How much should a drummer get paid if ?

[baggettcindy]

...........but, I'm curious about something else, tho'...

Why is the word 'cocky' used to describe someone arrogant? Why did they decide that THAT was a good word to use? Any ideas, ladies and gentleman?


Im prety sure it comes from the rooster, which is also called a cock. The rooster is percieved as a verry arrogant animal, hence the word "cocky". Well Im done with my orgins lesson. Class dismissed. LOL!!!!!

I think it's used because it's a popular term.  It's used sooooo much until it's almost natural to use it in place of arrogant.  Arrogant seems to be used a lot when refering to wealthy people or people with a lot of knowledge...IMO

[BEATBOXERZ]

I play the drums...i said many people think the drums are easier...they take it for granted.

Yeah, I read your profile where it says you play the drums, so you should understand. The drums are very complicated and I believe you know that. Next time you encounter some one who has that attitude, just look at those same people who believe that and when they say the arrogant statement, sit them down on your drum throne, get a music stand, place a chart on that same stand, hand them your drumsticks (the ones that have splinters in them), turn on a click track and say have at it. I bet you they will fail... I have" Aretha Franklin" for every instrumentlist who can master their craft.

[HustleMan]

Note: Every church in America has some one who plays the drums.

Note: Not every church in America has a Drummer.

If I pick up a Guitar and play two notes, does it make me a Guitarist?   

It's sad.  Laymen think that being able to sit on a kit and keep SOME kind of time playing Bass on "1" and Snare on "3" makes you a drummer and it DOESN'T.  They don't see the drums as an art, when in fact it is.  Why?

Because you MUST take time to play ANYTHING on the Guitar, Organ and Keyboard, but if you have steady time, you can hold a simple beat on a drumkit from jump.  Hence they think it's easier.  Most people have NO idea till they try to actually get on a kit and hold down a service.

[bigblackdrummer]

Hey, dirty, baby I got your money
Don't your worry, I said hey.
Baby I got your money

Ol D.B.

[HustleMan]

Hey, dirty, baby I got your money
Don't your worry, I said hey.
Baby I got your money

Ol D.B.

Amen

[bigblackdrummer]

Amen

LOL!

[Furious Styles]

I shared this story on another thread however I think it is worth sharing on this discussion. I started playing drums for 10 bucks a week for a church in Memphis back in 1991. Mind you back then the going rate was 50 bucks in most churches.  I was in my sophomore year of high school so I had no idea. I was a novice to where the money was going in church. I thought God got all of it until Jan of 1991. I got a five dollar raise about 6 months later and it stayed there until about 1996. God blessed me tremendously even though my church was using me. I played for that church until I moved to nashville in 1999. I took a seven year hiatus from playing not because of that experience but because of a promise God made to me during the mid 90's. Preaching the gospel is another passion of mine. I see ministry totally different than being another musician in the church world. Personally I'm against gigging for secular acts.(another debate) Money always finds a the way to corrupt the best of us.(if we let it)

I see why Jesus was angry at the money changer The love of money opens up evil which sows discourse into our better judgement. Pastors and leadership will always budget more for themselves.(Get used to it) Politicians do the same thing. If we could right our own salaries what would they be? I really believe that we must reform how we do church business. That's from the pulpit on down. Those seven years taught me to love God more than my instrument. When I came out of retirement earlier this year I played for 2 months for nothing. The church begged me to take 100 bucks a week. I am appreciative but I'm there for the worship experience. It is something I haven't experienced since I became a drummer. There are only 2 things in this world that I would do for free. I would play drums and I would preach God's word for nothing. It is only because of the early exposure of how people can distort God's word and use people for their own purpose. If you are a drummer getting used by your fellowship don't murmur!! I speak from personal experience when I say that God will bless you if your heart is right. He taught us to pray for those who spitefully use us. After we pray then he is the one who covicts and judges. 

