Playing By Ear, Knowing What Key Your In...

[dabeastleash]

When I find a melody of a song I just can't figure out how to find the chords. I already read the theory posts, but there are many that are gone because AGPraise closed his account on youtube.  I'm wondering what are the major things that I need to know so I can start playing in service behind another musician and not look foolish when I get up there.  If you guyz could just help me out.  And my other question is, when playing in service how do you know which key you are in???

Thanks In Advance,

[under13]

You know what key you are in by knowing the scales, and knowing what notes belong, and which  ones dont belong in that scale/key

[PianoWizard]

You know what key you are in by knowing the scales, and knowing what notes belong, and which  ones dont belong in that scale/key

That's some 1st class wisdom doc..... . I play by ear and that's the way I do it, look for the melody line and the scale that fits.

PianoWiz...

[sjonathan02]

When I find a melody of a song I just can't figure out how to find the chords. I already read the theory posts, but there are many that are gone because AGPraise closed his account on youtube.  I'm wondering what are the major things that I need to know so I can start playing in service behind another musician and not look foolish when I get up there.  If you guyz could just help me out.  And my other question is, when playing in service how do you know which key you are in???

Thanks In Advance,

You MUST find the bass note. That's usually easier with a CD, though. When you're in a service (and mind you, I don't play in a service of any kind), I'd suggest finding the melody, then looking for the corresponding bass note, then fill in the middle (as long as you know your chords; three notes is all you need when you're getting started).

[musallio]

#1: Finding the key

What U13 said Smiley

Finding the bassnote is ok, but it doesn't help you find the key if you don't know whether it's the tonic (root), 6, 5 or whichever.
The same applies for the melody note.

I usually use either the melody note or the bass to find the root note (I use the melody notes more though.) This helps you to establish the key you are in.
But it helps to be familiar with how most of the other tones sound like so that for a song that takes long to go to the root, you can establish what the root is , say, when you play & can identify a 4 note (sub dominant sound)..

#2: Finding chords to melody note.

99% of the time, you have to know the key you are in before you can add any chords to a melody note. This is because you have to know how the chord is acting--eg, is it a 1 chord or a 4 or 5 chord in that specific key you are playing in..So only add chords that you are certain with...

My second answer to this part is that you start off by playing slow in your practice-the focus should be on analyzing the chords you play for any song..look at the notes that make up the chord & listen to the sound they make & how that links up with the song you are playing.
Fret not because you will not have to do this forever--Once you've been playing for a while, & you've played various songs, you would have INCREASED YOUR CHORD BASE & THE INSTANCES WHEN EACH CHORD CAN BE USED.

#3: Playing behind another musician

What instrument will this other musician be on? I'm sure they'd most likelly be playing piano Undecided
So then you should be playing other sounds for nice effects--there are plenty of sounds you can play..
There are selections from the wind instruments (Whistle, Bottleblow, Panflute, flute, recorder etc), brass (mute trumpet, sax, french horns etc), synth pads etc: all of these don't require you to play chords--you merely harmonize based on what you are hearing in your head or how you thing the song can go in that given beat/ rhythm...I know it sounds terrible if I try to play chords with those voices..
So if you play with them, I advise you to listen to songs that uses similar sound effects..

I know that if I run out of ideas for instance, for fast songs, I just use the brass & as in beat as I can, I play a 5,6,1,6,1 [in Db: Ab,Bb,Db or Ab,Bb,Db,Bb,Db]
This is just 1 idea that works well for many fast songs (just like how the 1-4 bass runs work for just about any fast song).

The nice thing with brass also is that you don't have to play all the time--you can just play "in the spaces" or fill in every now & again..listen to more recordings with such stuff  (Kirk's Brighter Day, lotsa Fred Hammond & many many more.)


Notice how all of the above requires you to play a 1 fingered note.
To play chords, you can use the string sounds as well (note how they fit both categories.) But remember to sustain the strings & make sure that you don't change chords too often as the piano would be doing..again, listening to recordings with strings will help you get a feel of what it should sound like/ can be done for dynamic effects.

The organs can also be used to play chords or single note runs..I love the organs coz they scream..& you can make it scream at the end of each verse by doing a run down from the 1 to the 5 [1,7,6,5] before a new verse/chorus starts. This one is the one an octave higher than where you'd be playing.

I hope these ideas make sense & will hep you to start exploring with new ideas. Smiley

[sjonathan02]

#1: Finding the key
Finding the bassnote is ok, but it doesn't help you find the key if you don't know whether it's the tonic (root), 6, 5 or whichever.
The same applies for the melody note.

I usually use either the melody note or the bass to find the root note (I use the melody notes more though.) This helps you to establish the key you are in.
But it helps to be familiar with how most of the other tones sound like so that for a song that takes long to go to the root, you can establish what the root is , say, when you play & can identify a 4 note (sub dominant sound)..

Aren't we saying the same thing just using two different methods?

If I use the melody, I still don't necessarily know the interval from note to note the same as you're suggesting by using the bass.

The other reason why this helps me (and I may be the only one which is completely fine) is because the melody can be doing a whole bunch of other things (the singer taking all day to get to 'ma' in the song "Amazing Grace" for example) before going to the next note in the song.

[musallio]

Aren't we saying the same thing just using two different methods?

If I use the melody, I still don't necessarily know the interval from note to note the same as you're suggesting by using the bass.

The other reason why this helps me (and I may be the only one which is completely fine) is because the melody can be doing a whole bunch of other things (the singer taking all day to get to 'ma' in the song "Amazing Grace" for example) before going to the next note in the song.

