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Author Topic: A Thought For "Drummers"...  (Read 8807 times)

MaestroDivine

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A Thought For "Drummers"...
« on: October 17, 2006, 03:38:18 PM »
Change the way you think of yourselves, 'drummers'.

The drum-set is but one instrument. If you continue to think of yourself as a drummer, then their is a possibility that subconsciously, you percieve yourself a soloist, who has to discipline himself/herself enough to 'settle' for being but ONE piece of a band.

How do you begin to change this?

Think of yourself as a musician. Before you became a 'drummer', and got into all of the fancy fills, did any/much of the music you love have a drummer who was showcasing all of fills?

More than likely, it did not. It was a collective effort from MUSICIANS, who knew their roles. I think this obsession with licks stems from the fact that we're breeding way too many drummer's, and not enough musicians...

Think back to the first time you became fascinated by an instrument. For many of us, we sat and watched that one musician, instead of appreciating the groove that resulted from a collective effort by all the musicians. As a result, we subconsciously disassociated ourselves from the group, and saw that instruments as a means to showcase our abilities, as an individual. That's why so many musicians are so eager to be the center of attention, and yet need 'discipline' to not do more than what your role call's for.

.....let's renew our minds, starting today. A "drummer" may or may not play for the music, but a MUSICIAN ALWAYS does what the music call's for. That's why he/she is called a MUSICian....

All of these youtube 'shed' clips, believe it or not, do nothing more than reinforce the notion that you're a soloist. When you're an impressionable, immature musician .... you see these clips, and want to express yourselves in that way. That is NOT what real music is about; yet some people consume that stuff on a daily basis.

Lastly, their is nothing wrong with listening to a song to hear what the drummer is doing; however, while it may be hard at this point, try to enjoy the music too. The more you can enjoy the music as a whole, I feel, the less you'll feel the need to interrupt the flow, by showcasing your chops. It definitely all connects.

At the end of the day, you should think of yourself a MUSICian who happens to plays; and not a drummer who happens to play music.

That's all.

Offline XYZ-Angel

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2006, 03:52:31 PM »
Man, that's deep

Thanks a lot.... Im only 15 but I am trying to "mature" on the drumset as much as I can...I needed that   :)

Offline keydrummer

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2006, 03:55:09 PM »
Change the way you think of yourselves, 'drummers'.

The drum-set is but one instrument. If you continue to think of yourself as a drummer, then their is a possibility that subconsciously, you percieve yourself a soloist, who has to discipline himself/herself enough to 'settle' for being but ONE piece of a band.

How do you begin to change this?

Think of yourself as a musician. Before you became a 'drummer', and got into all of the fancy fills, did any/much of the music you love have a drummer who was showcasing all of fills?

More than likely, it did not. It was a collective effort from MUSICIANS, who knew their roles. I think this obsession with licks stems from the fact that we're breeding way too many drummer's, and not enough musicians...

Think back to the first time you became fascinated by an instrument. For many of us, we sat and watched that one musician, instead of appreciating the groove that resulted from a collective effort by all the musicians. As a result, we subconsciously disassociated ourselves from the group, and saw that instruments as a means to showcase our abilities, as an individual. That's why so many musicians are so eager to be the center of attention, and yet need 'discipline' to not do more than what your role call's for.

.....let's renew our minds, starting today. A "drummer" may or may not play for the music, but a MUSICIAN ALWAYS does what the music call's for. That's why he/she is called a MUSICian....

All of these youtube 'shed' clips, believe it or not, do nothing more than reinforce the notion that you're a soloist. When you're an impressionable, immature musician .... you see these clips, and want to express yourselves in that way. That is NOT what real music is about; yet some people consume that stuff on a daily basis.

Lastly, their is nothing wrong with listening to a song to hear what the drummer is doing; however, while it may be hard at this point, try to enjoy the music too. The more you can enjoy the music as a whole, I feel, the less you'll feel the need to interrupt the flow, by showcasing your chops. It definitely all connects.

At the end of the day, you should think of yourself a MUSICian who happens to plays; and not a drummer who happens to play music.

That's all.



Very well said,Everyone should have read this.I see why your called MAESTRO

HustleMan

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2006, 03:58:48 PM »
Change the way you think of yourselves, 'drummers'.

