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Author Topic: another unwise choose in God's name..  (Read 6203 times)

Offline pastor rob

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another unwise choose in God's name..
« on: March 27, 2008, 08:48:26 PM »
Sadly, it continues.

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In Him,

Pastor Rob

Offline pastor rob

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2008, 08:50:23 PM »
Sorry, here it is.


Police are investigating an 11-year-old girl's death from an undiagnosed, treatable form of diabetes after her parents chose to pray for her rather than take her to a doctor.
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An autopsy showed Madeline Neumann died Sunday of diabetic ketoacidosis, a condition that left too little insulin in her body, Everest Metro Police Chief Dan Vergin said.

She had probably been ill for about a month, suffering symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, excessive thirst, loss of appetite and weakness, the chief said Wednesday, noting that he expects to complete the investigation by Friday and forward the results to the district attorney.

The girl's mother, Leilani Neumann, said that she and her family believe in the Bible and that healing comes from God, but that they do not belong to an organized religion or faith, are not fanatics and have nothing against doctors.

She insisted her youngest child, a wiry girl known to wear her straight brown hair in a ponytail, was in good health until recently.

"We just noticed a tiredness within the past two weeks," she said Wednesday. "And then just the day before and that day (she died), it suddenly just went to a more serious situation. We stayed fast in prayer then. We believed that she would recover. We saw signs that to us, it looked like she was recovering."

Her daughter ? who hadn't seen a doctor since she got some shots as a 3-year-old, according to Vergin ? had no fever and there was warmth in her body, she said.

The girl's father, Dale Neumann, a former police officer, said he started CPR "as soon as the breath of life left" his daughter's body.

Family members elsewhere called authorities to seek help for the girl.

"My sister-in-law, she's very religious, she believes in faith instead of doctors ...," the girl's aunt told a sheriff's dispatcher Sunday afternoon in a call from California. "And she called my mother-in-law today ... and she explained to us that she believes her daughter's in a coma now and she's relying on faith."

The dispatcher got more information from the caller and asked whether an ambulance should be sent.

"Please," the woman replied. "I mean, she's refusing. She's going to fight it. ... We've been trying to get her to take her to the hospital for a week, a few days now."

The aunt called back with more information on the family's location, emergency logs show. Family friends also made a 911 call from the home. Police and paramedics arrived within minutes and immediately called for an ambulance that took her to a hospital.

But less than an hour after authorities reached the home, Madeline ? a bright student who left public school for home schooling this semester ? was declared dead.

She is survived by her parents and three older siblings.

"We are remaining strong for our children," Leilani Neumann said. "Only our faith in God is giving us strength at this time."

The Neumanns said they moved from California to a modern, middle-class home in woodsy Weston, just outside Wassau in central Wisconsin, about two years ago to open a coffee shop and be closer to other relatives. A basketball hoop is set up in the driveway.

Leilani Neumann said she and her husband are not worried about the investigation because "our lives are in God's hands. We know we did not do anything criminal. We know we did the best for our daughter we knew how to do."
In Him,

Pastor Rob

Offline under13

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2008, 09:04:10 PM »
Yeah they should go to Jail. The Child would most likely have lived if they had went to the Hospital. They endangered her life. And she Died because of thier negligence

God gave us doctors for a reason. Of course we have to have faith and pray, but Dotcors are here to help us

Offline uriahsmusic

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2008, 09:10:06 PM »
...most interesting....what does the word say about going to the doctor vs trusting Him to heal you?

Offline sjonathan02

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2008, 09:25:39 PM »
Yeah they should go to Jail. The Child would most likely have lived if they had went to the Hospital. They endangered her life. And she Died because of thier negligence

God gave us doctors for a reason. Of course we have to have faith and pray, but Dotcors are here to help us


*in my best Scottish/Irish accent*

Are they now? ::) :D
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Offline under13

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2008, 09:28:44 PM »

*in my best Scottish/Irish accent*

Are they now? ::) :D

*in my best Scottish/Irish accent*

Are they now? ::) :D

You can "SADDOWN" until LGM gets a spell chek, like every othre mesage bored :) ;D

Offline chevonee

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2008, 09:29:53 PM »
This is a dog gone shame.
Strike while the iron is hot!

Offline csedwards2

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2008, 09:49:00 PM »
I dont think they should be jailed.

Offline under13

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2008, 09:58:42 PM »
I dont think they should be jailed.


Why?

Offline csedwards2

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2008, 10:21:25 PM »
Why?
Because that would get into the argument of "Should the govt, FDA, etc be requiring people to take X treatment, drug, procedure, or surgery."

I wouldnt want the govt  requiring me to do any specific treatment or procedure.

They dont know everything! Or if they do, they are not forthright in bringing truth. Because the healthcare industry is money-driven, and not health driven, certain practices are encouraged when they arent in the best interest of the patient; when it very well should be.

You've got cancer doctors who will never take Chemotherapy themselves, but will administer the treatment to anybody else who becomes diagnosed.

Remember this guy http://www.courttv.com/trials/cherrix/081606_ctv.html

Im not saying the parents of this new kid were 100% right or wrong. Thats not my call. But I do think somepeople, sometimes put too much faith in doctors and/or the drugs or advice they prescribe.

