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Gospel Instruments => Gospel Drummers => Topic started by: TightestGroove on March 08, 2006, 01:23:30 PM
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WHICH DRUMMERS DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST UNDER-RATED? MY TOP IS
1. REX HARDY- MARY J. BLIDGE
2. BIG MIKE - NEW BREED
3. BRIAN FRAZIER-MOORE - CHRISTINA AGUILERA
4. GORDEN CAMPBELL - JESSICA SIMPSON
5. TEDDY CAMPBELL - BRITANY SPEARS
:o TIGHTEST GROOVE :o
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Is rex hardy the guy tht was on the mary j live from LA? If so, that guy is wack and he's not underrated at all. Theres nothing special to him. (i'm not really sure, Im just tryin to get some good clips of him.... wink wink) I could have done that concert and got more oohhs an ahhhs.
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Excluding No 1 & 2...
I can see why 3-5 are underrated... it certainly doesn't look like its their own fault why their underrated! Lol!
Regardless, I don't know who these guys are but I plan on googling them. Thanks for the info, got some learning to do!
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Excluding No 1 & 2...
I can see why 3-5 are underrated... it certainly doesn't look like its their own fault why their underrated! Lol!
Regardless, I don't know who these guys are but I plan on googling them. Thanks for the info, got some learning to do!
LOL... you are suggesting their singers right??? hahaha...thats too funny!
:D :D :D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
God Bless.
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Excluding No 1 & 2...
I can see why 3-5 are underrated... it certainly doesn't look like its their own fault why their underrated! Lol!
Regardless, I don't know who these guys are but I plan on googling them. Thanks for the info, got some learning to do!
LOL... you are suggesting their singers right??? hahaha...thats too funny!
:D :D :D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
God Bless.
Yup. LOL! ;D
It was quite funny cause those were they first names I looked at... ::) ;D
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me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Is rex hardy the guy tht was on the mary j live from LA? If so, that guy is wack and he's not underrated at all. Theres nothing special to him. (i'm not really sure, Im just tryin to get some good clips of him.... wink wink) I could have done that concert and got more oohhs an ahhhs.
i think he was on blueprint wit her...i think he was crushing it...he desevers to b on this list i think
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me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am right behind you on that one!!! I also fit that category! haha
God Bless.
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WHICH DRUMMERS DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST UNDER-RATED? MY TOP IS
1. REX HARDY- MARY J. BLIDGE
2. BIG MIKE - NEW BREED
3. BRIAN FRAZIER-MOORE - CHRISTINA AGUILERA
4. GORDEN CAMPBELL - JESSICA SIMPSON
5. TEDDY CAMPBELL - BRITANY SPEARS
:o TIGHTEST GROOVE :o
Brian, Gorden and Teddy are not under-rated they are mature. They hold/have held dow gigs with major artists and musicians. THe fact is that too many folk here are caught up in the whooo weee factor. Being a working musician is not about that. All the guys you named are working. None of the guys you named have ventured into promoting themselves as an individual drumset artist or clinician.
These guys aren't under-rated really... they have respect in the circiut of hiring and firing, LOL. That's where we all need to be. Folks in general need to re-assess what being a good/great drumset musician is. It's not the flash in the "working/pro circuit" it is in call backs for recording and touring opportunities, it is the major tv performances, it is the imprompt to band calls.
If we talk under-rated lets talk about Nate Morton, house band drummer on CBS' - Rock Start INXS. He is a Berkley grad attending the same time as Abe Laborial Jr. or Forrest Robinson who plays with India.Arie . and any number of other guys whom just haven't gotten that spotlight gig yet but have been consistently holding down big gigs.
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WHICH DRUMMERS DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST UNDER-RATED? MY TOP IS
1. REX HARDY- MARY J. BLIDGE
2. BIG MIKE - NEW BREED
3. BRIAN FRAZIER-MOORE - CHRISTINA AGUILERA
4. GORDEN CAMPBELL - JESSICA SIMPSON
5. TEDDY CAMPBELL - BRITANY SPEARS
:o TIGHTEST GROOVE :o
Brian, Gorden and Teddy are not under-rated they are mature. They hold/have held dow gigs with major artists and musicians. THe fact is that too many folk here are caught up in the whooo weee factor. Being a working musician is not about that. All the guys you named are working. None of the guys you named have ventured into promoting themselves as an individual drumset artist or clinician.
These guys aren't under-rated really... they have respect in the circiut of hiring and firing, LOL. That's where we all need to be. Folks in general need to re-assess what being a good/great drumset musician is. It's not the flash in the "working/pro circuit" it is in call backs for recording and touring opportunities, it is the major tv performances, it is the imprompt to band calls.
If we talk under-rated lets talk about Nate Morton, house band drummer on CBS' - Rock Start INXS. He is a Berkley grad attending the same time as Abe Laborial Jr. or Forrest Robinson who plays with India.Arie . and any number of other guys whom just haven't gotten that spotlight gig yet but have been consistently holding down big gigs.
thanx alot sabe, they need to hear this! while these young cats is sheddin and killen in the basement, my man brizz is getting rich! that dude is never home!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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WHICH DRUMMERS DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST UNDER-RATED? MY TOP IS
1. REX HARDY- MARY J. BLIDGE
2. BIG MIKE - NEW BREED
3. BRIAN FRAZIER-MOORE - CHRISTINA AGUILERA
4. GORDEN CAMPBELL - JESSICA SIMPSON
5. TEDDY CAMPBELL - BRITANY SPEARS
:o TIGHTEST GROOVE :o
Brian, Gorden and Teddy are not under-rated they are mature. They hold/have held dow gigs with major artists and musicians. THe fact is that too many folk here are caught up in the whooo weee factor. Being a working musician is not about that. All the guys you named are working. None of the guys you named have ventured into promoting themselves as an individual drumset artist or clinician.
These guys aren't under-rated really... they have respect in the circiut of hiring and firing, LOL. That's where we all need to be. Folks in general need to re-assess what being a good/great drumset musician is. It's not the flash in the "working/pro circuit" it is in call backs for recording and touring opportunities, it is the major tv performances, it is the imprompt to band calls.
If we talk under-rated lets talk about Nate Morton, house band drummer on CBS' - Rock Start INXS. He is a Berkley grad attending the same time as Abe Laborial Jr. or Forrest Robinson who plays with India.Arie . and any number of other guys whom just haven't gotten that spotlight gig yet but have been consistently holding down big gigs.
thanx alot sabe, they need to hear this! while these young cats is sheddin and killen in the basement, my man brizz is getting rich! that dude is never home!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thats right, thats right! I couldnt give opinion on whether theyre underrated or not becuase of what Sabe is just hammered out.
... although it wasn't hard to rate the artists they were associated with... ;D
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I know one thing I need to read the entire board before I post my posts... Another underated drummer is Darryl Robinson (Lil Darryl). The few names that I am going to include is Terry Baker, Jeff Lo Davis, Chris Johnson, Joel Smith, and Asaph Ward Jr. I have a few more that I will mention later. Stay Blessed, Nate J.
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Is rex hardy the guy tht was on the mary j live from LA? If so, that guy is wack and he's not underrated at all. Theres nothing special to him. (i'm not really sure, Im just tryin to get some good clips of him.... wink wink) I could have done that concert and got more oohhs an ahhhs.
I agree, I dont think hes all that and following Gerald made his playing even more whack!
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Quote from: TightestGroove on March 08, 2006, 01:23:30 PM
WHICH DRUMMERS DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST UNDER-RATED? MY TOP IS
1. REX HARDY- MARY J. BLIDGE
2. BIG MIKE - NEW BREED
3. BRIAN FRAZIER-MOORE - CHRISTINA AGUILERA
4. GORDEN CAMPBELL - JESSICA SIMPSON
5. TEDDY CAMPBELL - BRITANY SPEARS
TIGHTEST GROOVE
Brian, Gorden and Teddy are not under-rated they are mature. They hold/have held dow gigs with major artists and musicians. THe fact is that too many folk here are caught up in the whooo weee factor. Being a working musician is not about that. All the guys you named are working. None of the guys you named have ventured into promoting themselves as an individual drumset artist or clinician.