The drum-set is but one instrument. If you continue to think of yourself as a drummer, then their is a possibility that subconsciously, you percieve yourself a soloist, who has to discipline himself/herself enough to 'settle' for being but ONE piece of a band.

How do you begin to change this?

Think of yourself as a musician. Before you became a 'drummer', and got into all of the fancy fills, did any/much of the music you love have a drummer who was showcasing all of fills?

More than likely, it did not. It was a collective effort from MUSICIANS, who knew their roles. I think this obsession with licks stems from the fact that we're breeding way too many drummer's, and not enough musicians...

Think back to the first time you became fascinated by an instrument. For many of us, we sat and watched that one musician, instead of appreciating the groove that resulted from a collective effort by all the musicians. As a result, we subconsciously disassociated ourselves from the group, and saw that instruments as a means to showcase our abilities, as an individual. That's why so many musicians are so eager to be the center of attention, and yet need 'discipline' to not do more than what your role call's for.

.....let's renew our minds, starting today. A "drummer" may or may not play for the music, but a MUSICIAN ALWAYS does what the music call's for. That's why he/she is called a MUSICian....

All of these youtube 'shed' clips, believe it or not, do nothing more than reinforce the notion that you're a soloist. When you're an impressionable, immature musician .... you see these clips, and want to express yourselves in that way. That is NOT what real music is about; yet some people consume that stuff on a daily basis.

Lastly, their is nothing wrong with listening to a song to hear what the drummer is doing; however, while it may be hard at this point, try to enjoy the music too. The more you can enjoy the music as a whole, I feel, the less you'll feel the need to interrupt the flow, by showcasing your chops. It definitely all connects.

At the end of the day, you should think of yourself a MUSICian who happens to plays; and not a drummer who happens to play music.

That's all.

Amen. 

I had a really hard time when I first started.  My MoM would always say "Listen to the Music!"  I would always think "What is he talking about?  I AM listening to the music!"

I really wasn't.

I was listening to myself.  I was concerned about doing something to get an "ooooh" or "aaaaaaah".

I didn't really start to be effective till I didn't care about getting  :o's

At this point, I can just play bass on 1 and snare on 3 and be content.   ;D

Offline Natejam71

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2006, 04:02:09 PM »
You came with it this time MaestroDivine... I agree one hundred percent.  True musicians is what we should strive to be.  Playing the drums is more than fills and chops.  I am not going to say too much becuase you said what needed to be said.  Stay Blessed and keep coming with the knowledge.  Nate J.

JFunky

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2006, 04:42:39 PM »
...it's up there.  Very well stated. 8)

...I don't know man.  For me, musicianship has always been the 1st thing on the list.  I was constantly reminded and still am by my "dictator mentors".  The music of my culture calls for it.  It's in my blood to always play for the song and music and to always enjoy everyone elses' playing around me.

...I approach the kit as a percussionist more than a drummer, constantly listening for gaps that I can fill in with a splash or cowbell or tambourine or something.  I guess that the way I think comes from playing congas melodically and listening to horn sections all of my life.  I just love to serve the music.

...one thing that is happening to me more and more is that I'm starting to enjoy songs that have "0" drums in them.  They're very inspiring to me at times. :-\

JFunky

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2006, 04:48:29 PM »
    "....as much as we love to play the drums and love to practice the drums, we should spend a lot of time listening to music."

                                                               - Horacio "El Negro" Hernandez

Offline Cherri

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2006, 06:30:49 PM »
Bump_________... I am voting Div for President... Div report by Jan 15...   

The sooner folk start realizing that education/learning is not a priviledge the better. It's a NEED!
What can I $ay Juanita Bynum is my cicerone.

Offline fretai03

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2006, 06:59:46 PM »
Thanks Div.

Offline vatim

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2006, 08:15:42 PM »
Great advice Div!! I don't know how many times I've been to a performance and less skillful drummers locks in and  flows with the music and it has a much better end result than the skillfull drummers that's just too busy and butcher a song.

 

blaquegenius

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2006, 09:26:50 PM »
***wiping tears*****

I LOVE YOU MAAAANNNNN!!!!!!

HustleMan

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2006, 09:39:22 AM »
Great advice Div!! I don't know how many times I've been to a performance and less skillful drummers locks in and  flows with the music and it has a much better end result than the skillfull drummers that's just too busy and butcher a song.
 

Preach!

In the final analysis, your keyboard player and Organist and Bass player are not going to be able to shine because they can't shine without a foundation.....

