@Churchy, sounds like a great plan to me. Thanks for putting it together. Just as a heads up, no matter how good a book it is, I tend to struggle big time with my focus when I'm reading anything non-fictional. :-[ :-\ :( I'll try to stick to the schedule, but I may fall behind a day or two (unless it's just an unexpectedly brilliant read).
@Fenix, well we can discuss online in a thread (or even via Skype, if everyone has one). If you ARE interested, I'm thinking a thread might work best for you, with the 5+ hour time difference.
This. But Im down for the cause. Wheres the best place to get it?
Sounds like an interesting read. I just downloaded it.
I am interested, however the book is non-fictional so i tend to struggle with those. :) I think we may need to spread out the chapters a bit more. Churchy's schedule looks really tight. :)
A thread would work best. As it is, i suspect most people won't have time for a Skype conference until late at night ( maybe 8pm-9pm US time, which is about 3am UK time). That just doesn't work for me.
I got mine via amazon.
Cool!
Yeah I'm in favor of thread discussion. And it's mainly a chapter (give or take introduction/definitions at beginning and afterword at end) a day.....LOL! You can do it! :D
Uh, people have things to do (well, maybe not you----j/k) so a chapter a day may not be feasible.
I'm interested, though.
I thought I was the only one who thought that schedule was a bit aggressive. LOL! Churchy, maybe we can do something that looks like 3-4 chapters a week? Plus, that'll give the speed readers some time to digest what they're reading?
@BBG, I got mine from Amazon, too. Your local library may have it, and I'm sure your local Christian bookstore will have it.
@Fenix the longest chapter is 2 with about 25-30 pages. The other chapters are about 15-20 pages on average.
Okay, now that I have a calendar and the Table of Contents in front of me, here is my proposal. I like the idea of having discussion on Thursdays (only because people seem to scatter on Fridays). Does that work for everyone?
May 16 - May 18: Acknowledgments, Preface, Introduction, and
Chapter 1 - "Have We Really Been Doing it By the Book?" (pgs 1-8)
May 19 - Discussion
May 19 - May 25:
Chapter 2 - "The Church Building" (pgs 9-46)
May 26 - Discussion
May 26 - June 1:
Chapter 3 - "The Order of Worship" (pgs 47-84)
June 2 - Discussion
June 2 - June 8:
Chapter 4 - "The Sermon" (pgs. 85-104)
Chapter 5 - "The Pastor" (pgs. 105-144)
June 9 - Discussion
June 9 - June 15:
Chapter 6 - "The Sermon" (pgs. 145-156)
Chapter 7 - "Ministers of Music" (pgs. 157-170)
Chapter 8 - "Tithing and Clergy Salaries (pgs. 171-186)
Chapter 9 - "Baptism and the Lord's Supper" (pgs. 187-198)
June 16 - Discussion
June 16 - June 22:
Chapter 10 - "Christian Education" (pgs. 199-220)
Chapter 11 - "Reapproaching the New Testament" (pgs. 221-242)
June 23 - Discussion
June 23 - June 29:
Chapter 12 - "A Second Glance at the Savior" (pgs. 243-252)
**OPTIONAL**
Afterword
Final Thoughts
Summary
Key Figures in Church History (pgs. 253-280)
June 30 - Discussion
Oooh shole is... lemme fix that right quick.
I'm really looking forward to the entire book, but based on the titles alone, I guess the first five chapters are what I'm most anxious to dig into! If it's written well (and the writing style and font work with my brain), I'll probably be reading ahead a little bit. But I'm really going to try to stick to the schedule so I can digest and ponder (and research) what I'm reading.
And by the way, Barna and Viola: if wearing a "Sunday Morning Costume" is pagan, then just go ahead and call me a heathen. #lovemycostumes
I will sadly probably not be in the discussions. I have stuff going on every week night. :(
You gonna leave me alone with all these guys, Nessa??? SMH!Can't be helped, I guess. I've been praying about streamlining my time. There's a lot of extra stuff I do for a lot of people, and it's starting to overload my schedule. I want to strip my time down to prayer time, study time, practice time, work, and my local church. Everything else is on the table to be CHOPPED.
:|
The billboard charts called, they said they won't be seeing you any time soon ...