Peace

Furious

[HustleMan]

I shared this story on another thread however I think it is worth sharing on this discussion. I started playing drums for 10 bucks a week for a church in Memphis back in 1991. Mind you back then the going rate was 50 bucks in most churches.  I was in my sophomore year of high school so I had no idea. I was a novice to where the money was going in church. I thought God got all of it until Jan of 1991. I got a five dollar raise about 6 months later and it stayed there until about 1996. God blessed me tremendously even though my church was using me. I played for that church until I moved to nashville in 1999. I took a seven year hiatus from playing not because of that experience but because of a promise God made to me during the mid 90's. Preaching the gospel is another passion of mine. I see ministry totally different than being another musician in the church world. Personally I'm against gigging for secular acts.(another debate) Money always finds a the way to corrupt the best of us.(if we let it)

I see why Jesus was angry at the money changer The love of money opens up evil which sows discourse into our better judgement. Pastors and leadership will always budget more for themselves.(Get used to it) Politicians do the same thing. If we could right our own salaries what would they be? I really believe that we must reform how we do church business. That's from the pulpit on down. Those seven years taught me to love God more than my instrument. When I came out of retirement earlier this year I played for 2 months for nothing. The church begged me to take 100 bucks a week. I am appreciative but I'm there for the worship experience. It is something I haven't experienced since I became a drummer. There are only 2 things in this world that I would do for free. I would play drums and I would preach God's word for nothing. It is only because of the early exposure of how people can distort God's word and use people for their own purpose. If you are a drummer getting used by your fellowship don't murmur!! I speak from personal experience when I say that God will bless you if your heart is right. He taught us to pray for those who spitefully use us. After we pray then he is the one who covicts and judges. 

Peace

Furious

Furious Styles, judging from your past posts, you seem to really have a problem with leadership.  Have you been hurt by a Pastor/Pastors before?  If so, there is a healing for you.

[j_kay]

Furious Styles: What's up, Nupe?

[Furious Styles]

I don't have a problem with Leadership. I do have a problem with the hypocrosy. To imply that I have had a bad experience because of my beliefs would be misguided. My thought pattern comes from the example of Jesus being willing to challenge the establishment. I believe that when money is the primary focus of why you serve(minister) then it is very easy to get off track. This discussion could imply that we are bitter about our experiences as  musicians in church but that isn't the case. We are all discussing the establishment which is healthy. I shared my experience to encourage not to try and tell the saddest story. I am better for my experience because my focus has been shaped in pleasing God and not lining my pockets.

That doesn't mean I wouldn't accept God's blessings through my brother or sister in Christ. It should be known that if God moves on my heart to be a blessing to someone I will do just that. Which is the true meaning of the scripture Give and shall be given. We know this scripture but the true essence of it is how men in return gives in our bosoms. That's another discussion. I am a true radical who desires to see things done right. So no hard feelings.

Sup PHI

[HustleMan]

I don't have a problem with Leadership. I do have a problem with the hypocrosy. To imply that I have had a bad experience because of my beliefs would be misguided. My thought pattern comes from the example of Jesus being willing to challenge the establishment. I believe that when money is the primary focus of why you serve(minister) then it is very easy to get off track. This discussion could imply that we are bitter about our experiences as  musicians in church but that isn't the case. We are all discussing the establishment which is healthy. I shared my experience to encourage not to try and tell the saddest story. I am better for my experience because my focus has been shaped in pleasing God and not lining my pockets.

That doesn't mean I wouldn't accept God's blessings through my brother or sister in Christ. It should be known that if God moves on my heart to be a blessing to someone I will do just that. Which is the true meaning of the scripture Give and shall be given. We know this scripture but the true essence of it is how men in return gives in our bosoms. That's another discussion. I am a true radical who desires to see things done right. So no hard feelings.

Sup PHI

 

I asked you this in another thread but you never answered.....

How long have you been at your current church?  How long have you been sitting under your present Pastor?  Are you allowing him to shepherd you?