These guys aren't under-rated really... they have respect in the circiut of hiring and firing, LOL. That's where we all need to be. Folks in general need to re-assess what being a good/great drumset musician is. It's not the flash in the "working/pro circuit" it is in call backs for recording and touring opportunities, it is the major tv performances, it is the imprompt to band calls.
If we talk under-rated lets talk about Nate Morton, house band drummer on CBS' - Rock Start INXS. He is a Berkley grad attending the same time as Abe Laborial Jr. or Forrest Robinson who plays with India.Arie . and any number of other guys whom just haven't gotten that spotlight gig yet but have been consistently holding down big gigs.
I agree with SABE. THem cats are being "richly" blessed. It is all about reading music and working. These cats on this list are touring and studio pros. To me Teddy shouldn't even be on there. If you watch American Idol. That guy can play any kind of music and still throw a crazy lick in there every now and again.
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wutz up drum family I just wanted to say that I respect all of your opinions imnot here to crush on what nobody think about those drummers that were mentioned but me an one of my friends were talkin about this kind of stuff and its like why cant we just respect a person for the way they play,someone said that rexell was wack and its like why must we be like that towards each other I mean we are all in this together and im not trying to hate on nobodys opinion but its like we all have a different style of playing so why cant we just respect a person for the way they play cause yeah you was right rexell is not gerald but that dont mean he sorry I know its a drummer that all ya'll on here look up to that might be more experienced than you or that can do more stuff than you but that dont make you a sorry drummer cause im sure its a lot of ya'll on here that is straight BLAZING!!!!!!!! on drums. But I just wanted to share that, yall stay up and keep on doin what you do, PEACE!!!!!!!!!!
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Quote from: TightestGroove on March 08, 2006, 01:23:30 PM
WHICH DRUMMERS DO YOU THINK IS THE MOST UNDER-RATED? MY TOP IS
1. REX HARDY- MARY J. BLIDGE
2. BIG MIKE - NEW BREED
3. BRIAN FRAZIER-MOORE - CHRISTINA AGUILERA
4. GORDEN CAMPBELL - JESSICA SIMPSON
5. TEDDY CAMPBELL - BRITANY SPEARS
TIGHTEST GROOVE
Brian, Gorden and Teddy are not under-rated they are mature. They hold/have held dow gigs with major artists and musicians. THe fact is that too many folk here are caught up in the whooo weee factor. Being a working musician is not about that. All the guys you named are working. None of the guys you named have ventured into promoting themselves as an individual drumset artist or clinician.
These guys aren't under-rated really... they have respect in the circiut of hiring and firing, LOL. That's where we all need to be. Folks in general need to re-assess what being a good/great drumset musician is. It's not the flash in the "working/pro circuit" it is in call backs for recording and touring opportunities, it is the major tv performances, it is the imprompt to band calls.
If we talk under-rated lets talk about Nate Morton, house band drummer on CBS' - Rock Start INXS. He is a Berkley grad attending the same time as Abe Laborial Jr. or Forrest Robinson who plays with India.Arie . and any number of other guys whom just haven't gotten that spotlight gig yet but have been consistently holding down big gigs.
I agree with SABE. THem cats are being "richly" blessed. It is all about reading music and working. These cats on this list are touring and studio pros. To me Teddy shouldn't even be on there. If you watch American Idol. That guy can play any kind of music and still throw a crazy lick in there every now and again.
Wow!!! LOL Wow!!! You guys are crazy
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There are a few drummers that i remember that are underated you guys may have heard of them.
1.Kevin Brunson(Milton Brunson & Thompson CS)
2.Keith Phelps (Indiana Mass Choir)
3.Larry Tucker (Oscar Hayes & Abunadant Life C.)
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wow some of u guys say that rex is wack, but he is still working. so i guess the person who writes the checks likes his playing and thats all that really matters. cuz that dude can play. true he didnt do anything amazing on that gig, but he played the gig right. he wasnt tryin to get ohhh and ahhhs, but he did some nice stuff on there tho. dont sleep on people who work! i personally dont care for ricky lawson, but i respect him cuz this man got to tour with micheal jackson and has held down many big gigs. u cant sleep on him and say he is wack. hes working!!!!
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i gotta add lil bean and bigblackdrummer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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wow some of u guys say that rex is wack, but he is still working. so i guess the person who writes the checks likes his playing and thats all that really matters. cuz that dude can play. true he didnt do anything amazing on that gig, but he played the gig right. he wasnt tryin to get ohhh and ahhhs, but he did some nice stuff on there tho. dont sleep on people who work! i personally dont care for ricky lawson, but i respect him cuz this man got to tour with micheal jackson and has held down many big gigs. u cant sleep on him and say he is wack. hes working!!!!
I can respect anyone whose gettin' big gigs. However, this IS the entertainment industry. I don't think their is anything wrong with the oooh's and aaaaah's, as long as they you know the time & place. Ricky Lawson did play for Michael ... but, he put me to sleep. I didn't dig his playing at all. I guess he doesn't care - but I do. I really don't like it when people make it seem like the only thing that matters is working. Who really wants to be a musician simply works?
Maybe some people can be content with that. However, I'm a showman at heart. While I know I'm not front & center .. I know I can bring something exciting to the music, without trying to take over the show.
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Great post SabianKnight....could not have said it better!! But no one in that list of first 5 are underated.
My underated list includes:
1. Chris Johnson - Dorinda Clark-Cole, Stevie Wonder, Anastasia, Gospel Wonders
2. Terreon Gulley - Christain McBride
3. Quinjan Anderson - Yolanda Adams, New Direction
4. Nate Smith - Better Carter
5. Yonrico Scott - Derek Trucks Band, After 7, Freddie Hubbard
6. Jamie Gamble - Brandy, Tony Braxton
When I say underated, only in the Gospel communitty as all of these cats work regularly!
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BRAIN COLLIER, JOEL SMITH , ARRON GREEN , LIL JOHN SEAN RICKMAN TYRON HINDRICKS OSCAR SEADEN BRAIN DUNN ERIC BROWN
SOME OF
THE YOUNG GUYS NEED TO HOOK UP WITH GUYS LIKE THE ABOVE FOR CONCEPT LESSONS GOD BLESS
TOMMY B
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Yo I agree with most of the stuff yall sayin because everyone is entitled to their own opinion. BUT, yall said that Teddy Campbell is underratted. Come on, First of all he is a beast. He has one of the tightest pockets out, he plays on National T.V. every week and he is versatile. He should be considered a top drummer.
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I have been away for awhile and tried to skim as many posts as possible and this post caught my eye. As usual, SK dropped the knowledge before me and stole my thunder. But let me add my 2.5 cents.
I was curious what was meant by "underrated". ??? ??? Underrated is defined as rating too low. With this definition in mind, some of the names on the initial list should never have been mentioned. Brizz, Teddy Campbell and Gordon Campbell, Jeff-Lo, Joel Smith, Oscar Seaton, Lil' John, OMG... :o these cats are established veterans in the industry. If you don't know about them shame on you. Their collective works speaks volumes about each of them. Underrated, by who's opinion. Any drummer worth their salt knows that these cats are "beasts" which I must mention is a term used too often on this board. Every new cat I hear about is a "beast" I'm going to start a thread called "the beasts of Ephesus" (but I digress).
Just b/c no one has started an internet campaign for a drummer does not mean that he is underrated. Most importantly, we can not forget that depending on the artist or the MD a drummer maybe be directed to play in a certain fashion. That's does not make them underrated, only obedient to direction so they can continue to get the call. What matters most, some dude with a keyboard hyping me on some website saying how hot I am on the set or being employed even if all I am asked to do is read the music and keep a 2/4 beat. ??? ???