LOL!
Can't be helped, I guess. I've been praying about streamlining my time. There's a lot of extra stuff I do for a lot of people, and it's starting to overload my schedule. I want to strip my time down to prayer time, study time, practice time, work, and my local church. Everything else is on the table to be CHOPPED.
Just a correction: Chapter 6 is entitled "Sunday Morning Costumes."
Which chapters are yall looking forward to reading the most??
key figures in church history
Yes! I tell ya, I wonder if things would change if more people understood the historic origins of many of our practices and why we do what we do....JESUS!I have trouble seeing how you could do communion wrong, lol. I mean it's kinda clearly laid out in the bible. It's not a grey area.
For me, that chapter. I'm also interested in the one on the sermon. Have we been doing the sermon wrong for centuries? I'm also interested in the one about communion. I am so convinced that our current practice of communion (particularly in the Baptist) has catholic origins.
Also the music ministry one.
Gosh I'm just ready to dig in....LOL!
I have trouble seeing how you could do communion wrong, lol. I mean it's kinda clearly laid out in the bible. It's not a grey area.
For me, that convenience, microwave, quickie communion is just wrong. :-\
I joke about it a lot, but honest to God, I absolutely HATE it. (No, I don't think anybody is going to hell behind it, but I really do hate those little 2fer cups).
IRT Churchy's comment, I think in general, people feel like it's not a big deal and it doesn't really matter as long as souls are being saved or the churches are growing, etc... that's in reference to sermons or anything else we find in this book.
I have trouble seeing how you could do communion wrong, lol. I mean it's kinda clearly laid out in the bible. It's not a grey area.
nessa I know you are going to be busy, but I hope you are able to read along with us or at least maybe a chapter or something if you have the time if you can't do the whole book ... cause this book is going to generate some interesting discussions that will affect the future of the readers.
I disagree. Here's why: communion, based on how my church and many protestants do it, is basically a piece of bread or a cracker and grape juice (or wine). That's catholicism practice. From my understanding, communion in the bible was an entire meal. While Jesus had supper and said "this is my body broken for you....." and "this is my blood.........", based on my understanding communion was a full meal.Churchy, so you think people are wrong, when Jesus clearly took the bread and the cup and said this is my body/blood AFTER they had supped. The ceremony is in commemoration of that particular symbolism, not what they had for dinner that night!
That's just my take though. :-\
Churchy, so you think people are wrong, when Jesus clearly took the bread and the cup and said this is my body/blood AFTER they had supped. The ceremony is in commemoration of that particular symbolism, not what they had for dinner that night!
But it should be a meal, if we're doing it biblically. BTJMWhere do you get that and why do you think that? The last supper was a meal, but communion took place after the supper. In fact, in one of Paul's writings (gotta find the scripture) he says don't just come here for a meal, because people were making it about food and potluck rather than focusing on remembering Christ's suffering.
:-\
LOL!And you would consider that a meal? Some bread and some juice? In that case, we already are having a meal!
I get ya, but I guess we'll agree to disagree. I just think if we're going to do communion biblically, we should go back to it being a meal. HOWEVER, it should still be done with bread and wine or grape juice or whatever. No raisin bread and no orange juice....LOL!
And you would consider that a meal? Some bread and some juice? In that case, we already are having a meal!
LOVE that show. #thatisallI love that show too along with Top Chef Masters, Iron Chef America, etc...
I love that show too along with Top Chef Masters, Iron Chef America, etc...
I gave up on that one. Somewhere there's a disconnect...
But what if i consider a little bit of bread and a thimble-ful of grape juice a meal?
Im sorry man, but i just do not see it in Acts 2: 42-47. At every instance, it is only talking about the "breaking of bread", which is something Jesus did AFTER he had the last supper.
OK, i think we need to be careful when reading this book. The problem i have found ouyt, mainly from personal experience, is that people don't read these types of books without an objective mind-set. You need to take what the author is saying and test it and research his claims, rather than just swallowing it hook, line, and sinker.
And this is why many believe that the end of the day it doesn't matter how you do it as long as you do it somehow (pragmatism). :-\
But yeah, this book is going to SERIOUSLY challenge some traditional ideologies about certain things from the pulpit to dressing up in church, etc. It's going to have to be a book in which you can look at their stuff and be very empirical AND OBJECTIVE about it!