[HustleMan]

I don't have a problem with Leadership. I do have a problem with the hypocrosy. To imply that I have had a bad experience because of my beliefs would be misguided. My thought pattern comes from the example of Jesus being willing to challenge the establishment. I believe that when money is the primary focus of why you serve(minister) then it is very easy to get off track. This discussion could imply that we are bitter about our experiences as  musicians in church but that isn't the case. We are all discussing the establishment which is healthy. I shared my experience to encourage not to try and tell the saddest story. I am better for my experience because my focus has been shaped in pleasing God and not lining my pockets.

That doesn't mean I wouldn't accept God's blessings through my brother or sister in Christ. It should be known that if God moves on my heart to be a blessing to someone I will do just that. Which is the true meaning of the scripture Give and shall be given. We know this scripture but the true essence of it is how men in return gives in our bosoms. That's another discussion. I am a true radical who desires to see things done right. So no hard feelings.

Sup PHI

Your past posts, and even some of the things you said in this post seem to indicate that you're not exactly ready to serve under a Pastor.

However, I just want to state to everyone on this board: You must follow a Pastor. 

That means you must be committed to a ministry and pay your tithe to that ministry.  Why?  Because it's scriptural.

Elisha followed and served Elijah:
IIKings 2
 1And it came to pass, when the LORD would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal.

 2And Elijah said unto Elisha, Tarry here, I pray thee; for the LORD hath sent me to Bethel. And Elisha said unto him, As the LORD liveth, and as thy soul liveth, I will not leave thee. So they went down to Bethel.

 3And the sons of the prophets that were at Bethel came forth to Elisha, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the LORD will take away thy master from thy head to day? And he said, Yea, I know it; hold ye your peace.

 4And Elijah said unto him, Elisha, tarry here, I pray thee; for the LORD hath sent me to Jericho. And he said, As the LORD liveth, and as thy soul liveth, I will not leave thee. So they came to Jericho.

 5And the sons of the prophets that were at Jericho came to Elisha, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the LORD will take away thy master from thy head to day? And he answered, Yea, I know it; hold ye your peace.

 6And Elijah said unto him, Tarry, I pray thee, here; for the LORD hath sent me to Jordan. And he said, As the LORD liveth, and as thy soul liveth, I will not leave thee. And they two went on.

He was COMMITTED to the man.  THAT'S why he received the double portion of Elijah's anointing.  Because he was committed to the Man of God. 

God values committment and steadiness. 

I want to encourage everyone here:

Find a Pastor and stick with him.  Pray and ask the Lord to direct you to the ministry that you're destined to be in.  That doesn't mean you can't play for other churches.  It simply means that no matter who you play for, you have a "home church."

Once he sends you to that Ministry, don't "Challenge the Establishment".  That's called Rebellion.   

[Furious Styles]

At this point I am a hired gun for this church. I haven't joined this church. The minister of music at this church is a childhood friend. In fact we were at the same church that I mentioned in my earlier post. He made 5 bucks more than I did!! We have been down with each other for some years and he practically begged me to play. I'm not one to turn down a friend in need so I obliged and played for free at this church for almost 3 months.  I've experienced some great things spiritually at this church. For the first time I've seen spiritual gifts flow without inhabition. The praise team is small and not as "talented" but they are sincere and faithful.

A lot of the music we do is unrehearsed and the spirit really moves in this church. The pastor seems to be a great guy but I haven't found him to be the sheperd that I know that God has for me. I'm looking for someone who will not only chasten me but have a geniune interest in my gift and calling. That is rare to find in a pastor nowadays because it is all about advancing "the kingdom" which in a lot of cases are individual church kingdoms but I digress on that. I need a pastor who shares my radical approach to ministry. My wife and I attend a mega church which hasn't satisfied my itch for the radical either. Most would take this as someone who needs a lot of attention or someone who wants things their way or the hghway.