The drummer is the foundation.

Offline SabianKnight

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2006, 12:28:18 PM »

Preach!

In the final analysis, your keyboard player and Organist and Bass player are not going to be able to shine because they can't shine without a foundation.....

The drummer is the foundation.


THough I understand what you are striving to say... MUSIC is the foundation. Let's not push false information based on the stereotypical church and urban players of today's music. Any Solo and Ensemble jury situation or Recital totally discredits your statement. Elton John, James Taylor, Chic Corea, Stanley Clark, Victor Wooten, Christian McBride, John Mcglaughlin, Al DiMeola and countless others blow that theory to shreds. The don't need accompaniment they choose to use it.

We must keep in mind that EVERY MUSICIAN in order to be truly effectictive must have a good/great UNDERSTANDING of TIME & RHYTHM. You cannot play music with those and they are synonomous. When you play time notational values you are playing rhythm. A quote from Max Roach in TRAPS magazine says that he feels sorry for musicians that cannot play time. THe drummer has been given the job of rhythm because the lack of definite pitch in the instrument not able to play a TRUE melody. However, everyone is responsible and accountable for time and rhythm. We are simply insurance to that end.

We drumset players/percussionist/musicians must step up and KNOW MUSIC. We must deliver ourselves from people and their limitations by eliminating our own. We have to stay on our game. A 'REAL' bass player and organist can shine on their own.   
Try not to become a person of success but rather a person of VALUE. - T. Harv Eker

rjthakid

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2006, 02:35:21 PM »
THough I understand what you are striving to say... MUSIC is the foundation. Let's not push false information based on the stereotypical church and urban players of today's music. Any Solo and Ensemble jury situation or Recital totally discredits your statement. Elton John, James Taylor, Chic Corea, Stanley Clark, Victor Wooten, Christian McBride, John Mcglaughlin, Al DiMeola and countless others blow that theory to shreds. The don't need accompaniment they choose to use it.

We must keep in mind that EVERY MUSICIAN in order to be truly effectictive must have a good/great UNDERSTANDING of TIME & RHYTHM. You cannot play music with those and they are synonomous. When you play time notational values you are playing rhythm. A quote from Max Roach in TRAPS magazine says that he feels sorry for musicians that cannot play time. THe drummer has been given the job of rhythm because the lack of definite pitch in the instrument not able to play a TRUE melody. However, everyone is responsible and accountable for time and rhythm. We are simply insurance to that end.

We drumset players/percussionist/musicians must step up and KNOW MUSIC. We must deliver ourselves from people and their limitations by eliminating our own. We have to stay on our game. A 'REAL' bass player and organist can shine on their own.   

Regardless of HOW well a musician understands Time & Rhythm, if the drummer is not steady, it throws everyone off.  If the drummer increases tempo, everyone will increase tempo.  If the drummer decreases tempo, everyone will decrease tempo. 

In a perfect world, that would not be the case.  But we don't play in a box.  We play with other musicians, and they can't say "He's playing a little faster, but I'm not going there.  I'm going to play this tempo, and that's it!"   :D 

That is not to say that we are SOLELY responsible for keeping time.  Everyone drummer here as, at some point, been blamed for a tempo fluctuation that was simply not their fault.

But accurate time and a solid groove are key in Gospel Music.  That responsibility lies more with the drummer than any other musician.

Offline FlamTap

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2006, 11:33:56 AM »
I feel you on that Maestro. I'm somewhat of a novice drummer. I was one of those that tried to imitate a Calvin Rodgers or Mike Clemmons fancy fill. I think that has delayed my growth as a drummer. I can do a little bit when it comes down to fancy fills, but when it comes to a straight groove or straight pocket playing, or even just understanding the craft of drums, I struggle sometimes due to the ignorance I had when I first began. Much props on the post, I believe GOD is telling me to focus more on the craft of musicianship and playing the drums whether than youtube clips of sheds and etc...

HustleMan

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2006, 12:01:27 PM »
I feel you on that Maestro. I'm somewhat of a novice drummer. I was one of those that tried to imitate a Calvin Rodgers or Mike Clemmons fancy fill. I think that has delayed my growth as a drummer. I can do a little bit when it comes down to fancy fills, but when it comes to a straight groove or straight pocket playing, or even just understanding the craft of drums, I struggle sometimes due to the ignorance I had when I first began. Much props on the post, I believe GOD is telling me to focus more on the craft of musicianship and playing the drums whether than youtube clips of sheds and etc...