I want in.....I've gotta see can I purchase the book today. Will someone please remind me of the schedule please? I've got so many things going on right now and I don't want to forget. I hope my ADD doesn't get in the way of my participation... :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ ;D ;D ;D ;D
I gave up on that one. Somewhere there's a disconnect...
In. deed. :D
OK, i think we need to be careful when reading this book. The problem i have found ouyt, mainly from personal experience, is that people don't read these types of books without an objective mind-set. You need to take what the author is saying and test it and research his claims, rather than just swallowing it hook, line, and sinker.
On another note, I just want to briefly point out how important it is to rightly divide and properly digest what we read - in this book and any other. It's bound to challenge our ideologies and perspectives, but it's not a Bible - it's the opinion (albeit a learned opinion) of two human beings. Digestion involves absorbing nutrients and vitamins to put them to good use, and excreting waste and toxins to rid the body of junk.
OK, i think we need to be careful when reading this book. The problem i have found ouyt, mainly from personal experience, is that people don't read these types of books without an objective mind-set. You need to take what the author is saying and test it and research his claims, rather than just swallowing it hook, line, and sinker.
And this is why many believe that the end of the day it doesn't matter how you do it as long as you do it somehow (pragmatism). :-\
But yeah, this book is going to SERIOUSLY challenge some traditional ideologies about certain things from the pulpit to dressing up in church, etc. It's going to have to be a book in which you can look at their stuff and be very empirical about it!
OK, i think we need to be careful when reading this book. The problem i have found ouyt, mainly from personal experience, is that people don't read these types of bookswithoutWITH an objective mind-set. You need to take what the author is saying and test it and research his claims, rather than just swallowing it hook, line, and sinker.
I think I have this book. I'm in!!! :)
Get ready to mark down this date in the LGM annuals as I'm about to give him a compliment:
I'm impressed with Churchy. He's standing his ground this time which is unusual for him (at least, when I read some of his posts).
Now, he's wronger than two left shoes (or, my using the word 'wronger') but at least he's standing firm in his assertion.
Wow!! Welcome back, TipTip! It's really SO good to see you! I just mentioned the other day that I missed you (it wassome old thread where you were cutting up as usual... lol)
Wow!! Welcome back, TipTip! It's really SO good to see you! I just mentioned the other day that I missed you (it wassome old thread where you were cutting up as usual... lol)Amen Rue.....AMEN!! We miss you when you're not around Tip....fa'real!
Amen Rue.....AMEN!! We miss you when you're not around Tip....fa'real!
Shoooooo, I miss LGM, when I'm not around! :DIndeed!! :D :D :D :D :D
And that Nessa is why I hope you are able to find time to read just one chapter and discuss it with us. but I understand if you can't ... btw did you take that picture?!?! *heads off to the CS thread*I will try to participate bro, I think it will be a very interesting discussion. As for the pic... er... uh... :D I'm sorry, ph... :( I will get it done, though.
Nessa, no pressure sis. I'm willing to bet that even if you don't have time to read the book, you'll probably still not be able to keep your mouth shut and avoid chiming in here or there. Of course, I'd love it if you could read the book with us, but I do understand.LOL! Thanks, I appreciate that.
LOL! Thanks, I appreciate that.
I will try to participate bro, I think it will be a very interesting discussion. As for the pic... er... uh... :D I'm sorry, ph... :( I will get it done, though.
Well at the end of the day more people prefer 3 of 5 adults prefer Pepsi over the leading brand...
:D
WOOT! my public library has this book ... however there is a 16 day wait ... so I will be a day or two behind you guys.
Okay, now that I have a calendar and the Table of Contents in front of me, here is my proposal. I like the idea of having discussion on Thursdays (only because people seem to scatter on Fridays). Does that work for everyone?