That's not it either. I know what God has in me and typically who you are assigned to is placed in your life by God and not by who you think. I'm praying for that day. That doesn't mean I do everything right or I believe I'm perfect. Part of my calling needs a kindred spirit that I respect and that individual respects me as well. The main reason I haven't joined this church because it is small congregation with the residue of the mega church mentality which I want no part of.. Mentality is key no matter the size of a church. I've grown to a place where if it was 10 to 20 sincere people and we were all on one accord with or without the music and the word is being rightly divided then that would be the place for me to be. I'm after a more initmate walk with God. I hope that sheds more light on where I'm comming from. If not I don't expect to understand everyone nor do I expect everyone to understand me. So its cool either way. I appreciate your conern.

Furious

[drummer4god]

well depending on were and wat church u play for. if u play for a church with 100 members u should get like $50 if u playing for a church that holds 500 members and up a drummer should be gettin paid like $100 and up. but just remember it shouldnt be bout the money yea we need it and yea its good to play and get paid, but its about jesus guys..... i dont get paid at my church as yet...... but i pay for other groups and other church services and i get like $80 AND UP but with me im doing it for GOD.

[HustleMan]

At this point I am a hired gun for this church. I haven't joined this church. The minister of music at this church is a childhood friend. In fact we were at the same church that I mentioned in my earlier post. He made 5 bucks more than I did!! We have been down with each other for some years and he practically begged me to play. I'm not one to turn down a friend in need so I obliged and played for free at this church for almost 3 months.  I've experienced some great things spiritually at this church. For the first time I've seen spiritual gifts flow without inhabition. The praise team is small and not as "talented" but they are sincere and faithful.

A lot of the music we do is unrehearsed and the spirit really moves in this church. The pastor seems to be a great guy but I haven't found him to be the sheperd that I know that God has for me. I'm looking for someone who will not only chasten me but have a geniune interest in my gift and calling. That is rare to find in a pastor nowadays because it is all about advancing "the kingdom" which in a lot of cases are individual church kingdoms but I digress on that. I need a pastor who shares my radical approach to ministry. My wife and I attend a mega church which hasn't satisfied my itch for the radical either. Most would take this as someone who needs a lot of attention or someone who wants things their way or the hghway.

That's not it either. I know what God has in me and typically who you are assigned to is placed in your life by God and not by who you think. I'm praying for that day. That doesn't mean I do everything right or I believe I'm perfect. Part of my calling needs a kindred spirit that I respect and that individual respects me as well. The main reason I haven't joined this church because it is small congregation with the residue of the mega church mentality which I want no part of.. Mentality is key no matter the size of a church. I've grown to a place where if it was 10 to 20 sincere people and we were all on one accord with or without the music and the word is being rightly divided then that would be the place for me to be. I'm after a more initmate walk with God. I hope that sheds more light on where I'm comming from. If not I don't expect to understand everyone nor do I expect everyone to understand me. So its cool either way. I appreciate your conern.

Furious

I pray the Lord leads you to your Under Shepherd.

God Bless.   

[theLearner]

I don't mind getting under paid.....as long as im playing drums......I'll settle for $40.00 a week at  ANY church......
I haven't started getting gigs or anything....most of the drumming i have been doin for the 3 years i have been drumming was practicing and learning about drums

 (I did play at my chuch but not for money....and the music wasn't organized with proper singers or other musicians at all..)

I don't take those gigs for granted at all.....
As long as i get to play

[Icecold24k]

Well It seems I sparked up a major conversation I will state this yes its a ministry an you should be there to praise God but it takes money to build a successful ministry thus the reasoning that a pastor takes an offering every sunday. A music ministry takes money to function also because what about when musicians buy stuff to enhance their gift such as sheet music,videos,cds,tapes,keyboards,drums,drumsticks,heads,soundmodules,mpc's also lets not forget the music department does a lot of running like the preacher consider gas money all that goes into that check you get every sunday for playing an instrument an directing at the service.
Like me right now I play at 2 churches just to make gas money to get to rehearsals an services but I have no money for any thing extra to enhance my gift an its cause I'm a very under paid drummer an I love the Lord an I believe right now he's showing me where my blessings lie an I should count it all joy . 