God Bless you for your honesty.   :)

Offline SabianKnight

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2006, 12:33:34 PM »
Regardless of HOW well a musician understands Time & Rhythm, if the drummer is not steady, it throws everyone off.  If the drummer increases tempo, everyone will increase tempo.  If the drummer decreases tempo, everyone will decrease tempo. 
Quote
You are missing the point. When you have a real understanding of playing time you are more consistent. Misplacing and displacing and syncopation notes can and will cause a metric modulation (feeling of speeding up or slowing down). If you do not have a good understanding of time your doing this in accident or misuse can make you feel unsteady, especially to folk whom do not have good timing themselves.
Quote
In a perfect world, that would not be the case.  But we don't play in a box.  We play with other musicians, and they can't say "He's playing a little faster, but I'm not going there.  I'm going to play this tempo, and that's it!"   :D

That is not to say that we are SOLELY responsible for keeping time.  Everyone drummer here as, at some point, been blamed for a tempo fluctuation that was simply not their fault.
Quote
But accurate time and a solid groove are key in Gospel Music.  That responsibility lies more with the drummer than any other musician.

Everyone has got to strengthen and properly practice the playing time and understand all aspects of the quarter note. Keyboardist and singers are always going over the bar abusively because they don't undersatnd time and music structure. All to often doing run that change everytime there try to repeat them because they never work out the rhythm in time.

This is a problem with the genre itself. Gospel musicians and singers rarely even want to follw a drumset musician that has structure and timing because they don't want to discipline themselves. I help out at a small church (not the church I play for) whom cannot even have a comfortable service without a drummer and when they do they cannot keep time on the keys consistent because they allow their own vocals to "float" the time. That is a lack of understanding and discipline. That doesn't even make sense.
All musicians (vocalist included) should practice to a metronome and get a look on timing... groove. BTW, the SERIOUS ones do. Prince emphasized this in an interview in Guitar magazine. He said before even learning a bunch of chords etc that a person needs to get a lock on rhythm, groove... time.
Try not to become a person of success but rather a person of VALUE. - T. Harv Eker

MaestroDivine

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2006, 12:47:24 PM »
For those of you who feel my have words impacted you, I invite you to send a 'seed of apprecation' and/or a 'love offering" to my ministry. We accept cash, checks, money orders, furs, diamonds, gold, wom.....valuable art, houses, and the list goes on.

Offline SabianKnight

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2006, 12:51:22 PM »
For those of you who feel my have words impacted you, I invite you to send a 'seed of apprecation' and/or a 'love offering" to my ministry. We accept cash, checks, money orders, furs, diamonds, gold, wom.....valuable art, houses, and the list goes on.

 :D dude you are a nut  ;D
Try not to become a person of success but rather a person of VALUE. - T. Harv Eker

HustleMan

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Re: A Thought For "Drummers"...
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2006, 02:00:57 PM »
That is not to say that we are SOLELY responsible for keeping time.  Everyone drummer here as, at some point, been blamed for a tempo fluctuation that was simply not their fault.
Everyone has got to strengthen and properly practice the playing time and understand all aspects of the quarter note. Keyboardist and singers are always going over the bar abusively because they don't undersatnd time and music structure. All to often doing run that change everytime there try to repeat them because they never work out the rhythm in time.

This is a problem with the genre itself. Gospel musicians and singers rarely even want to follw a drumset musician that has structure and timing because they don't want to discipline themselves. I help out at a small church (not the church I play for) whom cannot even have a comfortable service without a drummer and when they do they cannot keep time on the keys consistent because they allow their own vocals to "float" the time. That is a lack of understanding and discipline. That doesn't even make sense.
All musicians (vocalist included) should practice to a metronome and get a look on timing... groove. BTW, the SERIOUS ones do. Prince emphasized this in an interview in Guitar magazine. He said before even learning a bunch of chords etc that a person needs to get a lock on rhythm, groove... time.

I completely understand what you're saying.

For those of you who feel my have words impacted you, I invite you to send a 'seed of apprecation' and/or a 'love offering" to my ministry. We accept cash, checks, money orders, furs, diamonds, gold, wom.....valuable art, houses, and the list goes on.

Furs?  Ok PimpDivine
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