May 16 - May 18: Acknowledgments, Preface, Introduction, and
Chapter 1 - "Have We Really Been Doing it By the Book?" (pgs 1-8)
May 19 - Discussion
May 19 - May 25:
Chapter 2 - "The Church Building" (pgs 9-46)
May 26 - Discussion
May 26 - June 1:
Chapter 3 - "The Order of Worship" (pgs 47-84)
June 2 - Discussion
June 2 - June 8:
Chapter 4 - "The Sermon" (pgs. 85-104)
Chapter 5 - "The Pastor" (pgs. 105-144)
June 9 - Discussion
June 9 - June 15:
Chapter 6 - "Sunday Morning Costumes" (pgs. 145-156)
Chapter 7 - "Ministers of Music" (pgs. 157-170)
Chapter 8 - "Tithing and Clergy Salaries (pgs. 171-186)
Chapter 9 - "Baptism and the Lord's Supper" (pgs. 187-198)
June 16 - Discussion
June 16 - June 22:
Chapter 10 - "Christian Education" (pgs. 199-220)
Chapter 11 - "Reapproaching the New Testament" (pgs. 221-242)
June 23 - Discussion
June 23 - June 29:
Chapter 12 - "A Second Glance at the Savior" (pgs. 243-252)
**OPTIONAL**
Afterword
Final Thoughts
Summary
Key Figures in Church History (pgs. 253-280)
June 30 - Discussion
Mine should be arriving today (actually, it should have arrived on Friday, but that's another story ::)). Anyway, I'm looking forward to digging in.I've started. I've read the preface and intro so far.
First discussion next week! WoooHOOO!!!
Anybody already get started?
I read an excerpt on my Kindle. Just bought the book--should arrive on Thursday.
I think I'm going to get on this, it sounds interesting enough. Hopefully a local store has it cause I won't be able to buy it til thursday or friday, but I'll be on board for the wild ride LOL
I've started. I've read the preface and intro so far.
Just curious (because I'm still kinda intrigued by Kindlers), why'd you buy the book if you have a Kindle?
Intriguing? I don't want to try to skip ahead to discussions or anything, but I'm curious to know what you think thus far.No, nothing too intriguing, in my opinion. In fact, it's pretty much what you would expect from a preface and an intro- a lot of talk that points to the meat of the book without giving any of the meat.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh ok... gotcha.
I think LL reads on his Kindle app (unless he got a Kindle in addition to his app). I couldn't see myself doing it, either.
OAN, you are really making me want to get a new phone. But I won't jack the thread... lol.
No, nothing too intriguing, in my opinion. In fact, it's pretty much what you would expect from a preface and an intro- a lot of talk that points to the meat of the book without giving any of the meat.Yeah, I hate that. But still, I can't go forward without reading them, lol!
Okay, just skimmed the last 6 pages or so (please correct me if I'm wrong)
List of people and if they have the check mark then they have the book also
Name Do they have the book Ms. Monroe (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) Mr. Empowered (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) Mr. Brown (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) Mr. Fenix Mr. Grace Mr. Luvr (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) Mr. Jonathon Mrs. Vonne Ms. Tip (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg)
LOL @ Brownie's Brain.
| Name | Do they have the book |
| Ms. Monroe | (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) |
| Mr. Empowered | (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) |
| Mr. Brown | (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) |
| Mr. Fenix | |
| Mr. Grace | |
| Mr. Luvr | (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) |
| Mr. Jonathon | |
| Mrs. Vonne | |
| Ms. Tip | (http://developer.apple.com/library/ios/documentation/userexperience/conceptual/TableView_iPhone/Art/check_mark.jpg) |
I'm now on chapter one.
I'm fired up and ready!!!I can't quite share your level of enthusiasm, but I am interested in seeing what the upcoming discussions will be like.
I hadn't planned to, but I'm going to start reading tonight or tomorrow. I know I'm going to need more time than everyone else.
I can't quite share your level of enthusiasm, but I am interested in seeing what the upcoming discussions will be like.
well if you and LL are already getting started I might as well start...
We will still keep the same schedule for discussing the various chapters though right?
well if you and LL are already getting started I might as well start...
We will still keep the same schedule for discussing the various chapters though right?
I already have some questions I want to raise, but I think I'll wait until the actual discussion date and kind of weigh if I want to even ask them, because they may start some trouble....LOL!
Btw, I'm in the middle of the "introduction." I'm going to try to wait to get to chapter 1 the official day we start.