[FerrariRed]

Interesting points and opinions.  I have been a drummer for Mt. Zion Baptist Church in Nashville, TN since 1996.  When my pastor (Bishop Joseph Warren Walker, III asked me to play he was just starting out.  I initially replied to him I would play for nothing because I simply did not believe I should be paid by the church for "work for the Lord".  He appreciated my response and offered me $50 per Sunday.

As his mininstry grew, then sky-rocketed, we began to receive raises every year.  My pastor is a former drummer and drum major for the Southern University Marching Band, Baton Rouge, Louisiana.  So he knows music.  He also understands the importance of music in the ministry and the services.  To fast forward, we are now one church in three locations within the city of Nashville, Tennessee and a fourth location in Jackson, Tennessee about 125 miles between Nashville and Memphis, Tennessee.

Our pay depends on our MUSICAL contribution and experience to the ministry.  Of course our minister of music receives a very nice salary because he is the man responsible for selecting the music and incorporating the music into the services and various programs that are held at the church.  He is fulltime, writes songs, oversees choir and band rehearsals, directs choir, a recording musician, toured with Donnie McClurkin, CeCe Winans.  He is responsible for making sure that Bishop's musical request are met at any church service or program (Sunday, Wednesday and any other day).

The music directors (MD) (Virgil Stratford and Tyrone Dickerson) at each location receive a nice salary, because they are also fulltime like the minister of music.  They write songs, conduct rehearsals, make sure musicians have music in advance before rehearsals, recorded with various artists, toured with the likes of Yolanda Adams, Rizen, Joe Slaughter and Kirk Whalum.  All eyes are on them when the service begins.  One thing Bishop dislikes is dead silence.

We have a praise and worship leader who is a fulltime recording artists: Benita Washington (just released her second album).  She leads praise & worship at any service or program, assist in directing choir rehearsals, oversees praise teams at each location, leads the congregation in the Sunday Morning hymn selection.

We have an organist that plays, but was specifically hired to back bishop while he preaches.  He is fortunate to travel with him everywhere he preaches.  He is fulltime, recording artist and he is responsible for laying the down the B3 for any songs we play.  So he attends all rehearsals also.

The remaining musicians are paid biweekly.  I make $14,000 per year parttime.  But I have a fulltime job and will have my Masters in Public Administration by July 2007.  I am expected to be at all rehearsals, services and programs.  Me and the other drummers split the additional services and programs.  Of course as the ministry grew and the church's financial responsibilities had to be met, pay was reconstructed.  So everybody does not receive the same pay.  But the point of all I have typed is our pay is based on our musical experience and contribution to the music ministry.  I don't expect to receive what my minister of music or MD receives.  I make my living another way.  So I understand their salaries are based on musical experience and meeting their personal needs for their families and themselves because they are fulltime.

I would simply say, trust God, know your musical instrument inside and out.  Understand you are not there to showoff your musical chops.  Be prepared at every rehearsal and service.  The money will follow.  ALSO understand your church's financial obligations.  Don't expect a large salary and the ministry is in the early stages or they simply do not have the money to meet your financial needs.

You are there to touch someone's life through your musical instrument.  I could not believe it, but I have had two people on totally separate occasions tell me I touched them spiritually from the drums.  Wow, that blew me away.  But it is aligned with the scripture I recite before I play: Psalm 150.

[JFunky]

Matthew Chapter 6

  19"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal.
20But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

28"And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin.

 29 Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these.
30 If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?
31So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?'
32 For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them.

33 But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

[sonofpaul]

FerrariRed..Amen,Amen, and some mo' Amen...Ferrari did the right thing, humbled himself and asked for nothing and now $14,000 part-time!!!!