Plus, some drummers are given the liberty and the autonomy to do things that others are not. I will change the names in my scenario to protect the innocent. There was a major artist getting ready for a national tour and they hired an "established" drummer with an "established" style to work the tour. Next time this artist when out to tour, the "established" drummer had a scheduling conflict and was unable to go on this particular tour. The MD called a relatively newbie (to touring at least) to handle this major gig. The new drummer proceeded to handle his business in the mold of the "established" drummer but was told by the same MD to tone down his schtick. When he questioned the MD after the set for clarification the MD told him that he had wanted to tell the "established" drummer to calm down but he was mindful of his reputation and did not want to cause a conflict so he allowed him to do what he does best (which did not really take away from the gig--note: some MDs just like to be dictatorial). Point being, I may have chops like Dennis Chambers and be asked to replace him but that does not mean that I will be allowed the same liberty that Dennis would have been afforded by the MD. Without this background I would be referred to as "wack" and "booty on the set" by some guy behind the keyboard all the while I'm just following the lead of the MD. So I guess I'll live with the moniker of underrated in my $850,000 home and I wave to all of you while I'm on TV.
I understood the question that was raised, but what is truly underrated?? If I got the gig I must be doing something right?
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UNDERATED IS WHEN THEY
WONT GIVE YOU A MODERN DRUMMER WRITE UP BUT YOUR IN THE MAG 5 TIMES ANYWAY
WE ALL KNOW
ITS FUNNY NOW BECUASE IT TOOK FOR US TO DO OUR OWN DVD
TO GRACE THE PAGES OF MODERN DRUMMER MAG
BUT THEYVE KNOWN US FOR YEARS
IVE BEEN ENDORCED SINCE I WAS 9-10 SO Y AM I NOT IN THERE.....
IVE SEEN WECKL AND TERRY BOZZIO LIKE 20 TIMES ON THE COVER OF THE MAG OFF CLINICS NOT MAJOR GIGS....WSUP WITH THAT..SHOULD I GO JOIN A FLY BY NIGHT ROCK BAND WILL THAT HELP./..LOL
THE WHOLE BLACK CULTURE IS UNDERATED....IF YOU ASK ME
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UNDERATED IS WHEN THEY
WONT GIVE YOU A MODERN DRUMMER WRITE UP BUT YOUR IN THE MAG 5 TIMES ANYWAY
WE ALL KNOW
ITS FUNNY NOW BECUASE IT TOOK FOR US TO DO OUR OWN DVD
TO GRACE THE PAGES OF MODERN DRUMMER MAG
BUT THEYVE KNOWN US FOR YEARS
IVE BEEN ENDORCED SINCE I WAS 9-10 SO Y AM I NOT IN THERE.....
IVE SEEN WECKL AND TERRY BOZZIO LIKE 20 TIMES ON THE COVER OF THE MAG OFF CLINICS NOT MAJOR GIGS....WSUP WITH THAT..SHOULD I GO JOIN A FLY BY NIGHT ROCK BAND WILL THAT HELP./..LOL
THE WHOLE BLACK CULTURE IS UNDERATED....IF YOU ASK ME
Yeah pretty much. It's like kats have to play with a major pop artist to get recognized. Folks are doing they're thing all over. On the real, I would love to see MD do an edition on the women drummers.
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Yeah pretty much. It's like kats have to play with a major pop artist to get recognized. Folks are doing they're thing all over. On the real, I would love to see MD do an edition on the women drummers.
UMMM...POP ARTIST DRUMMERS? I have seen a few...but definitely far from the Majority.
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Gospel drummers are underated no matter how big the gig. I wonder why????
Its the dern devil!!!!!
I was shocked to see Will Denton in Modern Drummer
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UMMM...POP ARTIST DRUMMERS? I have seen a few...but definitely far from the Majority.
I was trying to find the modify button,,but it done went missing..LOL
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As far as covereage etc goes... minority drummers bring in minority money. Though minorities spend more than they save it is ususally on frivilous big ticket items instead of investment items like top of the line cymbal, drum kits etc. We minority musicians have to relationship wise. We have to market ourselves. We have to let people in the know that we are (1) interested (2) capable of working in the crossover market. We have to be on top of our sight reading and be knowledgable of genre standard songs and whose who in the top 100 Billboards list etc. We have to set ourselves up to be universal rather than culturall ybound. We have to be seen on the "other side of the tracks" on the regular.
It comes down to marketing and the longevity of the marketing dollar. A marketing campaign is not cheap and it needs to runa bare minimum of 6 months to a year to be finacially viable. If numbers don't rise in a fiscal quarter it was a bust. What does this mean for us the aspiring?
It means that we need to handle our business as business. Learn the necessary knowledge to play the game and win starting with the rules of engagement. First thing being respect the system whether you like it or not. Second thing don't talk to flunkies when you need the word of a king. Invest in yourself: press pack that is updated on a quarterly to six-month basis, busines cards, professional head shots, press releases written by a publicist (not your cousin pookie or your boo ... unless they work for an ad agency with credentials), professional web site (dot.com not just a myspace), Never show up empty handed (always talk business willing and able to buy, show stats on your personal; fan base/record sales to date, awards), pick your gigs better than you pix your girls (meaning pix things that lift you up not milk you dry).
A man is judged by the company he keeps and so is an endorser or magazines bottom line. If we cannot make a company look better and bring in more money why do they need us. That's real talk from the business world. If you don't make dollars you don't make sense. That means that we have to increase our personal value.
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I MEAN THEY DONT GET THE MEDIA ATTENTION LIKE WECKL VINNIE ETC. THERES ONE BLACK ON THE COVER FOR EVERY 50 ................. OTHER RACES
JUST REAL TALK NO GOSPEL DRUMMERS ....... IT'S ONE SIDED
TB
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THERES ONE BLACK ON THE COVER FOR EVERY 50 ................. OTHER RACES
A story I once got told...
While sitting down with my aunt who was reading to me a bible story I asked her "Aunty, if Jesus was born in Bethlehem, why is he white in the picture?".
My aunty looked at me and said... "Boy, you have to understand... they didn't have enough coloured or black ink in the printer." ::) ;D
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Stokley
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mine are
like the post above mine says - Stokley
Chris Coleman
Rodney Holmes
Nat Townsley
Kieth Carlock
Teddy Campbell
i think next we should maybe talk about those that are overatted.
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i think next we should maybe talk about those that are overatted.
We have already talked about that.
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To me Kevin Kelly is the most underated drummer. But around herre in tha lou we got mad respect for tha dude. Wednesday i got lessons wit dude and let me tell u tha dude is sick. he does just as much work j. haynes and calvin rodgers man im tellin u. maybe its jus me because i love stl drummers (not that i aint got love for all drummers). jus my opinion
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I MEAN THEY DONT GET THE MEDIA ATTENTION LIKE WECKL VINNIE ETC. THERES ONE BLACK ON THE COVER FOR EVERY 50 ................. OTHER RACES
JUST REAL TALK NO GOSPEL DRUMMERS ....... IT'S ONE SIDED
TB
Ummm...I have seen Dennis Chambers right there. He is black right? John Blackwell is black right? Rodney Holmes, I think he is black too. Carter Beauford? Billy Cobham? Bernard Purdie?
Please, dont use the excuse because I am black or white or yellow or orange I didnt get what I wanted. Thats just a crock of bologna. get real. quick trying to find excuses.
God Bless.
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I think Gerald Heyward had a cover a while back, too (or at least a rather long article).
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I think Gerald Heyward had a cover a while back, too (or at least a rather long article).
and Teddy Campbell
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Ummm...I have seen Dennis Chambers right there. He is black right? John Blackwell is black right? Rodney Holmes, I think he is black too. Carter Beauford? Billy Cobham? Bernard Purdie?
Please, dont use the excuse because I am black or white or yellow or orange I didnt get what I wanted. Thats just a crock of bologna. get real. quick trying to find excuses.
God Bless.
It is not a crock racial inequality still does heavily affect the African American community representation. And we should not ever stop fighting for just due respect and opportunity. But the game is what it is and we have to respect the game as it is and learn hoow to win at it.