[/quote
The first part of chapter 1 is a lot like the introduction to me. If it doesn't pick up the pace soon, I'm not going to be a happy camper.
Welp... skimming through the book, I just found out where Churchy got his idea that communion should be a full meal. :D:D
Umm I just wanna say somebody must've been praying for me bc this font isn't bothering me at all.
I'm on the Preface and I'm liking it so far. Even the footnotes are captivating my attention. Nothing I didn't know already, it's just good to see in writing all the thoughts I could never put into words.
I'll hold my peace til discussion time.
Sorry PH haven't got the book yet. It may be possible today but if not I know By friday I'll have it. Don't leave me out though I may be the last one through the gate but I'm hoppin on this train LOL (corny humor chuckle)
FTR, I enjoyed the preface and intro... it was a great appetizer. But by the time I got to 1, I was ready for some good eatin.... looking forward to Ch2.
The first part of chapter 1 is a lot like the introduction to me. If it doesn't pick up the pace soon, I'm not going to be a happy camper.
Touch your neighbor and say "BRING OUT THE MEAT!!"
([url]http://blacktvmag.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/chris-rock.jpg[/url])
"Bring out the meat!"
Touch your neighbor and say "BRING OUT THE MEAT!!"
No.
No.
ROFL!!!!!
I just refuse to participate in any church calisthenics that aren't in the Bible. *kanyeshrug*
Turn to your neighbor and...
Turn to your neighbor, give 'em a high five and...
Tap your neighbor and...
?/?
Tell ya what, passa, preach da Word and SADDOWN!! :-\
I think I must've missed this comment. But yeah, I agree. It's a bit redundant. :-\Yeah, it's a very easy read. I have been stopping to take notes on things I want to comment on when we start our discussions. Otherwise, I'd be flying through this. BTW, I'm on chapter 2 as well. Haven't read in a couple of days. My new phone doesn't have Kindle App compatablilty yet, so I haven't been passing my time on the train reading.
BUT... on a lighter note, I'm really very grateful that it's not a difficult read (for me). I'm breezing right on through.
Okay, now that I have a calendar and the Table of Contents in front of me, here is my proposal. I like the idea of having discussion on Thursdays (only because people seem to scatter on Fridays). Does that work for everyone?
May 16 - May 18: Acknowledgments, Preface, Introduction, and
Chapter 1 - "Have We Really Been Doing it By the Book?" (pgs 1-8)
May 19 - Discussion
May 19 - May 25:
Chapter 2 - "The Church Building" (pgs 9-46)
May 26 - Discussion
May 26 - June 1:
Chapter 3 - "The Order of Worship" (pgs 47-84)
June 2 - Discussion
June 2 - June 8:
Chapter 4 - "The Sermon" (pgs. 85-104)
Chapter 5 - "The Pastor" (pgs. 105-144)
June 9 - Discussion
June 9 - June 15:
Chapter 6 - "Sunday Morning Costumes" (pgs. 145-156)
Chapter 7 - "Ministers of Music" (pgs. 157-170)
Chapter 8 - "Tithing and Clergy Salaries (pgs. 171-186)
Chapter 9 - "Baptism and the Lord's Supper" (pgs. 187-198)
June 16 - Discussion
June 16 - June 22:
Chapter 10 - "Christian Education" (pgs. 199-220)
Chapter 11 - "Reapproaching the New Testament" (pgs. 221-242)
June 23 - Discussion
June 23 - June 29:
Chapter 12 - "A Second Glance at the Savior" (pgs. 243-252)
**OPTIONAL**
Afterword
Final Thoughts
Summary
Key Figures in Church History (pgs. 253-280)
June 30 - Discussion
The Book club has moved to its own board. :)
accidentally read through chapter 4 ....
i'm not certain if the author is contradicting himself or what but ... I guess I should wait for the actual conversations
accidentally read through chapter 4 ....
i'm not certain if the author is contridicting himself or what but ... I guess I should wait for the actual conversations
I was gonna start a new thread over here... looks a little dull lol.
Anyways, umm.....are ya finished with that book yet? And what are yal reading next? Did anyone decide yet? Should we make a vote?
Wrong thread....LOL! But yeah you're right!