lead `me to and I will not go out and buy a cd hat has one gospel song on it and the rest with the devils message comming accross full blast and that is one way they get you in your mind and the bottom line to all this when judgement day comes around no matter what we say those christian and non christians will be judges by our Lord and savior Jesus Christ on what the motive was behind the song were you trying to save the unsaved were you trying to make a quick buck without spreading my message and the crowns will be awarded accordingly and if there is a church that unknowingly uses an beat thats similar to worldly musiic but lives are being brought to the Father he will judge them accordingly the crowns will be set up according to the works of your hand my Lord God will judge these people we can say all we want but there is only one judge all praises to the Lord of Host God bless you all :)

Offline nardo73

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #36 on: May 14, 2005, 09:57:32 AM »
AMEN!!
II Kings 3:15  But now bring me a minstrel. And it came to pass, when the minstrel played, that the

Offline tak

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Where should we as gospel musicians draw the line?
« Reply #37 on: May 14, 2005, 11:15:50 AM »
Robbbace it brings me joy to hear that news. To hear God at work, I shouldn't be surpised because He's always doing something great.  But I get excited when I think about Jesus and all He does for us, especially knowing if He can do it for you I know He can do it for me too.

I concur. Amen. That's what we must alll realize; that He is the judge of the quick and dead (Acts 10:42).  We must work out our own salvation (Phlp 2:12).  Everday we make eternal choices, we have got to walk according to His will not our philosophy or our own wisdom (foolishness) but in obedience to the Wisest all knowing God.

Offline jamaicanbaan

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Re: just my opinion!
« Reply #38 on: May 14, 2005, 12:58:05 PM »
Quote from: uriahsmusic
MUSIC IS NOT JUST MUSIC.....AS A PRODUCER I KNOW THAT MUCH OF THE COMMERCIAL MUSIC TODAY IS CREATED TO BRING OUT A PERSONS SEXUALTY...GETTING THE GROOVE JUST SO....SO THAT YOU WILL MOVE A CERTAIN WAY....THESE THEMES ARE IMPOSED UPON THE PUBLIC BY PEOPLE WHO GENERALL LIVE BY AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT STANDARD THAN WE DO!
.....EVEN THE OLD SCHOOL GOSPEL WAS JUST BLUES!....MANY OF THE MELODIES THAT WE SING TODAY AS GOSPEL TUNES WERE BAR SONGS OF THE PAST....
....THE GOSPEL WE CALL TRADITIONAL WAS PLAYED THE SAME WAY BLUES WAS PLAYED BACK IN THE DAY...

YOU SEE WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS THAT WE TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE MUSIC OF THE DAY BECAUSE WE USE THE MUSICIANS OF THE DAY....SO THE MUSIC CHANGES ACCORDINGLY!

THE PROBLEM IS NOT THE MUSIC...IT IS WHAT THE MUSIC IDENTIFIES WHEN IT IS PLAYED!....UNLIKE IN TIMES PAST THE MUSIC AND THE PERFORMANCE AND THE MOTIVE OF TODAYS MUSIC IS PURPOSELY SEXUAL....AND BECAUSE IT IS SO OBVIOUSLY COPIED FROM CONTEMPORARY R&B AND HIPHOP WHICH IS DIRECTLY ASSOCIATED WITH SEX, VIOLENCE AND BASICALLY UNCHRISTIAN BEHAVIOR...
IT TAKES ON AN EXTRA AIR OF INAPPROPRIATENESS.

SO WHAT DO YOU DO……
I THINK THAT THE OLDER MUSIC CAME FROM A DAY WHEN THE TIMES WERE MORE INNOCENT (INTENT WISE) AND THERE IS NO WAY TO CONSTRUE THAT MUSIC AS WORLDLY TODAY.
SO STICK TO THE OLD TIME WAY….

IF YOU PLAY THE MUSIC AND BOOTIES START SHAKIN LIKE IN A CLUB…YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG MUSIC…

IF YOU ARE PLAYING A GOSPEL SONG THAT CAN BE TAKEN TO MEAN SOMETHING ELSE…YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG MUSIC….

DOES IS MENTION JESUS?...GOD…HOLY SPIRIT….IF IT DOESN’T YOU SHOULD WONDER WHY!

IF THE MUSIC OBVIOUSLY ILLISITS ANYTHING THAT IS UNCHRISTIAN THEN YOU SHOULD BEWARE OF THE APPEARENC OF EVIL….(NOT WORTH IT)

I CAN GO ON AND ON…BUT ONE THING THAT I CAN PROMISE YOU!
THE CHRISTIAN MUSIC INDUSTRY IS BEING RUN BY FOLKS WHO WANT MONEY!...AND COULD CARE LESS ABOUT YOUR SALVATION…SO BEWARE!



AMEN,      IF THAT AINT THE TRUTH...................

Offline insanesquirle

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well
« Reply #39 on: May 14, 2005, 10:43:23 PM »
"I mean how is it that a person can't even talk to us about a foot ball game or the practical things in life, because we're to busy being spiritually minded that we loose the connection with them".

well personal i believe that you can have fun and you can talk about sports and things like that but dont put it over god.  Some churches get together during the super bowl and watch it all together.  I tell you what, i should rather and i would rather be at a church service hearing the word of god and praising the lord for what he did for us than watching a ball being tossed.  Now do I think that football is a sin? no, but i still just dont believe that instead of services you watch a game.
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