Sometimes we Americans complain about being tired of hearing about racial inequality complaints but the fact is that until everybody admits to the problem and takes a stand on the problem one side or the other then the problem will continue to be a thorn in our side. Until then though we have to man up get game tight and lay waste to our own short comings. We have to realize that everybody cannot go to the top because frankly they are not prepared to be there. We have to grow our circl of influence so that we enable those around us to be able to go. Then we can weed out those that are not willing to go. A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link and more times than not it starts with the man in the mirror.
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Ah yes, I forgot about that one...
Anyway, I really don't think the race issue applies to this one. The reason why the same people tend to make the cover over and over is because their pretty much household names in the drumming arena. Think about it: why do you think Lebron James is always on the cover of basketball magazines? Their are other good basketball players out, but they have to get the 11 year olds to buy the magazine somehow. If they are going to get a lage reading base, they have to put people on the cover that people have actually heard of. Go into Guitar Center and ask a random person who Eddie Heyward, Jeff Davis, or Calvin Rogers is. I bet you they can't answer. (Apparently for a gospel drummer to get into MD, they have to convert to R&B, but I'm not going to go there right now. How's that for a topic...)
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It is not a crock racial inequality still does heavily affect the African American community representation. And we should not ever stop fighting for just due respect and opportunity. But the game is what it is and we have to respect the game as it is and learn hoow to win at it.
Sometimes we Americans complain about being tired of hearing about racial inequality complaints but the fact is that until everybody admits to the problem and takes a stand on the problem one side or the other then the problem will continue to be a thorn in our side. Until then though we have to man up get game tight and lay waste to our own short comings. We have to realize that everybody cannot go to the top because frankly they are not prepared to be there. We have to grow our circl of influence so that we enable those around us to be able to go. Then we can weed out those that are not willing to go. A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link and more times than not it starts with the man in the mirror.
I am half white and half hispanic, but look all white. and because of where I live, the majority being hispanic. I have not seen first hand the priviledges that are always being insinuated for the white community. Maybe that is indeed true in somewhere else. but now where I live. for example: At our University, there are scholarships available for: African American Males & Females, for Hisapnic Males & Females, for Hawaiin, Indian, and everything else. But not one for a white or caucasian. There are plenty of ethnic clubs, every one under the sun, but if we were to put a white or caucasian club, we would be considered racist.
we speak alot on here about crutches, I feel that claiming racism is a crutch. Just look at sports alone. Who excels? who are the best?
I am far from racist, never will be close to being one. but I do get mad when so called minorities try to point out Benefits that I definitely do not see or have the priviledge of receiving. I have never received a nod over anyone else because of my color. I actually have been rejected because I didnt know spanish fluently. So that is what I think.
God BLess.
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It is not a crock racial inequality still does heavily affect the African American community representation. And we should not ever stop fighting for just due respect and opportunity. But the game is what it is and we have to respect the game as it is and learn hoow to win at it.
Sometimes we Americans complain about being tired of hearing about racial inequality complaints but the fact is that until everybody admits to the problem and takes a stand on the problem one side or the other then the problem will continue to be a thorn in our side. Until then though we have to man up get game tight and lay waste to our own short comings. We have to realize that everybody cannot go to the top because frankly they are not prepared to be there. We have to grow our circl of influence so that we enable those around us to be able to go. Then we can weed out those that are not willing to go. A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link and more times than not it starts with the man in the mirror.
****Holding the collection Plate*****
Well said Sabe. It's not about blaming other folks for our short coming or lack of opportunities, in order to proceed to the next level, no matter what you're doing, We need to prepare. Now, let's be real, in America, there is still a problem with Racism. no if, and about it. But we as Christians can be an influence, but we have to get on the same page, and rid ourselves of the divisions with the Body of Christ...uh oh.. another can of worms...
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If racism goes in every direction, against Black White or Hispanic, then I would agree, but to say that one race is singled out is just not true. If someone believes that, come live where I live.
God Bless.
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I am half white and half hispanic, but look all white. and because of where I live, the majority being hispanic. I have not seen first hand the priviledges that are always being insinuated for the white community. Maybe that is indeed true in somewhere else. but now where I live. for example: At our University, there are scholarships available for: African American Males & Females, for Hisapnic Males & Females, for Hawaiin, Indian, and everything else. But not one for a white or caucasian. There are plenty of ethnic clubs, every one under the sun, but if we were to put a white or caucasian club, we would be considered racist.
we speak alot on here about crutches, I feel that claiming racism is a crutch. Just look at sports alone. Who excels? who are the best?
I am far from racist, never will be close to being one. but I do get mad when so called minorities try to point out Benefits that I definitely do not see or have the priviledge of receiving. I have never received a nod over anyone else because of my color. I actually have been rejected because I didnt know spanish fluently. So that is what I think.
God BLess.
I AM SORRY E-R I LOVE YOU DOG BUT YOUR (oops caps)
any way
i feel like your comments and your point of view are quite self centered and isolated. it is impossible for you to formulate an opionion on such a grand issue effectively by looking at it regionally and using only YOUR experiences and immediate/demographic outlook.
this is a problem that is alive EVERYDAY from coast to coast, we go through it, and we are not only formulating our views from personal experience, but from fact gotten from varied sources.
hope this made sense and was clear- in a rush
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I AM SORRY E-R I LOVE YOU DOG BUT YOUR (oops caps)
any way
i feel like your comments and your point of view are quite self centered and isolated. it is impossible for you to formulate an opionion on such a grand issue effectively by looking at it regionally and using only YOUR experiences and immediate/demographic outlook.
this is a problem that is alive EVERYDAY from coast to coast, we go through it, and we are not only formulating our views from personal experience, but from fact gotten from varied sources.
hope this made sense and was clear- in a rush
Well, isnt this an issue of anyones experience? How can someone talk about it unless it is experienced. My beef is this:
The statement that White Folk have their road paved for them. That they succeed because they are white. That is just flat out wrong.
maybe in the 50's but not anymore. I just dont buy it. I am not trying to call out any race. but now is definitely a time for the rights of the people...dont believe me? Gays have more rights than we do now. So if someone on this board really feels that they didnt get considered for a drumming gig because they were not white....Please let me know. PM me. I will help you get a lawyer and we will sue the living daylights out of whoever did that to you. Why not sue for discrimination. Its happening everywhere.
I have a very close friend who is African American. He is now an NBA player and is doing quite well. He didnt ever complain that he didnt get what was right because he was Black. NOT ONCE DID THAT COME OUT OF HIS MOUTH. and I dont think I have ever seen anyone work as hard as he did. He wanted something and he was going to get it, regardless of the obstacle. Hard work and dedication, while not taking no for an answer, will get you whatever you want. Quit finding excuses.
Will someone...explain the Sports world to me please.
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and please dont take me wrong...
I am not a racist.
far from it.
I love you guys like brothers I never had!
I just dont want to see you guys willingly not grow anymore because of racism. There is a whole lot of ways around it. Dont let an excuse get you down.
God can answer it all.
Whatever you ask for in my name you shall have it. Dont let the devil put an excuse or roadblock in your way.
but just so you know this:
As Jesus suffered, so must we also suffer so we can reign with him forever.
I apologize again if I came across in an incorrect manner. I was not trying to offend anyone at all.
God Bless You All.
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"The statement that White Folk have their road paved for them. That they succeed because they are white. That is just flat out wrong. "
E-R ...
I feel like this - because Whites are in control of most everything in this country/the world - and they make up the majority - it's not outside of the realm of sound logic to think that you'd be at an advantage, over a non-White.
See, I think it does come down to the fact that you can't really see it, 'cause you don't live it. Sure, Whites may face discrimination is certain areas ... however, those things were changed, so the playing feel could be leveled, somewhat. I mean, if it weren't for rule implemented, to make sure a certain number of minorities get to take advantage of opportunities, Whites would continue to have a COMPLETE advantage over people in other ethnic groups.