 

[themidiroom]

Aren't we saying the same thing just using two different methods?

If I use the melody, I still don't necessarily know the interval from note to note the same as you're suggesting by using the bass.

The other reason why this helps me (and I may be the only one which is completely fine) is because the melody can be doing a whole bunch of other things (the singer taking all day to get to 'ma' in the song "Amazing Grace" for example) before going to the next note in the song.

Actually all the methods discussed here can be used.  So many songs have similar patterns so when you hear the melody, you can figure out what interval it is as it relates to the pattern of that song and that will usually lead you back to the root.  For instance, if the song is 1-4-5-1  and the melody corresponds to the 4, then you can figure out where the 1 is.  This only works if you're familiar with the song or if you can identify where the song is going.

[Fenix]

Listen out for the pattern of the song. Do you know the number system? If not, learn it and learn how it applies to songs. That is, tome, one the most important things a musician should know. Its all well and good if you can pick out the melody, but if you have no idea what the pattern is, then you will be lost.

When you learn by melody, take time out to learn what note the accompanying chord comes in on. Each chord in a song (for simple ones at least) have a melody note that signifies the chord to be played. Listen out for that.

For example, lets say a song is in C major and the melody note is an E, you know that there are 3 chords that can use the E in the C major scale: C major, E minor and A minor. Try each chord and see which one works best. This is my approach to learning simple enough songs.

For more complex songs, i beg for chords.

[sjonathan02]

Listen out for the pattern of the song. Do you know the number system? If not, learn it and learn how it applies to songs. That is, tome, one the most important things a musician should know. Its all well and good if you can pick out the melody, but if you have no idea what the pattern is, then you will be lost.

When you learn by melody, take time out to learn what note the accompanying chord comes in on. Each chord in a song (for simple ones at least) have a melody note that signifies the chord to be played. Listen out for that.

For example, lets say a song is in C major and the melody note is an E, you know that there are 3 chords that can use the E in the C major scale: C major, E minor and A minor. Try each chord and see which one works best. This is my approach to learning simple enough songs.

For more complex songs, i beg for chords.

This is great if you the key you're in. We're discussing how to know what key you're in.

In other words, if I don't know I'm in C but hear that E, how do I find my way to the tonic (or root) note.

[themidiroom]

This is great if you the key you're in. We're discussing how to know what key you're in.

In other words, if I don't know I'm in C but hear that E, how do I find my way to the tonic (or root) note.

Don't be difficult Sjon.  We're saying that if you hear a progression, you may have to hypothesize to figure out the tonic note.  Depending on the song, you might be wrong but this method will cover quite a few songs.  It's amazing how many songs go to 5 then to 1.

[bullet1]

I would basically wait and listen for the sogn to go through once.  Once the song resolves listen for the resolve.  That would be your 1 chord.  Listen for where it goes after that.  Maybe the 3 or the 4 usually.  After that you can pretty much know what scale your in.  Especially if you know the melody. 

Here is a theory that I have come to notice and figured out on my own with commen theory sense.  Every scale has another scalel that is closely associated with another scale save two notes.  So if you can play in C#-Db you can play in F# save two notes. 

So listen for the melody.  Just finger through the melody while they are singing just make sure your not very loud.  Once you figure out the resolve or the start of a song you have what scale your in 9x's out of ten.  So if the song resolves in G or it starts in G then your going to play the chords associated with that scale. 

Get Jamal's new DVD.  It breaks down how to play a song by ear. 

I hope this made sense and helps out.  If not disregard my post. 

[Fenix]

I would basically wait and listen for the sogn to go through once.  Once the song resolves listen for the resolve.  That would be your 1 chord.  Listen for where it goes after that.  Maybe the 3 or the 4 usually.  After that you can pretty much know what scale your in.  Especially if you know the melody. 

Bingo, baby!

This is great if you the key you're in. We're discussing how to know what key you're in.

In other words, if I don't know I'm in C but hear that E, how do I find my way to the tonic (or root) note.

  

Oh wait, we are in the Piano room aren't we?

Crud.

[cas10a]

All songs do not resolve to or start on the 1 (this will not always tell you the key), more times than not it will happen, but not always.  To find the key it's best to know and use your scales, they will tell you the key of the song.  If you know your scales well enough you can find the key just by playing a scale through the song without knowing the exact melody or the root bass note.

[themidiroom]

All songs do not resolve to or start on the 1 (this will not always tell you the key), more times than not it will happen, but not always. 

You're right.  I guess experience is a good teacher because even when a song doesn't resolve to the 1, I can still hear the 1.

[dabeastleash]

Can I get some information on where to get Jamal's DVD??

[cas10a]

You're right.  I guess experience is a good teacher because even when a song doesn't resolve to the 1, I can still hear the 1.

Exactly, experience is a good teacher and it may be possible for some to still hear the 1 even though a song may not resolve to the 1.

"Holy One" by Tremaine Hawkins is a good example of a song that doesn't start on the 1 or resolve to the 1.  It's in the key of Gb, but the verse start chord and end chord is a BMaj9 the (4).

[under13]

If i'm not sure of the key I'm in, I just play the cadence or turnaround, and it will usually end on the 1.

What I also would do is think about the shout walk up, I know that if I start it on C, then i'm in Ab. If It starts on F, Then I'm in Db etc

[sjonathan02]

Don't be difficult Sjon.  We're saying that if you hear a progression, you may have to hypothesize to figure out the tonic note.  Depending on the song, you might be wrong but this method will cover quite a few songs.  It's amazing how many songs go to 5 then to 1.

Who's being difficult? 

[themidiroom]

Who's being difficult? 

I know you can't hep it.