Offline sjonathan02

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2008, 10:24:52 PM »
You can "SADDOWN" until LGM gets a spell chek, like every othre mesage bored :) ;D

Ok, then can we discuss your inability to use the LGM "quoting" system correctly?  :D :D :D :D

BTW, if you use Mozilla, IT has spell check built in. ;) 8)
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Offline B3Wannabe

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2008, 10:28:11 PM »
Yeah they should go to Jail. The Child would most likely have lived if they had went to the Hospital. They endangered her life. And she Died because of thier negligence

God gave us doctors for a reason. Of course we have to have faith and pray, but Dotcors are here to help us


Man! I almost lost it on you for a second! That was the craziest thing I've ever heard! All this talk and you don't even have children! Come back when you have children!
 >:( >:( >:( >:(

.... ::)

....I'm saddened by this case, but these parents should definitely not go to jail. Just say for instance your kid comes up to you one night saying their head hurts, you pray for them and then later they die from an aneurysm, you go to jail?!!! Crazy laws! ....and then they were homeschooling too. Makes crazy politicians and administrators think they have to monitor everything we do!

Offline under13

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2008, 10:47:43 PM »
Man! I almost lost it on you for a second! That was the craziest thing I've ever heard! All this talk and you don't even have children! Come back when you have children!
 >:( >:( >:( >:(

.... ::)

....I'm saddened by this case, but these parents should definitely not go to jail. Just say for instance your kid comes up to you one night saying their head hurts, you pray for them and then later they die from an aneurysm, you go to jail?!!! Crazy laws! ....and then they were homeschooling too. Makes crazy politicians and administrators think they have to monitor everything we do!




This was more than a headache.
I think of it from this standpoint. How would I feel if I became Very very sick or died, because my parents refused to take me to the doctor to get treatment that most likely would have gotten rid of my sickness in a few days

 she had been ill for about a month, suffering symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, excessive thirst, loss of appetite and weaknes

Now if those symptoms were present for a day or two, then ok, But for a child to be in that kinda pain and sickness for over a month just seems negligent. You cant compare that to one headache.


Offline B3Wannabe

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2008, 11:12:42 PM »
This was more than a headache.
I think of it from this standpoint. How would I feel if I became Very very sick or died, because my parents refused to take me to the doctor to get treatment that most likely would have gotten rid of my sickness in a few days

 she had been ill for about a month, suffering symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, excessive thirst, loss of appetite and weaknes

Now if those symptoms were present for a day or two, then ok, But for a child to be in that kinda pain and sickness for over a month just seems negligent. You cant compare that to one headache.

Dude.

I know people that have died from aneurysms. The onset can be just as slow. I've had two family members die, almost in the same way this girl died. Both had diabetes. Both died on the way to the hospital after leaving the church.

I'm not disagreeing that they should've taken her to the doctor, but I'm disagreeing with your opinion that they should be jailed. If this were me, I would've prayed for direction. If God said take them to the hospital, I would've taken them, but doing so doesn't guarantee healing!!!!!!

And the parents are right. The girl can be resurrected. The news is making them out to be psychos. Religious, home-schooling, anti-medicine, psychos. I take offense to that.

You still have no idea what you're talking about.

Offline Iamluv

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2008, 11:50:48 PM »
The fact that the father, started to give his daughter cpr after she wasn't breathing, is suspect.  If you believe fasting and praying  is enough, then why administer cpr?  I, don't say jail these parents...those who know better do better, but I, say by every means neccessary, protect the other children from the same ignorance.  What if this child wanted to live and had no say so in the matter because of her age and her parents beliefs? This child suffered and they need to be held accountable for their actions.
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Offline under13

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2008, 11:57:00 PM »
The fact that the father, started to give his daughter cpr after she wasn't breathing, is suspect.  If you believe fasting and praying  is enough, then why administer cpr?  I, don't say jail these parents...those who know better do better, but I, say by every means neccessary, protect the other children from the same ignorance.  What if this child wanted to live and had no say so in the matter because of her age and her parents beliefs? This child suffered and they need to be held accountable for their actions.

If not Prison, What kind of punishment do you think is appropriate for this situation?

Offline baggettcindy

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2008, 12:30:48 AM »
A few  years ago, Oprah had a lady on her show who also believed in faith healing and not going to seek medical help.  I think her daughter died also from something a few dollars worth of medicine could've prevented.  Ya know what?  Oprah pointed out this lady was wearing glasses.  So...she asked..why not pray God will heal your eyes..why wear glasses? (paraphrased).  I thought Oprah had a good point.

Offline BigFoot_BigThumb

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #17 on: March 28, 2008, 12:44:46 AM »
I will say is it's one thing to have faith, and it's another thing to use good common sense.

Some people let someone else's idea of faith make them stupid.  This incident was outright stuoid and a child died. C'mon, a whole month?

Some doctors are really about helping the sick, and God helps them to do that.  Some doctors are about helping themselves by filling their pockets.  Like these Hollywood plastic surgeons.  That doesn't make them all bad.
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Offline B3Wannabe

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #18 on: March 28, 2008, 04:16:49 AM »
It settled. More than one of you are crazy!

Offline sjonathan02

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Re: another unwise choose in God's name..
« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2008, 06:30:18 AM »
It settled. More than one of you are crazy!




Pot meet Kettle.
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