Why do you think those rules had to be implemented to begin with? I mean, you say you're being discriminated against, at times .. but you can seriously say that the minor discrimination you may face from time to time - is in any way comparable to the racism that Black & members of other ethnic groups have faced through-out the history of this countries existence.
I don't think it can be argued that Whites have an advantage in this world, over-all. Look at every field, without the exception of athletics - and tell me if you don't see more Whites and other ethnic groups. E-R, I'm not one who will use racism as a crutch. However, I know that it does exist ... and I can clearly see that, over-all, Whites have more of advantage in this world ... because their kind RUN it. Now, it's not gonna stop me from striving for what I want in life. It also doesn't mean that because if I don't achieve my goals, it had anything to do with race. However, in a country that has just recently gave Black & other ethnic groups "equal" rights in the past forty years ... it's not an insane leap of logic to assume, that racism could still be a factor. Not everyone wanted the laws to change, you know?
Also ..
Just because the LAWS change, doesn't mean the ATTITUDES have changed towards minorities. Racism can be blatant - and it can be very subtle. I do feel that - because many Whites don't see the tree hanging's & more extreme manifestations of racismtc .. they assume it's no longer the same. However, when you're Black ... you noticed the subtlties .. 'cause you're affected by them everyday. RACISM IS VERY REAL! ANYONE can be racist - however, it's just that racism is minorities CAN be more of a hinderance to success in certain fields
E-R, love ya, bro'. Just a difference of opinion, on a touchy subject.
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"The statement that White Folk have their road paved for them. That they succeed because they are white. That is just flat out wrong. "
E-R ...
I feel like this - because Whites are in control of most everything in this country/the world - and they make up the majority - it's not outside of the realm of sound logic to think that you'd be at an advantage, over a non-White.
See, I think it does come down to the fact that you can't really see it, 'cause you don't live it. Sure, Whites may face discrimination is certain areas ... however, those things were changed, so the playing feel could be leveled, somewhat. I mean, if it weren't for rule implemented, to make sure a certain number of minorities get to take advantage of opportunities, Whites would continue to have a COMPLETE advantage over people in other ethnic groups.
Why do you think those rules had to be implemented to begin with? I mean, you say you're being discriminated against, at times .. but you can seriously say that the minor discrimination you may face from time to time - is in any way comparable to the racism that Black & members of other ethnic groups have faced through-out the history of this countries existence.
I don't think it can be argued that Whites have an advantage in this world, over-all. Look at every field, without the exception of athletics - and tell me if you don't see more Whites and other ethnic groups. E-R, I'm not one who will use racism as a crutch. However, I know that it does exist ... and I can clearly see that, over-all, Whites have more of advantage in this world ... because their kind RUN it. Now, it's not gonna stop me from striving for what I want in life. It also doesn't mean that because if I don't achieve my goals, it had anything to do with race. However, in a country that has just recently gave Black & other ethnic groups "equal" rights in the past forty years ... it's not an insane leap of logic to assume, that racism could still be a factor. Not everyone wanted the laws to change, you know?
Also ..
Just because the LAWS change, doesn't mean the ATTITUDES have changed towards minorities. Racism can be blatant - and it can be very subtle. I do feel that - because many Whites don't see the tree hanging's & more extreme manifestations of racismtc .. they assume it's no longer the same. However, when you're Black ... you noticed the subtlties .. 'cause you're affected by them everyday. RACISM IS VERY REAL! ANYONE can be racist - however, it's just that racism is minorities CAN be more of a hinderance to success in certain fields
E-R, love ya, bro'. Just a difference of opinion, on a touchy subject.
ya, I understand where you are coming from and what happened in the past is brutal and unjust. I would never try to compare the two, nor should someone else try to compare what they are going through with what happened then. I just think that people that wanted to succeed did. George Washington Carver, he pushed through in a time where racism was huge. but He made something of himself even in those circumstances. I am a firm believer that regardless of race color or creed we will succeed if we want to.
We choose to disagree, which is fine. and I definitely believe it is a very touchy issue. I dont know where you are coming from because I am not black, and you couldnt know where I am coming from because you are not white. So its far to walk away in disagreement. We should probably stop it here before others take it in the wrong way.
You know I have love for you guys...
God Bless.
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ya, I understand where you are coming from and what happened in the past is brutal and unjust. I would never try to compare the two, nor should someone else try to compare what they are going through with what happened then. I just think that people that wanted to succeed did. George Washington Carver, he pushed through in a time where racism was huge. but He made something of himself even in those circumstances. I am a firm believer that regardless of race color or creed we will succeed if we want to.
We choose to disagree, which is fine. and I definitely believe it is a very touchy issue. I dont know where you are coming from because I am not black, and you couldnt know where I am coming from because you are not white. So its far to walk away in disagreement. We should probably stop it here before others take it in the wrong way.
You know I have love for you guys...
God Bless.
I'm not saying that you can't succeed if you are a non-White. That would be a ridiculous statement. I'm simply saying that race CAN be a barrier, where as it may not be for a White, in many fields. I mean, how difficult do you think it would be for a Black/Hispanic to become a president?
See, the day that we can become President, is the day that I think all racial talk should cease. The laws can be changed to get more minorities into certain fields - but ATTITUDES of the MAJORITY would have to change before their could be a non-White president. Not a token president, either. You know - one of the "We'll elect you guys one time, so you can't say their was never a president that was a non-White". See, right now ... Blacks/Hispanics .. don't even see becoming the president as an option - 'cause it such a long shot, you know?
For me, that is standard. When we can have Presidents of ANY ethnicity, then racial equality as been achieved.
This topic should probably be locked - 'cause it may turn into something it shouldn't be.
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I think that racism will always be around. Until the Lord comes - its not going away.
But I have also learned that (Like E-R, sorry freddy) you cannot have opinions or express yourself
about racism without it being personal. For example... Something happens to you or your family & friends or if you hear/see
it over the news etc it becomes personal because you make a personal connection with the violated person's ethnicity.
I think that everyone on this forum has had some form of racial confrontation whether we are black, white, brown, orange, purple, gay, straight etc
and our personal experiences & different levels of tolerance combined with our education & upbringing make up the way we express our opinions of this subject.
I remember back in my high school art class - our white teacher organised a little in-class art competition.
Basically, in the space of one week I had called the winner (asian girl) a "chink" as in "Oh man, the chink won...". Then I beat up a white dude because he called my dad "gay" (I considered his comments racially fuelled). The whole time I thought that my actions were justified.
Then my white art teacher sat me down & said "Fred, you are not a racial failure because you called Michelle a "chink" or that you beat up Duncan... you were wrong because you fuelled yourself with racial indiscretion. Everything you did was your own." I had never thought that I was the one being racial towards myself.
Now, I realise, this is personal as much as it is a collective ethnical issue. So, I try to win all the personal wars. Being correct with God, myself & racially accepting other ethnicities. Because I truly believe that there is no such thing as whites vs everyone else. I believe it's more like Everyone vs Everyone else.
The small things help me tolerate the big things or help me try to work out the big things in a calm & non-anger fuelled manner.
God Bless.
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I think that racism will always be around. Until the Lord comes - its not going away.
But I have also learned that (Like E-R, sorry freddy) you cannot have opinions or express yourself
about racism without it being personal. For example... Something happens to you or your family & friends or if you hear/see
it over the news etc it becomes personal because you make a personal connection with the violated person's ethnicity.
I think that everyone on this forum has had some form of racial confrontation whether we are black, white, brown, orange, purple, gay, straight etc
and our personal experiences & different levels of tolerance combined with our education & upbringing make up the way we express our opinions of this subject.
I remember back in my high school art class - our white teacher organised a little in-class art competition.
Basically, in the space of one week I had called the winner (asian girl) a "chink" as in "Oh man, the chink won...". Then I beat up a white dude because he called my dad "gay" (I considered his comments racially fuelled). The whole time I thought that my actions were justified.
Then my white art teacher sat me down & said "Fred, you are not a racial failure because you called Michelle a "chink" or that you beat up Duncan... you were wrong because you fuelled yourself with racial indiscretion. Everything you did was your own." I had never thought that I was the one being racial towards myself.
Now, I realise, this is personal as much as it is a collective ethnical issue. So, I try to win all the personal wars. Being correct with God, myself & racially accepting other ethnicities. Because I truly believe that there is no such thing as whites vs everyone else. I believe it's more like Everyone vs Everyone else.
The small things help me tolerate the big things or help me try to work out the big things in a calm & non-anger fuelled manner.
God Bless.
Thanks. I appreciated that.
God Bless.
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HOW MANY FRONT PAGES HAVE THEY HAD ON MODERN DRUMMER ????????????????
I THOUGHT SO
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E_R,
In know way shape or form was I thinking or calling you a racist.
I just pointed out facts as we African American are forced to live them in the United Staetes. I also pointed out the fact that we have to rise above and arm ourselves with KNOWLEDGE. The real rules of engagement.
I was born in the poorest and most racist state in the United States. I have always gone to predominatley white schools and I have never failed a standardized test. I was discrimnated against by my own race when we lived in the project for being smart. Heck, I was discrimnated against in the predominatley white schools for being smart. I chose not to go to a black college because I wanted equality. Iwanted the big budget access that white universities had and I wanted to learn to play the "game" that society plays in the United States.
Don't think any of us are coming down on you. We just don't want our struggles/efforts/victories slighted.
I Tell you a short story then I think that we should table this to PM:
My (now)wife(then girlfriend fiance) and I moved to Oklahoma right after I graduated college. She had a job transfer When we got there we went to a real estate office and asked about rental properties... They sat 4 hours making calls to find us a spot. We were like they are really nice. They kepet asking... "why did you come here?" and we explainedthe situation. ONe day a co-worker of my wife drove us on a tour of the area. She said that she would take us to the black area of town but stated (now this is a white lady of German descent) "you don't want to live with them." I almost went Public Enemy on her but I refrained and maintained a professional diimeanor. When we got to the black area i was like she is right! The conditions were horrendous. My wife and I were the most well know AfricanAmericans in 3 counties in less than 2 weeks.
Do you know why because the word spread that we were educated black people. I was the FIRST African American to work for the towns newspaper. This was in 1997. WE was considered an oddity, an educated black man and woman. So learning to play the game and increase your personal value (not material value but personal worth) is very important.
As musicians we have to market ourselves past racial stereotypes and socio-economic boundaries. We have to constantly expand our knowledge and or ears. We have increase our circle of influence past our church and our neighborhoods and our townes. We have to admitt an dacknowledge the fact that sometimes what we see as racism and discrimination is not that but unfortunate truth of not being prepared an dnot presenting ourselves in the best light. We have to show our worth. No one wants to associate with someone of little or no value.
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HOW MANY FRONT PAGES HAVE THEY HAD ON MODERN DRUMMER ????????????????
I THOUGHT SO
Not sure what kind of answer your expecting but an obvious rhetorical answer to that would be...
...How many front pages does a magazine have?
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Sabe that was some deep stuff doc. But it's real!!
Seven,
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For real, tho' ...
Black people - we have it a lot better than we used to. Things could be much better - but progress HAS been made, obviously.
As musicians, we need to take full advantage of all of the opportunities we have now. Now that we have a fair shot at becoming educated - and bettering ourselves, mentally, physically, financially, & musically - why wouldn't we?
Some of us, unknowingly play right into the stereotype of the dim-witted, lazy, Black. Racism may still exist - and yes it may place SOME barriers in your way; but you just make sure that the only thing a racist can ever hold against you, is the color of your skin. You carry yourself in a respectable manner! Educate yourself! Eventually, they will have to accept that we're no more or less than they are. However, it will take more than the efforts of a few of us - or we will be seen, like Sabe and his Wife, as oddities.
A Black brain isn't any less functional than a White mind. Use it! If you choose not to - just know that you're partly responsible for the perception that we are just a race of baby-making, lazy. thugging, uneducated, monkey's!
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i really believe that this whole thing is based from personal experiences and we can only give our opinions on what we have experienced. i am not on anyones side im just saying that E-R makes valid points and i wish there was more of his side because it almost seems like he is being ganged up on although it might not come off that way thats how i felt it.
anyway . . . . . back to the subject.
who do you think is underated.???
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To Sabe Div and Drumzalicious.
Sabe, I know you werent calling me a racist. I wasnt really directing my statement towards you but to everyone else that doesnt really know me.
I definitely know that there is still racism, and contrary to many beliefs, whites go through it too. That was my point. I dont believe that it is just the whites against all other colors. Its not like that anymore. As I stated, I am half white and half hispanic but I was always pushed away from the hispanic community in a pretty hateful manner. BUT....the whole point, that never kept me away from anything. I never let that hold me back. There was a job I really wanted with a nice Firm, I got turned down because I wasnt fluent in Spanish and I LIVE IN AMERICA. So, I went and got a job at a better firm. I didnt let that roadblock get in my way. In my area, there is a thing called Hispano Chamber of Commerce where just Hispanic people rally, if the whites had a club called the white chamber of commerce or anything of the sort, we would quickly be called racist and it wouldnt be allowed, but yet other colors are allowed to draw a line and say I am proud to be a member of this ethnic group.
Sabe I respect what you said and I agree 100%. There is a bad image of people that is unfortunately the majority in every race. You are well educated and you didnt let anything get in front of you. So you dont fit in the category.
Div & Sabe, concerning what Div said. Hey there are Redneck Trailer Trash Racist Honkeys that give White guys like me a really bad name. But I am not that white guy. I do not like to get stereotyped for him. I am also a well educated person, and for someone to say well you got there because you are white is just stupid. I got here because I had a goal, ambition and desire and Faith in God that I would get what I want. and I have to say Amen to what Div said, there is the African American people that are content thugging around and they complain that everyone is racist towards them. Same with the hispanics, theres the Cholo Gangbangers that are always causing trouble, thats not all the Hispanics. but the Idiots in every Race give the rest of us that are trying to make something of ourselves a really bad name.
I guess what triggered the whole thing is this: I do not like hearing people finding an excuse as to why they cant do something. Why put a border or a boundry to what you can accomplish? Why say I want to the best I can be but because of this, I can only get this far. Then whats the point of even trying? That especially disgusts me with Christians. We have a God that according to his word, ANYTHING we ask of in His name, it is Ours. So where is our Faith? I have never taken no for an answer in anything in my life. I have always pushed myself as far as I can. I graduated High School at 16 years old, College at 18 years old. I am the Manager of a staff of professionals that are double my age. Why? because I pushed myself to never take no.
Drumzalicious, thanks for your kind words. I really appreciate that coming from you.
So Sabe and Div, you guys are well educated you have achieved a whole lot. Did racism stop you? it may have got in your way a few times as it does with everyone, but did it hold you back? No. You wouldnt be where you are now if it had.
We should let nothing hold us back. period.
God Bless.
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To Sabe Div and Drumzalicious.
Sabe, I know you werent calling me a racist. I wasnt really directing my statement towards you but to everyone else that doesnt really know me.
I definitely know that there is still racism, and contrary to many beliefs, whites go through it too. That was my point. I dont believe that it is just the whites against all other colors. Its not like that anymore. As I stated, I am half white and half hispanic but I was always pushed away from the hispanic community in a pretty hateful manner. BUT....the whole point, that never kept me away from anything. I never let that hold me back. There was a job I really wanted with a nice Firm, I got turned down because I wasnt fluent in Spanish and I LIVE IN AMERICA. So, I went and got a job at a better firm. I didnt let that roadblock get in my way. In my area, there is a thing called Hispano Chamber of Commerce where just Hispanic people rally, if the whites had a club called the white chamber of commerce or anything of the sort, we would quickly be called racist and it wouldnt be allowed, but yet other colors are allowed to draw a line and say I am proud to be a member of this ethnic group.
Sabe I respect what you said and I agree 100%. There is a bad image of people that is unfortunately the majority in every race. You are well educated and you didnt let anything get in front of you. So you dont fit in the category.
Div & Sabe, concerning what Div said. Hey there are Redneck Trailer Trash Racist Honkeys that give White guys like me a really bad name. But I am not that white guy. I do not like to get stereotyped for him. I am also a well educated person, and for someone to say well you got there because you are white is just stupid. I got here because I had a goal, ambition and desire and Faith in God that I would get what I want. and I have to say Amen to what Div said, there is the African American people that are content thugging around and they complain that everyone is racist towards them. Same with the hispanics, theres the Cholo Gangbangers that are always causing trouble, thats not all the Hispanics. but the Idiots in every Race give the rest of us that are trying to make something of ourselves a really bad name.
I guess what triggered the whole thing is this: I do not like hearing people finding an excuse as to why they cant do something. Why put a border or a boundry to what you can accomplish? Why say I want to the best I can be but because of this, I can only get this far. Then whats the point of even trying? That especially disgusts me with Christians. We have a God that according to his word, ANYTHING we ask of in His name, it is Ours. So where is our Faith? I have never taken no for an answer in anything in my life. I have always pushed myself as far as I can. I graduated High School at 16 years old, College at 18 years old. I am the Manager of a staff of professionals that are double my age. Why? because I pushed myself to never take no.
Drumzalicious, thanks for your kind words. I really appreciate that coming from you.
So Sabe and Div, you guys are well educated you have achieved a whole lot. Did racism stop you? it may have got in your way a few times as it does with everyone, but did it hold you back? No. You wouldnt be where you are now if it had.
We should let nothing hold us back. period.
God Bless.
Hey - ER ...
Everyone faces racism ... however, in a White dominated society - whites have more of an advantage, and less barriers to overcome. I didn't say you have NO barriers - but I know you have less. See, you're not going to get in over me JUST because you're white ... however, I TRULY believe .. if you and I are equally qualified - in THIS society, you'd get the job in most cases. Heck, depending on the employer .. even if you're a little less qualified ......
ER, are you saying that this world isn't dominated by Whites? We all know that people tend to look out for their own. Their is STILL so much racial tension in this country. You only see it when something happens that 'causes the races to choose sides.
1). Who is HollyWood dominated by? Sure, their are major Black actors - but their are waaaaaaaay more white actors/actresses in Hollywood than Blacks. Most of the roles are written for White's. That much is obvious. Let us see a Black/Hispanic James Bond..................
B. Dude, for one day, I would like for all of the day time commercials to have just Black/Hispanic women. Just ONE day! Dude, ever since I was a young boy watching TV ... their were only a FEW commericals using Black/Hispanic/Asian models. Why do they only use White models? Does it make a difference? In a White dominated society, it matters.
2). What if the "Passion of the Christ" featured a Black Jesus - instead of a White one? Their would have been outrage, and WE ALL know it. They say we don't know what Jesus looks like, and his color shouldn't matter. However, if Mel Gibson had flipped his wig, and used a darker Jesus, people would not have been very pleased with that. Their will never be a non-White image of God, in a White dominated Society. If we don't know how he looked - why does he look Caucasian?
3). The JUSTICE system is ran by Whites. In all honesty ... do you believe that if a White man raped a Black woman, it'd be the same outrage .. as if a Black man raped a White woman?? I can TELL you it wouldn't be the case. I've seen it too many times. Think about racial stereotyping when it comes to driving. Man, I've lived this. NO ONE IS SAYING THAT WHITES DON'T GET TICKETS .... however, I've seen Whites say the WORST things to cops, and they were simply told to "Calm down, sir/ma'am." No Black person in their RIGHT MIND, would think to raise their voice at a Cop.
4). How many of our nations Presidents have been Black/Hispanic? Why? Are we less qualified. I'm sure their is some Hispanic out there who could do an infinitely better job than George Bush. Not 'cause he's White. Because he's a flippin' idiot!
Dude, my point is ... we're now allowed to stand in line for opportunities - but in a White dominated society, the attitudes towards minorities keep's us out of them, more often than it would ever keep you out. I hate to say this - but that is just a reality for minorities that cannot be debated. Either it exist's, or we're all deranged. I really wish that Whites could be Black just for ONE day. Just to FEEL how different it is. I'm not gonna say you don't face any racism - I never said that ... but, it's like this ...
Why do you think when a White person makes ANY KIND of sweeping generalizations about Blacks/Hispanics in the media ... it becomes WW3? Yet, a Black/Hispanic can get on TV and say EXACTLY what he wants to say about Whites, and no one really bat's an outbrow.
You wanna know why? It's like David & Goliath. No one feels sorry for the dominant one, or the one in charge(Except for the rape example. Something about interracial sex brings out the beast in people).
In a school yard fight - if their was a kid around 5'6" 135lbs ... fighting a dude 6'3" 230lbs ... and the shorter kid was beating the daylights out of him, would anyone feel sorry for the big guy? No. People would be cheering that guy on! HOWEVER....
If that same big guy started being the crap out of that little guy - everyone would feel sorry for that smaller guy, and people would probably try to help him out.
That's how it is, that's how it always will be. No one feels as much sorrow for the White man, who has every door opened for him - all he needs be is qualified. A Black/Hispanic man, in MOST(not all) , cases ... can be qualified, and still have doors shut in his face. Who would ever know? If their are no rules implemented to keep a certain number of minorities in certain fields/positions ... the employers is given free-reign to hire as he/she pleases. That person, mor ethan likely would be White. If this is so obsurd, then why did we need something like Affirmative Action. Did they create this jsut for the heck of it? Sure, Whites man have lost out on some opportunities ... but, for the longest, it was US who lost out.
I can't budge from this. This is the reality I live everyday. I am not the type to use racism as a crutch ... however I do know, for a White to compare their racial discrimination .. to a Black/Hispanic/Etc ... is ludicrous. It exist's for you ... but nowhere near the same extent. I see it everyday, & everywhere.
This is YOUR race's world, ER - and you ultimately will have more of an ADVANTAGE of it.
E-R, I'd like to ask you. Sabe and I have been saying the same thing. Neither one of us can be labeled a lazy Black. I'm sure you find both of us somewhat intelligent, at least. With that being said - doesn't that give some validity to our points? No one is saying you don't have a point too. I KNOW you do. White face discrimination in certain areas - such as the hip hop industry, for example. However, in MAINSTREAM society - that is dominated by White people, you do not. I repeat - you do NOT.
We've just been given equal rights .. not too many decades ago. Our race had to fight just to get the rights that we have. They weren't given to us. The fact that we didn't have them all before - let's us know that had we not fought for them, things probably would have remained the way they were. Laws have changed ... but attitudes have no. It will be a looooooong while before their will be TRUE equality. Their is no TRUE equality. If anyone tell's me their is true equality - I will personally slap them in a face, with a white glove filled with rocks. Bugs Bunny style.
Dude, I'd like to ask you - if both of us were qualified to run for President - who do you think would win? Seriously. That's my test mark for true change & racial equality. We've had HOW many White presidents in a row, and no one cared. Imagine if their were two BLACK presidents in a row? They'd cry Whites are being kept out of office, because of the color of their skin. Oh, is that so? It doesn't feel so great now, does it? Would that be true, or would they just simply be paranoid? See, that's how it is. When Whites are kept out of things because of the color of their skin, it's alright for them to say that. For us, we're all using it as a Crutch.
Now - you said yourself that you were kept out of things because of your color. Now, just imagine how it would be if some other race dominated the World, other than Whites.
~The End.
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To Sabe Div and Drumzalicious.
Sabe, I know you werent calling me a racist. I wasnt really directing my statement towards you but to everyone else that doesnt really know me.
I definitely know that there is still racism, and contrary to many beliefs, whites go through it too. That was my point. I dont believe that it is just the whites against all other colors. Its not like that anymore. As I stated, I am half white and half hispanic but I was always pushed away from the hispanic community in a pretty hateful manner. BUT....the whole point, that never kept me away from anything. I never let that hold me back. There was a job I really wanted with a nice Firm, I got turned down because I wasnt fluent in Spanish and I LIVE IN AMERICA. So, I went and got a job at a better firm. I didnt let that roadblock get in my way. In my area, there is a thing called Hispano Chamber of Commerce where just Hispanic people rally, if the whites had a club called the white chamber of commerce or anything of the sort, we would quickly be called racist and it wouldnt be allowed, but yet other colors are allowed to draw a line and say I am proud to be a member of this ethnic group.
Sabe I respect what you said and I agree 100%. There is a bad image of people that is unfortunately the majority in every race. You are well educated and you didnt let anything get in front of you. So you dont fit in the category.
Div & Sabe, concerning what Div said. Hey there are Redneck Trailer Trash Racist Honkeys that give White guys like me a really bad name. But I am not that white guy. I do not like to get stereotyped for him. I am also a well educated person, and for someone to say well you got there because you are white is just stupid. I got here because I had a goal, ambition and desire and Faith in God that I would get what I want. and I have to say Amen to what Div said, there is the African American people that are content thugging around and they complain that everyone is racist towards them. Same with the hispanics, theres the Cholo Gangbangers that are always causing trouble, thats not all the Hispanics. but the Idiots in every Race give the rest of us that are trying to make something of ourselves a really bad name.
I guess what triggered the whole thing is this: I do not like hearing people finding an excuse as to why they cant do something. Why put a border or a boundry to what you can accomplish? Why say I want to the best I can be but because of this, I can only get this far. Then whats the point of even trying? That especially disgusts me with Christians. We have a God that according to his word, ANYTHING we ask of in His name, it is Ours. So where is our Faith? I have never taken no for an answer in anything in my life. I have always pushed myself as far as I can. I graduated High School at 16 years old, College at 18 years old. I am the Manager of a staff of professionals that are double my age. Why? because I pushed myself to never take no.
Drumzalicious, thanks for your kind words. I really appreciate that coming from you.
So Sabe and Div, you guys are well educated you have achieved a whole lot. Did racism stop you? it may have got in your way a few times as it does with everyone, but did it hold you back? No. You wouldnt be where you are now if it had.
We should let nothing hold us back. period.
God Bless.
One last thing ... I think the reason why you feel the racial discrimination you face is just as major as what we face - is because, you seem to be the type who don't to just "stick to your kind". I mean, you're on a messageboard we're the majority of the membership is Black/Hispanic. That tell's me something about how you'd socialize in real-life. You have no problems being around people of other races - however, because of that, you may face discrimination from Blacks/Hispanics, because of your skin color.
I wonder if that's it. Relatively speaking - the racism you face, may feel/be just as major as the one we face, because of that fact.
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Div,
Man, just let me say that it just makes me feel good to know that there are still brothers who can express themselves so eloquently. I applaud you!
MaestroDivine for President!!!!!! Who's with me???!!!!!!!!!!!!
Aaawww, forget everybody else. I'll be your campaign manager ;D!!!!!
I do have this question, though. Can anyone tell me why there have been no concessions made toward me (as far as teaching me my native language -- whatever African dialect that may be), but now half of the billboards I see in Houston are written in Spanish to accommodate all of the people who are admittedly here illegally??? Hmmmmmm. . . just wondering.
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Thats kinda where I am coming from. If this is indeed a white man owned world, then why in my country am I forced to speak the language of another? Spanish is all over the place here...and the majority of the illegals are right here in my state. That is why I am exposed to so much bolgona, Cali, AZ, NM and Texas are the border states. So down here, its a different world.
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Thats kinda where I am coming from. If this is indeed a white man owned world, then why in my country am I forced to speak the language of another? Spanish is all over the place here...and the majority of the illegals are right here in my state. That is why I am exposed to so much bolgona, Cali, AZ, NM and Texas are the border states. So down here, its a different world.
ER, this is a White man's world. I doubt any Hispanic believe it's theirs. What you face is not a racial issue - but a issue of qualifications. If I applied for the job - I would have to have the same qualifications. It's because we have so many Hispanic Americans, that we have to have people who can communicate in their language is well. They're not taking over - it's just that their money spends too - and they need people who can speak to them, to take it from them.
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Thats kinda where I am coming from. If this is indeed a white man owned world, then why in my country am I forced to speak the language of another? Spanish is all over the place here...and the majority of the illegals are right here in my state. That is why I am exposed to so much bolgona, Cali, AZ, NM and Texas are the border states. So down here, its a different world.
Now, I do say that we should have them learn the language before they can enter this country. That's how I feel. At the same time - the only reason we have to accomodate Hispanics, specifically - is because of how close Mexico is in proximity to the US. If it was an Asian country, instead of Mexico - we would have to learn their language. Nothing wrong with learning a second laguage - and you're not being discriminated against, just because you have to speak that language, to learn. It's, as I said before, simply a matter of qualifications. A Hispanic American who applied for that job would be turned down if they couldn't speak the language.
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just because you have to speak that language, to learn. = just because you have to speak that language, to work there.
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I definitely wasnt referring to just work. For example, as bald eagle said, just drive down the street more than half the billboards are in spanish, you go to the drive thru of any fast food restaurant and you cant understand what they are saying. and I actually am about 75% fluent in spanish, because as I stated I am half. but in this country I speak english, I agree with what you said, they need to learn BEFORE they get here. but that is not the case....I am suggesting this was a racist issue, just stating another thing that maybe you dont see since you dont live here.
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ER, this is a White man's world. I doubt any Hispanic believe it's theirs. What you face is not a racial issue - but a issue of qualifications. If I applied for the job - I would have to have the same qualifications. It's because we have so many Hispanic Americans, that we have to have people who can communicate in their language is well. They're not taking over - it's just that their money spends too - and they need people who can speak to them, to take it from them.
Once again, I'm in awe. . . MaestroDivine for President!!!!!!!!!! Who's with me????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I definitely wasnt referring to just work. For example, as bald eagle said, just drive down the street more than half the billboards are in spanish, you go to the drive thru of any fast food restaurant and you cant understand what they are saying. and I actually am about 75% fluent in spanish, because as I stated I am half. but in this country I speak english, I agree with what you said, they need to learn BEFORE they get here. but that is not the case....I am suggesting this was a racist issue, just stating another thing that maybe you dont see since you dont live here.
The whole border issue is crazy, man.
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so how bout those braves ? ? ?
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so how bout those braves ? ? ?
Haha!
Right. I don't think it got out of hand, tho'. I've seen arguments about race get VERY ugly. While it is a touchy subject - no one insulted anyone. So, that say's a lot about the people who participated in the discussion/debate.
Now if it had been BBD ................. ;D ;D ;D
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Haha!
Right. I don't think it got out of hand, tho'. I've seen arguments about race get VERY ugly. While it is a touchy subject - no one insulted anyone. So, that say's a lot about the people who participated in the discussion/debate.
Now if it had been BBD ................. ;D ;D ;D
True I am very proud of ourselves, we acted as mature adults. Oh man, that doesnt fit me....lets get back to messing around.
God Bless.
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NOW BACK TO UNDERRATED DRUMMES...smarkland38 is DEFINATELY on point with his choices and i think he'll agree with these
my boy Mike Wiliams some of ya'll are too young (Commissioned) Joey Bruce, Joel Smith, Dana Davis,
Chris Coleman is waayyy underrated
Nisan Stewart that Royster dvd did not do him justice at all he's not a drummer he's a musician
Steve Bibbs does anybody remember him?
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Well support gospel drummer round up magazine and show how much you matter!! www.mygdru.com
We would love to hair from you.
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Brent Easton & Reggie "Wally" Norris & Herschell A.K.A Drummers for YPJ & FVC!!! All of them are a force to be reckond with!!!
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lol..rex not being underated.....but um the only drummer i know thats underated is RODERICK GREEN..he use to play for Y-ADAMS,SHERLY MURDOCK,the WINANS and a couple others...he from texas now dwelling in in tampa fl...
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nate townsley
ladell abrams
eddie heyward